:agree:Really Fast, Handles Super Well. People that say that, don't [haven't] ride [ridden] real motorcycle's.
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Ducati Competitor???
- Thread starter kmakona
- Start date
:agree:Really Fast, Handles Super Well. People that say that, don't [haven't] ride [ridden] real motorcycle's.
Bob Denman
New member
:hun: Watch them lean over to their sidewalls... :dontknow:
...unless I've mis-interpreted again... :shocked:
A
arntufun
Guest
I don't know if I can agree with you here. If the tire pressure and the shocks are set up right I think the Spyder screams through the corners. I came off a Honda CBR 900rr (crotch rocket) and I think I take corners faster now on the Spyder than with the CBR. Or maybe I'm more confident on the Spyder than I was on the CBR. I can't wait until I get the Evo sway bar for this thing then I will really hit the twisties hot. :thumbup:
Firefly
Active member
Don't know as I've never ridden with you-- but you need to slide your butt into the curve and hang off the side to some degree to hold the inside wheel down....
I can hit most curves at twice the posted speed - - no problem--- many times much more than that. Posted 35 ---- 70 is usually not a problem at all.
Can the Spyder corner as well as a sport bike? NOPE.
This video of the Duc trike is a joke--- I could take those curves 3 times as fast as this rider-- and I'm not that great of a rider. He's going way slow in the turns...... leaning does not automatically = better or faster in turns.
Ridden the Dragon many times-- only guys that it's hard to keep up with are the rockets---- HD bikes no problem.
Spyder isn't 'fast' -- but she's QUICK. Would take HD's off the line or in the twisties with the exception of the V-Rod.
Guess we do need to make a professional video Dan-------
Let's plan it and DO IT. Huligan's can do this..... point of view as well as roadside. Maybe next year on the 209??? No much traffic there and some great spots to show how well Spyder handles....
docdoru
Doru the Destroyer-Spyder Photo Investigator
Bob Denman
New member
:agree: The rider difinitely looked to be struggling... either he was a novice, or (I feel) the trike took effort more to lean over than is practical...
...But it showed some promise!
Give them a chance to work out the suspension geometry a bit more and it might be a winner!That's the answer, more confident, And with most bikes you don't have to add lot of $ junk $ to handle a hard corner.
You're getting Mellow, Especially your last few posts.
?:joke:?
sinkhole
New member
Me like! Easier rear tire changes. :2thumbs:
WackyDan
New member
WackyDan
New member
Depends on the motorcycle. I can out run pretty much anything but a crotch rocket, or a well ridden sport tourer in the twisties.
In a straight line, pretty much anything will out run the Spyder... but what is fun about going straight?
MarkLawson
RT-S PE#0031
I'm curious if the lean is initiated by counter-steer (like a two-wheeler) or by direct steer (like a Spyder)...
BajaRon
Well-known member
I would be surprised if they put a lousy rider on that Ducati to show it off. If the rider is good (which I highly suspect) then it's the bike making him look bad and not the other way around.
My feeling is the design is flawed (that's what proto-types are for). The question is, can it be fixed?
Here is the problem as I see it with a 3 wheeled leaner.
On a motorcycle, lean angle is 100% determined by centrifugal force. Speed and angle of the turn is perfectly balanced by lean angle. There is no mechanical factor here (other than the hard parts that you move to achieve balance between these 2 opposing forces). Lean angle is infinitely adjustable (within 'Not to exceed limits').
With a trike, lean angle is NOT determined by centrifugal force, it is determined by mechanical linkage which simply leans the machine based on the angle of the handlebars.
Handlebars straight ahead, bike sits straight up, turn to lock and bike achieves maximum lean angle. This is very far from being the same thing.
For example, go through a turn at 5 mph with 2 wheels, then go through that same turn at 50 mph. Same lean angle? Not unless you want to end up in the weeds! At every speed your lean angle must change to achieve balance on 2 wheels. And we aren't even talking about variations in rider weight and height yet!
