Standalone GPS necessary?

[MLTDWN]

Just bought a new 2018 RT Limited yesterday after 30 years of two wheelers. Being delivered next week. I’ve seen some videos about the BRP connect. Before I sell my Garmin Zumo 660, is there any reason why someone would need or want a standalone GPS unit to attach to a Spyder with BRP Connect? Thanks very much.

 

[Thopper]

The Genius works well in my opinion but "old school peeps" like the Garmin. I am 66 but have an advantage by having many young tech savvy people in my life.

 

[h0gr1der]

I'm the old school guy they're talking about. My smart phone isn't waterproof, my Zumo is. I've never met a rider that has never been in a dry state their whole lives. I'm still not convinced that smart phones can get updates to location without network connectivity, some folks say they have actual GPS receivers in them, I'm not sure. The A-GPS bothers me. Make sure it has actual GPS, as the assisted GPS may have problems without network connectivity.

Specs on my phone for GPS;
COMMS WLAN Wi-Fi 802.11 a/b/g/n, dual-band, Wi-Fi Direct, hotspot
Bluetooth 4.2, A2DP, LE, EDR, aptX
GPS Yes, with A-GPS, GLONASS
NFC Yes (market dependent)
Radio FM radio
USB microUSB 2.0, USB Host

A-GPS
https://www.diffen.com/difference/A-GPS_vs_GPS

GLONASS
https://beebom.com/what-is-glonass-and-how-it-is-different-from-gps/

 

[Haze]

I'm riding in a lot of areas that don't have reliable cell phone access, Nevada.
A dedicated GPS gives me a feeling of security that I just don't have with the cell phone.
A-GPS looks good but I still lilke my dedicated Garmin 396. Lots of additional functions
when paired with my XMRadio and Android cell phone.
Just call me old school.

 

[billybovine]

My last Spyder had the Zumo 660 that came with when it was new. When I traded it off GPS went with it.

So I got a 2018 F3L with the new dash. If you use the BRP Connect app on your phone. The point is mute whether it is waterproof or not. It is in a weatherproof compartment. If that works for you great. Give that a try first.

I did not like the selection of apps available for BRP connect. I did not like my phone tucked away were I could not get to easily. When using the BRP Connect app. The phone screen is locked. So apps that I want to use, like for example garage door opener app. I can't get to. So I mounted my phone to the handlebars and provided it with a power cable to keep up the charge. Run a gps app on the phone directly and use it's screen. My phone is waterproof. So it does matter if it gets rained on.

Whether your phones needs data to operate a GPS app depends on the app. For example Google maps, if you choose data only on WiFi and preload the map of where you are going to. No cell data need. Also apps like genius maps download the map for north america. No cell data needed. But Waze gps app must have cell data or it will not work.

Many phones have A-GPS and Glonass. Cell data is needed for the A (Assisted) function to work. That's a good thing if you are in a parking garage or between skyscrapers. The gps functions will likely still work where as a stand alone gps will fail. Out in the open country assisted does absolutely nothing. But your modern phone will perform as a well as a standalone gps. Using both the American gps satellites and the Russian Glonass satellites. Because the chipset is the same or similar in the phone as a gps.

So it's up to you. Using a modern smartphone as a gps will work very well. But if it makes you happy to have a dedicated gps. Keep your 660.

PS It is an often repeated myth that smartphones need cell data for the gps to work. So I repeat modern smartphones do not need cell data to work as a gps. This may have been true for old antique cell phones but not now. If you wish to give it a try. Put the phone in airplane mode. That cuts off the connection to the cell towers, wifi and bluetooth. The gps chips will still work and the phone will function as a gps just fine with the correct gps app.

 

[MLTDWN]

These are great points guys. Thanks so much. I will hang on to it and attach it. As a semi-computer dinosaur and old school guy (68 years old and I still like paper maps), I wouldn’t doubt the I’ll find using the BRP Connect effectively will take me some time and using all of its features will likely never happen. ��

 

[MLTDWN]

Those question marks at the end were supposed to be �� ��. See what I mean...

 

[MLTDWN]

Wait a minute my smiley faces are still question marks. Well never mind, you get it.

 

[h0gr1der]

Snip

Run a gps app on the phone directly and use it's screen. My phone is waterproof. So it does matter if it gets rained on.

Whether your phones needs data to operate a GPS app depends on the app. For example Google maps, if you choose data only on WiFi and preload the map of where you are going to. No cell data need. Also apps like genius maps download the map for north america. No cell data needed. But Waze gps app must have cell data or it will not work.

Many phones have A-GPS and Glonass. Cell data is needed for the A (Assisted) function to work. That's a good thing if you are in a parking garage or between skyscrapers. The gps functions will likely still work where as a stand alone gps will fail. Out in the open country assisted does absolutely nothing. But your modern phone will perform as a well as a standalone gps. Using both the American gps satellites and the Russian Glonass satellites. Because the chipset is the same or similar in the phone as a gps.

Snip

PS It is an often repeated myth that smartphones need cell data for the gps to work. So I repeat modern smartphones do not need cell data to work as a gps. This may have been true for old antique cell phones but not now. If you wish to give it a try. Put the phone in airplane mode. That cuts off the connection to the cell towers, wifi and bluetooth. The gps chips will still work and the phone will function as a gps just fine with the correct gps app.

:2thumbs: Mr. Billybovine sounds like he has the actual scoop. I wasn't sure, but figured if my A-GPS couldn't get it done without network, the surely the Russians meddling in the election.... Errr, wrong topic. I meant Russian GPS would get it done. Now, if only my phone was waterproof. I spent less on my new GPS 595LM than a new phone would cost.

