B.E.S.T. warranty does not cover exploding clutch at 13k miles - 2008 RS - Premier Ed

[Doodah]

It sounds like we're all riding ticking time bombs

So let me get this straight. BRP is claiming that they've designed a clutch that, when it undergoes normal wear and tear, will possibly fail catastrophically and demolish the engine. And that this is a normal, expected occurence that is not covered by their own warranty. Really!!?

Maybe I missed it. Is there something in the user's manual that explains what maintenance the OP should have done to avoid this problem?

 

[bullant12]

So let me get this straight. BRP is claiming that they've designed a clutch that, when it undergoes normal wear and tear, will possibly fail catastrophically and demolish the engine. And that this is a normal, expected occurence that is not covered by their own warranty. Really!!?

:hun: When have they claimed that?!?! This is the first case that we've heard of...:dontknow:

 

[Bob Denman]

I can't believe that you'd actually need a lawyer to get actively involved. :shocked: it might be best to keep them in your hip pocket; just in case! :thumbup:

 

[Doodah]

:hun: When have they claimed that?!?!

You need to reread the original post.

 

[Firefly]

I have spoken with customer service. I called myself after the dealer told me about the slow walking issue. This was after I raised a little hell being 3 months in.
- first time I called, gave them my VIN and they confirmed my name and told me there was no claim on my bike. They gave me a Call-ID number. I promptly began raising hell again with the dealer who pulled his records and provided me a Call-I'D that was several thousand ahead of the one I was given.
- I call BRP again referencing th dealer Call-ID and they were oh, oh yeah. Then they told me they were not covering clutch work or replacing the engine in whole. Voiced my dissatisfaction and asked for this to be escalated.
- received a call from another gentleman a week later and he was rude and pretty much told me I was SOL on the clutch as it is a wear item, end of conversation. I talked to him about my engine and my concerns with piecing it back together and the overall health and the dude actually raised his voice to me and told me that was the best I'm getting out of BRP. Told me the dealer was at fault because they could not diagnose why the clutch exploded.

Dealer is not happy either as they are getting low balled on the rebuild labor.

Consulted with a lawyer yesterday and they are researching it, they say its a slam dunk. I have not heard back from the email I sent to Carlo and I am at my wits end.

Do you know if you were really talking to BRP... or BEST???

They are separate companies......

 

[serf]

Who told you not to buy the BEST? Most have been very happy with BEST, and I believe there's less chance of problems when using the BEST warranty compared to a 3rd party. While Zurich is well known, there are many others out here that used other 3rd party warranties that turned into a nightmare.

At least with BEST, it is endorsed by BRP.. and should push come to shove in court.. that could prove to be important.

What companies have people had major issues with (besides brp). Not trying to hi-jack the thread, but I am looking to extend my warranty by next month and it would be nice to know who to avoid.


Guess Zurich sound reputable, but I'd have to check their pricing compared to BRP (with a sponsor doing 750/3yrs on the best warranty).

 

[Jeriatric]

B.E.S.T.

What companies have people had major issues with (besides brp). Not trying to hi-jack the thread, but I am looking to extend my warranty by next month and it would be nice to know who to avoid.


Guess Zurich sound reputable, but I'd have to check their pricing compared to BRP (with a sponsor doing 750/3yrs on the best warranty).

The B.E.S.T. warranty is as good as they get for the Spyder. IMO.

That said, you may want to pay very close attention to any mods you may make and how BRP feels about such modifications.

 

[bone crusher]

:agree:You nailed it !!!!!!!!!!! My aftermarket warranty does put the customer through all this either. The dealer calls with whats wrong, if it's covered ( I have a detailed list of what is and what isn't covered) they give the dealer the ok and a PO# for payment. It's as simple as that.


I know alot of members on this forum think the the Best Warranty is the only way to go, and that because thats the only warranty company they have heard of from forum members here. Why would someone buy a warranty from a company that is affiliated with BRP is beyond me ?????

Does your warranty have road-side assistance? Also, can you get it once the BEST runs out...meaning, my warranty runs out next year...will your company still offer a warranty (being my bike is still under factor BEST warranty)?

 

[rcturner]

Care to tell us all what the error in the catalog is so we can be aware of the problem???

The one that I was talking to them about was concerning the comfort seat which their catalog lists as standard on the Limited. They said that this was just an error in their catalog and that they had no intention of honoring their catalog error or correcting the catalog.