Now, do the same thing with your 3 wheeled leaner. You're stuck with the same lean angle in this turn at both speeds and every speed inbetween. And there-in lies the issues you see this rider having. He’s trying to achieve perfect lean angle and he can’t because he’s mechanically locked into a ‘One Angle Fits All’ system.
I’ll keep my Non-Leaning Spyder, thank you very much. When I want to lean I’ll do it right, on My Suzuki M109R.
My Spyder does what it does best by not leaning (just like my car) and my M109R does what it does best.
I will say that without upgrades to the sway bar and shocks, you are really missing out on the full potential of your Spyder in the twisties. Quantum difference.
My feeling is the design is flawed (that's what proto-types are for). The question is, can it be fixed?
Here is the problem as I see it with a 3 wheeled leaner.
On a motorcycle, lean angle is 100% determined by centrifugal force. Speed and angle of the turn is perfectly balanced by lean angle. There is no mechanical factor here (other than the hard parts that you move to achieve balance between these 2 opposing forces). Lean angle is infinitely adjustable (within 'Not to exceed limits').
With a trike, lean angle is NOT determined by centrifugal force, it is determined by mechanical linkage which simply leans the machine based on the angle of the handlebars.
Handlebars straight ahead, bike sits straight up, turn to lock and bike achieves maximum lean angle. This is very far from being the same thing.
For example, go through a turn at 5 mph with 2 wheels, then go through that same turn at 50 mph. Same lean angle? Not unless you want to end up in the weeds! At every speed your lean angle must change to achieve balance on 2 wheels. And we aren't even talking about variations in rider weight and height yet!
Now, do the same thing with your 3 wheeled leaner. You're stuck with the same lean angle in this turn at both speeds and every speed inbetween. And there-in lies the issues you see this rider having. He’s trying to achieve perfect lean angle and he can’t because he’s mechanically locked into a ‘One Angle Fits All’ system.
I’ll keep my Non-Leaning Spyder, thank you very much. When I want to lean I’ll do it right, on My Suzuki M109R.
My Spyder does what it does best by not leaning (just like my car) and my M109R does what it does best.
I will say that without upgrades to the sway bar and shocks, you are really missing out on the full potential of your Spyder in the twisties. Quantum difference.
Firefly
Active member
:agree:-- What Ron said!
Also---- that thing leans WAY too far IMO...... I would be shocked it the BRP 'leaning spyder' (should they actually bring it to market) leaned anywhere near that far--- I would think 15 degrees would be just enough to 'assist' a bit........but more than that seems problematic.... :dontknow:
Also---- that thing leans WAY too far IMO...... I would be shocked it the BRP 'leaning spyder' (should they actually bring it to market) leaned anywhere near that far--- I would think 15 degrees would be just enough to 'assist' a bit........but more than that seems problematic.... :dontknow:
Bob Denman
New member
I just knew that somebody could put it into words!:clap:
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A
arntufun
Guest
That's the answer, more confident, And with most bikes you don't have to add lot of $ junk $ to handle a hard corner.
You're getting Mellow, Especially your last few posts.
:roflblack::roflblack: Lamont gave me hell the other day for blasting BRP with there downfalls in another thread so I want to make sure I even out the good with the bad !!! :thumbup:
, but wouldn't mind seeing a Spyder made to look like a motorcycle with 3 wheels instead of a snowmobile, Tupperwareless. But I do like snowmobiles too so they could keep making the existing models also and I could have one of each. :clap:
hyea:Let's sing it together; I'm just mad about Saffron, Saffron's mad about me,
[your turn] ...........:roflblack::roflblack:
daveinva
New member
Dagnabbit, I came in here to write what Ron said... too slow!
But yeah, the short version of a long physics-based argument is shown in that video, starting at 0:38.
While I'm certain that a wide-stance leaning reverse trike can be made pretty fun to ride with the proper suspension and (likely) electronics, I don't think that's the answer right there.
That said, I *do* think there's promise with the narrow-stance reverse trike design, ala the MP3 Piaggio. I want a motorcycle version of the MP3 vice scooter-- you'd still have to ride it like a motorcycle vice trike, but you'd have at least a little more stability underneath to deal with those nasty urban environments and road surprises.
