Jeriatric
Thinks out loud
Moral or legal implications
Choose your marketing language wisely.
Call it a 'Fire Sale'.
As in priced to move.
Choose your marketing language wisely.
Call it a 'Fire Sale'.
As in priced to move.
-
There were many reasons for the change of the site software, the biggest was security. The age of the old software also meant no server updates for certain programs. There are many benefits to the new software, one of the biggest is the mobile functionality. Ill fix up some stuff in the coming days, we'll also try to get some of the old addons back or the data imported back into the site like the garage. To create a thread or to reply with a post is basically the same as it was in the prior software. The default style of the site is light colored, but i temporarily added a darker colored style, to change you can find a link at the bottom of the site.
Well it was fun while it lasted but i'm moving on!
- Thread starter 3 Wheel Addict
- Start date
Spyder Tony
New member
My thoughts exactly...
Yes...my only problem with those dumping/selling their '13's for another ryde is that the owner's former problem will be a new owner's current problem. I have seen several Spyders sold due to problems big enough to dissuade the owner from keeping it any longer...but have a hard time believing full disclosure is happening at the time of sale (assuming it is not traded in at a dealer or similar). Who in their right mind would buy a problematic machine with known issues...even if it is at a slightly reduced rate. I have seen ST-L's as cheap as $19K brand new...yet have not seen a used one for sale that cheap. Most are looking for payoff on the remaining balance of the bike they paid $24K or more for. Personally, I could not in good conscience sell a known "bad bike" to a private party knowing the issues I had dealt with. I would think that if it were traded in, a dealership would/could "fix" and resell the Spyder...but then again, if it were able to be fixed, how come it hasn't been thus far (rhetorical question)?. Our '13 ST-L is hot...but not enough for us to dump it. I have a GREAT dealership and BRP support that helped overcome the majority of the heat related issues. Heat is still present, so I will be watching how the new side vents for the '14 ST work out this Summer. If they are proven, I will be purchasing some for my gal's ryde. I am lucky that the purchase of my '08 GS was from a reputable person who told me upfront about any issues he had as an owner. I also had 2 local dealers run the vin for a history on the vehicle. I could've just as easily bought a bike that had severe known issues that weren't disclosed. I do believe in "buyer beware"...but the thought of someone selling an item that they no longer want due to mechanical issues scares me. I applaud you for considering the ramifications of selling your "problem Spyder" to a prospective new owner.
All of the information contained in this post is just my opinion. No more, no less
Yes...my only problem with those dumping/selling their '13's for another ryde is that the owner's former problem will be a new owner's current problem. I have seen several Spyders sold due to problems big enough to dissuade the owner from keeping it any longer...but have a hard time believing full disclosure is happening at the time of sale (assuming it is not traded in at a dealer or similar). Who in their right mind would buy a problematic machine with known issues...even if it is at a slightly reduced rate. I have seen ST-L's as cheap as $19K brand new...yet have not seen a used one for sale that cheap. Most are looking for payoff on the remaining balance of the bike they paid $24K or more for. Personally, I could not in good conscience sell a known "bad bike" to a private party knowing the issues I had dealt with. I would think that if it were traded in, a dealership would/could "fix" and resell the Spyder...but then again, if it were able to be fixed, how come it hasn't been thus far (rhetorical question)?. Our '13 ST-L is hot...but not enough for us to dump it. I have a GREAT dealership and BRP support that helped overcome the majority of the heat related issues. Heat is still present, so I will be watching how the new side vents for the '14 ST work out this Summer. If they are proven, I will be purchasing some for my gal's ryde. I am lucky that the purchase of my '08 GS was from a reputable person who told me upfront about any issues he had as an owner. I also had 2 local dealers run the vin for a history on the vehicle. I could've just as easily bought a bike that had severe known issues that weren't disclosed. I do believe in "buyer beware"...but the thought of someone selling an item that they no longer want due to mechanical issues scares me. I applaud you for considering the ramifications of selling your "problem Spyder" to a prospective new owner.