From their catalog:

COMFORT SEAT
Ultra comfortable with lumbar support. Roomier for driver to improve comfort during long rides. Driver seating area pushed back by 2” (50 mm), thus relaxing the driver’s knees and upper body. Stock Backrest to match Comfort Seat.
Spyder RT 219400343 - Black (Standard on 2012 RT Limited Model) Spyder RT 219400410 - Tan (Standard on 2012 Lava Bronze Metallic RT Limited Model) $599.99

I later found out that this error has been know of at BRP for some them but, they have no concern or feeling of responsibility to correct it.

 

[Firefly]

The one that I was talking to them about was concerning the comfort seat which their catalog lists as standard on the Limited. They said that this was just an error in their catalog and that they had no intention of honoring their catalog error or correcting the catalog.

From their catalog:

COMFORT SEAT
Ultra comfortable with lumbar support. Roomier for driver to improve comfort during long rides. Driver seating area pushed back by 2” (50 mm), thus relaxing the driver’s knees and upper body. Stock Backrest to match Comfort Seat.
Spyder RT 219400343 - Black (Standard on 2012 RT Limited Model) Spyder RT 219400410 - Tan (Standard on 2012 Lava Bronze Metallic RT Limited Model) $599.99

I later found out that this error has been know of at BRP for some them but, they have no concern or feeling of responsibility to correct it.

Well, once a catalog like that is printed and distributed... it would be very expensive to yank them all and reprint them. You'll notice in the fine print on page 2 of the catalog:

Because of its ongoing commitment to product quality and innovation, Bombardier Recreational Products Inc. (BRP) reserves the right, at any time, to discontinue or change specifications, prices, designs, features, models or equipment without incurring any obligations. Some models depicted herein may include optional equipment. Prices are based on Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Prices. Dealers may sell for a different price.

So maybe at one time they were going to include those seats on the RT limited models, or maybe it's simply a mistake... and mistakes happen. I bet if a dealer thought he was going to lose an RT limited sale, he'd probably though a comfort seat in if you really pressed the issue.

 

[Kratos]

So many good stories and bad stories......why does BRP go all out their way to help a customer out and then crawfish on another? Are there any facts we're missing here?....Is BRP possibly blaming the OP for driver error?....Is that the missing fact???

 

[DRTSB]

BEST warranty

You're painting with a really broad brush...... Most owners have not had problems.. and most who have had warranty work have been taken care of. We've had a few stories lately.. and many people only post when something bad happens.

The BEST warranty is in the same price as other aftermarket warranties.. so I would not consider it 'expensive'. Nor do I consider the Spyder itself 'expensive'.

For every one of these bad stories of warranty problems.. there have been plenty where BRP has gone above and beyond in helping owners.

I agree, but lets not forget, there are 2 sides to every story, sometimes 3!

 

[NancysToy]

Well, once a catalog like that is printed and distributed... it would be very expensive to yank them all and reprint them. You'll notice in the fine print on page 2 of the catalog:

Because of its ongoing commitment to product quality and innovation, Bombardier Recreational Products Inc. (BRP) reserves the right, at any time, to discontinue or change specifications, prices, designs, features, models or equipment without incurring any obligations. Some models depicted herein may include optional equipment. Prices are based on Manufacturer’s Suggested Retail Prices. Dealers may sell for a different price.

So maybe at one time they were going to include those seats on the RT limited models, or maybe it's simply a mistake... and mistakes happen. I bet if a dealer thought he was going to lose an RT limited sale, he'd probably though a comfort seat in if you really pressed the issue.

Always read the weasel words!

So many good stories and bad stories......why does BRP go all out their way to help a customer out and then crawfish on another? Are there any facts we're missing here?....Is BRP possibly blaming the OP for driver error?....Is that the missing fact???

:dontknow: In the case of the OP, I don't see tha BRP is doing any such thing...the BRP dealer is. There is a difference.

 

[rcturner]

As an example of my concerns, if BRP were really committed to product improvements and helping the customer not have problems with their products, a fairly simple change in the computer programming would not allow owners to shift at RPMs that could damage the clutches. This is just one example of a problem that seems to have been recurring since Spyders first came out. Apparently it is still alive and well after producing thousands of bikes and insisting that the riders are the problem when clutch failures occur. Also, I have been unable to find any reference to acceptable and unacceptable shifting points in the official Spyder documentation. It must be our responsibility to figure this out by analyzing our expensive failures and trying not to do it again. Although I have not really experienced it, excessive engine heat has apparently been a persistent problem. Many here feel that the after market has a solution but, BRP doesn't seem interested. Loose battery terminals seems to be another issue that comes up often. That should not be very difficult to solve if they wanted to.