As for the other issue, getting the most out of your Spyder: with practice and the right setup, you can take the Spyder through turns *quite* fast. My rules of thumb:
1. Fill up those tires (I ride 18/28, that makes a difference)
2. Get the better swaybar, better shocks, or the better swaybar AND the better shocks.
3. GET OFF YOUR BUTT! Riding the Spyder to the fullest is a physical activity. It's a great workout, yoga of the first order. You want to slide off the seat *into* turns, lean forward towards the mirrors, use your feet to push off the pegs, and use your inner thighs to press against the body.
With practice comes confidence, and with confidence comes the knowledge that you're much likelier to scare *yourself* off the turn than uproot the Spyder, especially if you're hanging off the side drunken-monkey style.
Now, I'd like to add somewhat paradoxically, that I found riding like this to be more useful *in the very beginning* than I'm riding now, with close to my first 2,000 miles in. Meaning, when I first started riding I found it easier to exaggerate my movements and leaning to help take turns at speed. Now that I'm growing comfortable with the limits of my RS, I'm better able to judge the speeds and corners I can take without hanging off the Spyder.
(Alas, every so often I still come into a turn a *wee* bit too hot, and only realize at the last second that I need to hang off even further... hey, I'm *still* new to this! :doorag
.
Anyway, the Spyder isn't a sportbike. But it's definitely more nimble than a cruiser, and competitive with many touring bikes out there. But there's no reason you have to ride it all crazy-like: you can do sleepy sweepers all you want, and the Spyder will enjoy itself.
P.S. I want a Spyder racing series, somewhere, just so I can see how the best Spyder riders maximize this machine. BRP needs to sponsor something to show off what this thing can really do.
But yeah, the short version of a long physics-based argument is shown in that video, starting at 0:38.
While I'm certain that a wide-stance leaning reverse trike can be made pretty fun to ride with the proper suspension and (likely) electronics, I don't think that's the answer right there.
That said, I *do* think there's promise with the narrow-stance reverse trike design, ala the MP3 Piaggio. I want a motorcycle version of the MP3 vice scooter-- you'd still have to ride it like a motorcycle vice trike, but you'd have at least a little more stability underneath to deal with those nasty urban environments and road surprises.
As for the other issue, getting the most out of your Spyder: with practice and the right setup, you can take the Spyder through turns *quite* fast. My rules of thumb:
1. Fill up those tires (I ride 18/28, that makes a difference)
2. Get the better swaybar, better shocks, or the better swaybar AND the better shocks.
3. GET OFF YOUR BUTT! Riding the Spyder to the fullest is a physical activity. It's a great workout, yoga of the first order. You want to slide off the seat *into* turns, lean forward towards the mirrors, use your feet to push off the pegs, and use your inner thighs to press against the body.
With practice comes confidence, and with confidence comes the knowledge that you're much likelier to scare *yourself* off the turn than uproot the Spyder, especially if you're hanging off the side drunken-monkey style.
Now, I'd like to add somewhat paradoxically, that I found riding like this to be more useful *in the very beginning* than I'm riding now, with close to my first 2,000 miles in. Meaning, when I first started riding I found it easier to exaggerate my movements and leaning to help take turns at speed. Now that I'm growing comfortable with the limits of my RS, I'm better able to judge the speeds and corners I can take without hanging off the Spyder.
(Alas, every so often I still come into a turn a *wee* bit too hot, and only realize at the last second that I need to hang off even further... hey, I'm *still* new to this! :doorag
.Anyway, the Spyder isn't a sportbike. But it's definitely more nimble than a cruiser, and competitive with many touring bikes out there. But there's no reason you have to ride it all crazy-like: you can do sleepy sweepers all you want, and the Spyder will enjoy itself.
P.S. I want a Spyder racing series, somewhere, just so I can see how the best Spyder riders maximize this machine. BRP needs to sponsor something to show off what this thing can really do.
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