All of the information contained in this post is just my opinion. No more, no less
Last edited:
MidTNDawg
New member
Honda is doing this?
Are you sure? I know things change and often very quickly, but their chairman said "never".
Are you sure? I know things change and often very quickly, but their chairman said "never".
ARtraveler
R.I.P. Dwayne
Sad to see that issues have caused you to part with the :spyder2:. If I were in your shoes, I would most likely be doing the same thing.
A difficult situation when you are trying to sell of a machine with known issues. As a potential purchaser, I would shy away from that kind of deal--even with a deep discount. Then again, there are those out there, that would also jump on the deal--if the price is right.
One piece of advice I have offered many times to potential buyers is to check with a dealer and get the history of the machine, and to look at SL to see what previous owners have said about their :ani29:
If you are going to deep discount, I also recommend selling off the accessories, and post the bike on SL. You may get results on such a sale.
A difficult situation when you are trying to sell of a machine with known issues. As a potential purchaser, I would shy away from that kind of deal--even with a deep discount. Then again, there are those out there, that would also jump on the deal--if the price is right.
One piece of advice I have offered many times to potential buyers is to check with a dealer and get the history of the machine, and to look at SL to see what previous owners have said about their :ani29:
If you are going to deep discount, I also recommend selling off the accessories, and post the bike on SL. You may get results on such a sale.
flamingobabe
...in the pink (Girls On Spyders)
I understand completely that selling the 2013 might be the best thing....but consider trading it in on another tradition trike...and then you are free of liability.....I could never sell my ST 2013 to an individual.....I know the problems....could not do that to anyone...but trade to a dealer...yelp...that I could do
viperryder
Member
Goldwing trike
Check out the May 2014 issue of Wing World page 42. The first time I saw them I thought they were Spyders. Trike is called R18 Reversed Trike. Will be at Spyderfest 1-3 May 2014.:yes:
Check out the May 2014 issue of Wing World page 42. The first time I saw them I thought they were Spyders. Trike is called R18 Reversed Trike. Will be at Spyderfest 1-3 May 2014.:yes:
Yes...my only problem with those dumping/selling their '13's for another ryde is that the owner's former problem will be a new owner's current problem. I have seen several Spyders sold due to problems big enough to dissuade the owner from keeping it any longer...but have a hard time believing full disclosure is happening at the time of sale (assuming it is not traded in at a dealer or similar). Who in their right mind would buy a problematic machine with known issues...even if it is at a slightly reduced rate. I have seen ST-L's as cheap as $19K brand new...yet have not seen a used one for sale that cheap. Most are looking for payoff on the remaining balance of the bike they paid $24K or more for. Personally, I could not in good conscience sell a known "bad bike" to a private party knowing the issues I had dealt with. I would think that if it were traded in, a dealership would/could "fix" and resell the Spyder...but then again, if it were able to be fixed, how come it hasn't been thus far (rhetorical question)?. Our '13 ST-L is hot...but not enough for us to dump it. I have a GREAT dealership and BRP support that helped overcome the majority of the heat related issues. Heat is still present, so I will be watching how the new side vents for the '14 ST work out this Summer. If they are proven, I will be purchasing some for my gal's ryde. I am lucky that the purchase of my '08 GS was from a reputable person who told me upfront about any issues he had as an owner. I also had 2 local dealers run the vin for a history on the vehicle. I could've just as easily bought a bike that had severe known issues that weren't disclosed. I do believe in "buyer beware"...but the thought of someone selling an item that they no longer want due to mechanical issues scares me. I applaud you for considering the ramifications of selling your "problem Spyder" to a prospective new owner.
All of the information contained in this post is just my opinion. No more, no less
My suggestions will still cost you money but may reduce the pain and perhaps get you a spyder.
Consider: 1) trade in for a 14 and let the dealer deal with your headache. 2) hire an attorney to cause an action to both the dealer and BRP, this may create some leverage to negotiate a better trade in value and/or a better price on a 14. If the price you get on a 14 is low enough perhaps you can turn around and sell it which might reduce you loss.