 

[SuperG]

Heh...

I'm not of the "old school" exactly as I'm a 57 yo former software engineer, and so new tech is an everyday thing for me. BUT... there's something amusing about considering standalone GPS units as "old school"... It wasn't all that long ago, maybe 20 years or so since they became available.

Smartphones have the advantage that they can support more features than the canned apps in the standalone units, but with extra features come complexity. That's the price. Sometimes, for some people, the extra features just aren't worth burning up more neurons.

Me? I'm happy with Genius maps - I really like the integration with the Spyder's dash. Since I can answer the phone with my bluetooth helmet, it's all I need. I'm not gonna be doing anything with the phone while I'm traveling, so I don't need to see the phone's screen.

 

[Cruzr Joe]

I have a 2018 F3-Limited and i use a stand alone Garmin 660LM GPS that is bluetoothed to my helmet for several reasons
1- BRP connect is not always reliable
2- Cell phone GPS is not always reliable
3- Cell phone can be used for other things on my ride
4- GPS is waterproof and reliable without plastic cases
5- i also have music on my GPS drive that can come across my Bluetooth to my helmet

Cruzr Joe

 

[Jim&Melissa]

I have a 2018 RT. I use the Genius Maps that I purchased for my phone, it's ok. You can run your phone in airplane mode for this app. It converts the phone into a standalone GPS device. My biggest problem is, when I plug in my phone in the frunk of my bike and plug it in, the charge off the bike is't enough to keep the phone charged. You have to turn on your location on your phone, and my LG just can't keep up using the Genius Maps. My phone will last for about 2 hrs max, and i get a message on my phone saying, phone is overheated and is going to shut down. My phone gets very hot to the touch. So that being said, I think I will purchase the TOMTOM Rider 550 and mount it to my bike.

I am open to some suggestions on what i can do, to improve my current situation.

Blessing

 

[Cruzr Joe]

I have a 2018 RT. I use the Genius Maps that I purchased for my phone, it's ok. You can run your phone in airplane mode for this app. It converts the phone into a standalone GPS device. My biggest problem is, when I plug in my phone in the frunk of my bike and plug it in, the charge off the bike is't enough to keep the phone charged. You have to turn on your location on your phone, and my LG just can't keep up using the Genius Maps. My phone will last for about 2 hrs max, and i get a message on my phone saying, phone is overheated and is going to shut down. My phone gets very hot to the touch. So that being said, I think I will purchase the TOMTOM Rider 550 and mount it to my bike.

I am open to some suggestions on what i can do, to improve my current situation.

Blessing

One suggestion for the heat is mount your phone on handle bars and just use a cable extension

Check to make sure that your USB is plugged in and working properly, should be able to power your phone with no problems (some USB connectors were not connected at the factory)

Cruzr Joe

 

[Jim&Melissa]

It works great with the BRP Connect thru the bike, the bike just doesn't keep up with the charge to keep it charged. How would you run a cable extension from the front trunk to the handle bars?

 

[Thopper]

Sounds tome your LG phone battery is defective. The battery should not get that hot. My iphone seems to be 100% charged after every use. (In the frunk).

 

[Cruzr Joe]

Just add an extension USB cord

 

[1iHooligan]

Just tried in airplane mode on my iphone XR. Says it is offline and can't do it. If you know of a way to make it work, please let me know.

 

[Bfromla]

These are great points guys. Thanks so much. I will hang on to it and attach it. As a semi-computer dinosaur and old school guy (68 years old and I still like paper maps), I wouldn’t doubt the I’ll find using the BRP Connect effectively will take me some time and using all of its features will likely never happen. ��

nothing wrong with old school
Gotta still have the skills when the electronic toys are useless, or dead battery:firstplace:
With that however multiple devices can be handy, stand alone GPS that can swap from vehicle to vehicle (bike 2bike) with same saved favorites:thumbup: so I can go back there on my other bike, as well as not all GPS are as operation friendly or accurate it seems. I also like using stand alone GPS for extended parking or hiking ventures where I may get distracted & turned around when visiting the larger events or just hiking a scenic area with no trails. opcorn: one case particular at my first Spyderfest '15 one of locations on passport poker run was Hanger kafe at an airport out in the sticks. Address was correct GPS location for that address was not. My phone offerd satellite view, my GPS did not I located the airport on the phone & used its vocial cues combined with digital map view on GPS to get there, glad I did.
anyone else remember that fun?

 

[Flamewinger]

The minimum iPhone requirement is the 6. As of the 7, Apple made all iPhone waterproof. All smartphones since they came with GPS have three antennas, Cell, WiFi and GPS which means if you're not in cell service the GPS will still work. Kinda why BRP selected Genius and Sygic because the app uses downloaded map data. I like Sygic because I can see it and the info much better than Genius. Since the last 2-3 dash updates, it has worked way better and the latest update is the best. I routed a lightning cable from the front cargo to the dash for easy access to the phone. Genius still has problem with voicing the correct directions. DR ST AVE are pronounced Doctor EssT Aive. Too funny. I would not use a standalone GPS and it's a waste of $$$ and very slow. Sygic is the cheapest and sometime is on sale 50% off.

The 3 GPS apps in the dash Sygic - Rever - Genius Maps

 

[billybovine]

What gps app are you using? You need to use a gps app that has offline maps. I am not certain about a Iphone. But in android for example. Google maps work if you download the map data first. Genus maps or Sygic should work because the map is downloaded when you set it up. Waze will not work because it is designed to work only with a data connection.