By the way, I do like my 2012 RT Limited very much and have found riding it to be a very enjoyable experience. My wife and I are also in complete agreement that many aspects of the Spyder are far superior to our 1800 Goldwings and Harley UC. Comfort is better, wind protection for the passenger is much better and the ride is much better.

My dealer has also stepped up to help me where BRP failed. However, I really do feel that BRP has failed many of us big time. In the long run, this will not be good for us or them.

 

[pro10is]

As an example of my concerns, if BRP were really committed to product improvements and helping the customer not have problems with their products, a fairly simple change in the computer programming would not allow owners to shift at RPMs that could damage the clutches. This is just one example of a problem that seems to have been recurring since Spyders first came out. Apparently it is still alive and well after producing thousands of bikes and insisting that the riders are the problem when clutch failures occur. Also, I have been unable to find any reference to acceptable and unacceptable shifting points in the official Spyder documentation. It must be our responsibility to figure this out by analyzing our expensive failures and trying not to do it again. Although I have not really experienced it, excessive engine heat has apparently been a persistent problem. Many here feel that the after market has a solution but, BRP doesn't seem interested. Loose battery terminals seems to be another issue that comes up often. That should not be very difficult to solve if they wanted to.

By the way, I do like my 2012 RT Limited very much and have found riding it to be a very enjoyable experience. My wife and I are also in complete agreement that many aspects of the Spyder are far superior to our 1800 Goldwings and Harley UC. Comfort is better, wind protection for the passenger is much better and the ride is much better.

My dealer has also stepped up to help me where BRP failed. However, I really do feel that BRP has failed many of us big time. In the long run, this will not be good for us or them.

The issue you raise with the SE5 clutch is very valid. For untold thousands of miles many, if not most of us, were regularly using RPM ranges that we now know can significantly damage the clutch. There was no way to know as the BRP user's manual does not offer any specific guidelines on shifting and the ECU is still not programmed to downshift correctly to avoid this issue. It was fortunate that word of the problem finally "leaked" to this forum, but to this day there is still no official word from BRP nor is there a recall to reprogram the ECU. What is going to happen when all these potentially damaged clutches finally give out? Will BRP step up to the plate or are we going to be told it's our problem?

Why hasn't BRP addressed this issue? I think I know the reason but I'll save it for another thread that specifically addresses the SE5.

 

[jsmiley]

Response from BRP - HORRIBLE!!

Well BRP was watching this thread and reached out to me to get more details a few weeks back. I told Natasha the whole story. I gave her the 3 CALL-ID's i had for customer service, talked to her about my concerns with the repair, the clutch not being covered and she began looking into it. I finally heard back on Tuesday for the final verdict.

- She informed me that more than half the delay was the fault of the dealer, that early June is when they first received the photos of my engine and diagnosed it. Basically she said the dealer was slacking.
- My clutch was not being covered. There was no evidence of any misuse on my part and that is irrelevant. The clutch is in no way covered under warranty regardless of how it broke be it catastrophic explosion like was in my case or wear and tear. Its all the same to BRP. Exploding clutch is aceptable, suck it up Mr. Consumer.
- My bike is still in the shop as several parts have been back ordered and like i said before they are piece parting it back together. She told me when they ordered the partial replacement nothing was on back order which was a complete lie. They didnt even have a complete parts list for the repair to make that determination and several subsequent orders have been made to obtain the complete parts list to make it whole.
- It was 5 months on the 18th of August this bike has been in the shop. BRP is taking no responsibility for the delay, failure to cover the clutch or the half as attempt to rebuild it.
- My spydr is forth one that the dealer has ever had to rebuild like this and they had to ship it to another shop as the shop it was at had never rebuilt one. BRP response, well you have warranty with us so if it breaks again we will cover it, sure like you took care of me this time.

I was offered nothing, but a have a nice day and sorry for your luck. 13k miles and my engine went nuclear. 9 months total in the shop between this and the multiple replacements of my DPS, which almost killed me at one point.