I don't know how upside down you will be but anything that will reduce the gap will help.
Looking at all the issues that have plagued the 13 since it was introduced I don't know why all the 13 owners have not come together for a class action suit, I have to believe an atty would take it on a contingency.
Oldmanzues
New member
I did not go check, but I blieve it is a Vendor built, Not Honda factory.
One huge problem is, it appear to modified/convesion on a F6B, most and I think all of them do not have a reverse system. The reverse system on a Wing trike is not the samde system on a Spyder.
Oldmanzues
SteveMac
MOgang Member & Monster Member,
Correct with regard to it being a kit. But the R18 kit can be out on both the F6B (no reverse) but also fits the GL1800 (does have reverse).
TricWing was the only U.S. Based installer that I was aware of, and I am pretty confident they have no intention of being at Spyderfest with the R18 kits.
HOWEVER, Reggy will be at Spyderfest doing TricLED installs for Spyders!! :yes:
I doubt that you will ever see a"Y factor" offering from Mother Honda. Ever.
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Bob Denman
New member
Steve,
Why not? :dontknow:
is it because they might not think that the return would justify the expense?
Why not? :dontknow:
is it because they might not think that the return would justify the expense?
IntoTheWind
New member
All Spyders have had issues since the very first run of production, my own 2012 RT Limited has had a few issues, however I was fortunate to have a dealer who cares about customer satisfaction after the sale verses BRP. I truly believe the dealer network is the key no matter what company one deals with. I understand your frustration with whats happened to you, suggestion a different dealer even if it was as far as one hundred miles to get too who could deliver product satisfaction might me a move instead of just calling it quits with your 2013 Spyder. What ever your final decision and direction you take I wish you happiness in the future, remember you have a family network who cares.
SNOOPY
Active member
I thought about something funny to say...but it didn't work.
I thought about saying something intelligent, but couldn't think of anything...
So I'll just have to say that I've enjoyed your posts. I understand your frustration as a 2013 owner.
I'll miss your input and hope you find something fun and worry free.
.
I thought about saying something intelligent, but couldn't think of anything...
So I'll just have to say that I've enjoyed your posts. I understand your frustration as a 2013 owner.
I'll miss your input and hope you find something fun and worry free.
.
PMK
Active member
I realize we do not own a 13, so the fumes, drips, and heat issues are not yet and hopefully will not be a problem.
On the other end though, it is crap to have no support.
Overall though, if you were closer, I would have liked to help you and the others with solving the problem.
Overall, from what I have been reading, and BRP should step up, the fumes, drips, and heat are a multi faceted problem. Yes, maybe the exhaust should be either redesigned to offer better heat protection. Yes, the fuel cell should be double walled and have a thermal barrier applied in areas around hot spots. Yes the evap can, may or may not need relocation.
There may not be one easy fix for all of this, but in the end, there is no reason it can't be addressed properly. If machines are known to vent fuel, and even rip wet fuel, the EPA will freak out here in the US. With known reports of machines catching fire, whatever the cause, leaking fuel would surely be brought forward in any lawsuit, injury or death.
Stepping away may prove wise for piece of mind, though I have to wonder, behind closed doors, what is BRP planning, if anything.
I doubt this will be a quick fix, and maybe is just on a few of the machines sold vs the entire fleet. Possibly it has something to do with open road riding vs slower light to light riding.
I wish I could help. I hope BRP steps up for you and others.
Ultimately though, boiling gasoline is not cool no matter what vehicle.
PK
On the other end though, it is crap to have no support.
Overall though, if you were closer, I would have liked to help you and the others with solving the problem.
Overall, from what I have been reading, and BRP should step up, the fumes, drips, and heat are a multi faceted problem. Yes, maybe the exhaust should be either redesigned to offer better heat protection. Yes, the fuel cell should be double walled and have a thermal barrier applied in areas around hot spots. Yes the evap can, may or may not need relocation.
There may not be one easy fix for all of this, but in the end, there is no reason it can't be addressed properly. If machines are known to vent fuel, and even rip wet fuel, the EPA will freak out here in the US. With known reports of machines catching fire, whatever the cause, leaking fuel would surely be brought forward in any lawsuit, injury or death.
Stepping away may prove wise for piece of mind, though I have to wonder, behind closed doors, what is BRP planning, if anything.
I doubt this will be a quick fix, and maybe is just on a few of the machines sold vs the entire fleet. Possibly it has something to do with open road riding vs slower light to light riding.
I wish I could help. I hope BRP steps up for you and others.
Ultimately though, boiling gasoline is not cool no matter what vehicle.
PK
PMK
Active member
Again, we don't own a 2013, I have read some but not all of the issues and some of the suggestions to solve the issues.
One thing that came to mind regarding the heat in general, and I am likely way late to the party is the actual coolant. I have seen where the vehicle is serviced with a mix of antifreeze and water per the antifreeze bottle spec. Typically 70% antifreeze and 30% water. This may work ok in a car, but on machines with performance engines and small raiators they will run hot. If possible, run a 30% antifreeze and 70% Distilled Water mix. This will bring down temps. Also the addition of simple Redline Water Wetter helps also if added to the mix.
Not saying this is a cure all, but one of my previous dirt bikes, a Yamaha YZ426f was spewing coolant as delivered from the dealer / manufacturer. I initially considered the coolant overfilled and let it dump the excess. Nope, it just continued to puke. Simply draining and refilling with the above 30% antifreeze/70% Distilled Water/ recommended amount of Water Wetter totally subsided the problem.
Dirt bikes are known to heat the fuel. The radiators sit in front of the plastic fuel tank. As has been done here, some people are lining the hot spots with the foil backed insulation. Yes this does help, more so on a moving machine than one that will heat soak over time. Out of curiosity, has anyone ever accomplished insulating the entire fuel tank instead of just the hot spots? Granted the heat soaking may still happen with time, but the fuel temp may remain more stable and lessen issues except in the severe stop and go traffic.
I have read where people have installed fans, hoping to pull out the heat from the higher locations. Rather than pull the heat away, have any of those people tried to blow cool air into the hot compartment. Obviously a heat exit needs to exist, but possibly forcing cool air into hot areas could prove a benefit. Typically we draw heat away, but in simple terms, if it were a hot day, would you prefer a fan blowing on you or trying to pull air across you. Bad example but an idea.
In regards to wrapping exhaust pipes. I have dealt with this on high performance kit airplanes. Years ago, one of the aircraft I worked on, was running bare stainless steel exhaust. No mufflers or anything. 6 individual straight pipes. The entire length except for the last few inches was inside the cowling. The added heat was being carried into fuel components, intake pipes and overall decreasing HP. It was decided to wrap the exhaust with Thermo Tec tape. This did make a noticeable difference as some have found out. While better than bare stainless, there was still heat coming from the exhaust after wrapping. We ran the wrap for a few years, and as it began to fail, I researched other options. What I found was Jet Hot coatings offered a product that coated the pipes. Jet Hot would prep the exhaust pipes by grit blasting both the pipes exterior and interior. After prep, the pipes were coated both inside and outside. This process proved durable and better looking than the thermo tec tape wrap. It also ran cooler and after engine shutdown, the pipes were cool to the touch very quickly.
Just some ideas for those frustrated with some of the heat and fumes. Not saying these wil work or not, and maybe if I read more older posts possibly this has all been tried before.
PK
One thing that came to mind regarding the heat in general, and I am likely way late to the party is the actual coolant. I have seen where the vehicle is serviced with a mix of antifreeze and water per the antifreeze bottle spec. Typically 70% antifreeze and 30% water. This may work ok in a car, but on machines with performance engines and small raiators they will run hot. If possible, run a 30% antifreeze and 70% Distilled Water mix. This will bring down temps. Also the addition of simple Redline Water Wetter helps also if added to the mix.