This manufacturer does not care about the consumer, makes crappy products and have lost a customer for life. As soon as i get this piece of junk back i am putting the tires i bought 6 months ago on it and selling it for something else. I cannot afford the risk of another failure as the engine and labor to replace is more money than the bike is worth. I am bitter and would never recommend this manufacturer to anyone for the fact that they are a complete rip off.

I really hope the rest of you have better luck than I with your spyders and i would not wish this on anyone. I guess i am just another statistic and they are perfectly fine with that it seems. I am bitter and feel like i have been taken advantage of. This was not a cheap bike and I could have saved some money, had more reliability and actually got some riding in this season if I had made a better choice in selecting my bike.

BRP are crooks and yes it was BRP that I was speaking to.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

THE SEMI-AUTO ISSUE

Well BRP was watching this thread and reached out to me to get more details a few weeks back. I told Natasha the whole story. I gave her the 3 CALL-ID's i had for customer service, talked to her about my concerns with the repair, the clutch not being covered and she began looking into it. I finally heard back on Tuesday for the final verdict.

- She informed me that more than half the delay was the fault of the dealer, that early June is when they first received the photos of my engine and diagnosed it. Basically she said the dealer was slacking.
- My clutch was not being covered. There was no evidence of any misuse on my part and that is irrelevant. The clutch is in no way covered under warranty regardless of how it broke be it catastrophic explosion like was in my case or wear and tear. Its all the same to BRP. Exploding clutch is aceptable, suck it up Mr. Consumer.
- My bike is still in the shop as several parts have been back ordered and like i said before they are piece parting it back together. She told me when they ordered the partial replacement nothing was on back order which was a complete lie. They didnt even have a complete parts list for the repair to make that determination and several subsequent orders have been made to obtain the complete parts list to make it whole.
- It was 5 months on the 18th of August this bike has been in the shop. BRP is taking no responsibility for the delay, failure to cover the clutch or the half as attempt to rebuild it.
- My spydr is forth one that the dealer has ever had to rebuild like this and they had to ship it to another shop as the shop it was at had never rebuilt one. BRP response, well you have warranty with us so if it breaks again we will cover it, sure like you took care of me this time.

I was offered nothing, but a have a nice day and sorry for your luck. 13k miles and my engine went nuclear. 9 months total in the shop between this and the multiple replacements of my DPS, which almost killed me at one point.

This manufacturer does not care about the consumer, makes crappy products and have lost a customer for life. As soon as i get this piece of junk back i am putting the tires i bought 6 months ago on it and selling it for something else. I cannot afford the risk of another failure as the engine and labor to replace is more money than the bike is worth. I am bitter and would never recommend this manufacturer to anyone for the fact that they are a complete rip off.

I really hope the rest of you have better luck than I with your spyders and i would not wish this on anyone. I guess i am just another statistic and they are perfectly fine with that it seems. I am bitter and feel like i have been taken advantage of. This was not a cheap bike and I could have saved some money, had more reliability and actually got some riding in this season if I had made a better choice in selecting my bike.

BRP are crooks and yes it was BRP that I was speaking to.

I WAS SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING BUYING A USED SE-5, AFTER READING THIS THREAD.....NOT ANY MORE......MIKE

 

[NancysToy]

I am very sorry about how things turned out. I don't completely understand BRP's response. They clearly state that clutch plates and facings are excluded, but the clutch hub would not be harmed by a normal failure of those parts...the clutch would just slip, not explode. The remaining clutch parts should have been covered no matter what, as they are not normal "wear and tear" items. What is done is done, but BRP needs to be a little more careful with their assesments of what is and isn't covered under warranty, IMO. What they are saying doesn't jive with their printed warranty. As far as I'm concerned, part of this should have been covered, with the facings and plates, and part of the labor your responsibility. Their failure to compromise and adhere to their printed warranty has cost them a customer. That is a shame.

 

[Jeriatric]

Defense

While BRP and the dealers side of this story will never be represented by them (highly unlikely). One can clearly see the customer has been put on defense. This is what everyone should consider before doing ANY mods. Being put on defense is not where any of us want to be.

 

[Jeriatric]

I WAS SERIOUSLY CONSIDERING BUYING A USED SE-5, AFTER READING THIS THREAD.....NOT ANY MORE......MIKE

Mike, not sure if you recall but this was not an SE5.