Not saying this is a cure all, but one of my previous dirt bikes, a Yamaha YZ426f was spewing coolant as delivered from the dealer / manufacturer. I initially considered the coolant overfilled and let it dump the excess. Nope, it just continued to puke. Simply draining and refilling with the above 30% antifreeze/70% Distilled Water/ recommended amount of Water Wetter totally subsided the problem.
Dirt bikes are known to heat the fuel. The radiators sit in front of the plastic fuel tank. As has been done here, some people are lining the hot spots with the foil backed insulation. Yes this does help, more so on a moving machine than one that will heat soak over time. Out of curiosity, has anyone ever accomplished insulating the entire fuel tank instead of just the hot spots? Granted the heat soaking may still happen with time, but the fuel temp may remain more stable and lessen issues except in the severe stop and go traffic.
I have read where people have installed fans, hoping to pull out the heat from the higher locations. Rather than pull the heat away, have any of those people tried to blow cool air into the hot compartment. Obviously a heat exit needs to exist, but possibly forcing cool air into hot areas could prove a benefit. Typically we draw heat away, but in simple terms, if it were a hot day, would you prefer a fan blowing on you or trying to pull air across you. Bad example but an idea.
In regards to wrapping exhaust pipes. I have dealt with this on high performance kit airplanes. Years ago, one of the aircraft I worked on, was running bare stainless steel exhaust. No mufflers or anything. 6 individual straight pipes. The entire length except for the last few inches was inside the cowling. The added heat was being carried into fuel components, intake pipes and overall decreasing HP. It was decided to wrap the exhaust with Thermo Tec tape. This did make a noticeable difference as some have found out. While better than bare stainless, there was still heat coming from the exhaust after wrapping. We ran the wrap for a few years, and as it began to fail, I researched other options. What I found was Jet Hot coatings offered a product that coated the pipes. Jet Hot would prep the exhaust pipes by grit blasting both the pipes exterior and interior. After prep, the pipes were coated both inside and outside. This process proved durable and better looking than the thermo tec tape wrap. It also ran cooler and after engine shutdown, the pipes were cool to the touch very quickly.
Just some ideas for those frustrated with some of the heat and fumes. Not saying these wil work or not, and maybe if I read more older posts possibly this has all been tried before.
PK
flaggerphil
New member
It's too bad that it's come to this, but you have to do what you have to do. I've been lucky that I've had good dealer support and it's made all the difference in the world.
Hope things work out for you!
Hope things work out for you!
IdahoMtnSpyder
Active member
The ad in WingWorld was by Gene's Gallery in Springfield. They've been installing GW mods and trike kits for years. They may be at Spyderfest since it would same as local for them.
Remember back in the '60s, I think it was, when Honda, Kawasaki, and others were selling three wheel ATVs? There was a huge class action lawsuit against them because the 3 wheel ATVs were unstable, and people, especially kids, were getting killed on them. It's my understanding that as part of the settlement Honda and the others agreed to never again produce and sell a 3 wheel vehicle. That's why you'll never see a 3 wheel from Honda, and probably Kawasaki and Yamaha. Harley and Can Am were never part of the 3 wheel ATV debacle and thus are free to produce the 3 wheelers we have from them today.
For those who don't know, the reverse on the Goldwing uses the starter motor to move the bike backwards. I'm sure it's not as robust as the Can Am transmission mechanical reverse is, but it works and works well.
IdahoMtnSpyder
Active member
Then there is this: http://www.tiltingmotorworks.com/
Considering the last dated update on his site is Sept 2012 I wonder if he's actually in production. No prominent mention about Goldwing conversions as there was at one time, just Harley's. One of the reasons I got the Spyder was they exist, and his conversions don't, even though I really wanted to consider one for my '05 'wing.
Considering the last dated update on his site is Sept 2012 I wonder if he's actually in production. No prominent mention about Goldwing conversions as there was at one time, just Harley's. One of the reasons I got the Spyder was they exist, and his conversions don't, even though I really wanted to consider one for my '05 'wing.
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