Gasoline question - will Regular harm the Spyder?

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

I think it means the 1330 engine is equipped with a knock sensor to protect the engine from damage by retarding the spark, thereby eliminating the pre-ignition.

In other words, it should be safe to use 97 octane if that's what you want to do, but you may experience a loss of performance.

" 97 octane " ...??????? .....typo ???? ................Mike :thumbup:

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Bill -- while gasoline is a fraction (by weight) of the fuel our engines combust, it is the fraction that we can exercise the most quality and price control over. Because our Rotax engines essentially protect themselves, your choice should be guided by the same methods used for other consumables (eg, lettuce, beer, toilet paper, etc). They are, in no particular order:

1. Trustworthiness of the supplier
2. Price you are willing or able to pay
3. Rate of consumption including vehicle storage conditions (gasoline gets old just like lettuce does) which may call for additives
4. Driving conditions (vehicle gross weight, speed, terrain, temperature/humidity)

Generally #4 is the most concern for octane selection. If you are running your Spyder with heavy loads (2-up, trailer); above posted speeds; repeated hills and mountains; and in high temperatures with low humidity then a higher octane gasoline should be used.

And that's as far as I'm going to walk on this plank.:doorag:

:agree::thumbup::thumbup::thumbup: ... #4.- My best friend , a master mechanic, was asked by me about using reg. or premium gas ..... He tested my 14RT, and said - - use regular , UNLESS you are in the mountains, with long steep up-hills, and are towing a loaded trailer and a passenger that is obese, .... then use premium ......PERIOD ..... good luck .... Mike :thumbup:

 

[VegasDan]

I'm a bottom line type guy.
Premium fuel generally runs about 10 cents a gallon over midgrade and 15 - 20 over the base.

Lets say the Spyder gets 30 miles per gallon.
Over 100,000 miles - you will burn 3333 1/3 gallons of fuel.
Premium will cost you an additional $333 to $666 over that 100k miles. Or for most riders a savings of a whole $25 to $40 a year. So on your $30,000 bike - you decide.
Ill be running premium in mine.

 

[Piratezz]

The Rotax is a very sophisticated machine, but is also designed to drive all over the world, even in places where premium fuels don't even exist, I am all for using premium fuel, but it won't harm the machine, if you use regular fuel.

If you are a spirited driver, you will notice the difference between fuels, but it will show at the top end, of perfomance, so when cruising, use regular, when loading the motor (2up/ hills/ elevation,) a premium fuel is better.

But again, this is all personal preference, I always use premium fuels, for peace of mind, and I am a spirited driver..

 

[PMK]

Always best to follow your manufacturers approved data.

 

[Knizar]

:clap::agree::chat::bdh:opcorn::banghead:

 

[bikerchris1270]

:clap::agree::chat::bdh:opcorn::banghead:

We spend $25000-$30000 on a TOY…….I’ll stick with the best available Tier 1 fuel without Ethanol.
https://www.toptiergas.com/licensed-brands/

 

[Little Blue]

Cost of the Toy

We spend $25000-$30000 on a TOY…….I’ll stick with the best available.

My Tip: Don't buy 'ANY TOY' with a gasoline engine unless you can pay for the Gas/Maintenance.

Have yourself a great time. ........:thumbup:

 

[troop]

The OP has stated the following:

Not other rider's "opinions or preferences" Thank you. He wants mechanics and experts to answer this one.

Let's keep the comments to what the OP wants.

Many chances to get into a flaming gas war here. I am not going to reply to the question.

I just know what I do and it works for me. Been a Spyder owner since they came out (2008), and owned a total of seven. Almost 200,000 Spyder miles. What I do works for me. Have not had a spyder blow up or disintegrate, or need major engine repairs. I am going to keep on doing what I do. PS. I don't follow the manual(a).

Mechanics and experts? Does anyone on this site actually no more than the BRP/Rotax engineers who designed the 1330cc motor? Yes, the manual RECOMMENDS 91 octane fuel. NO WHERE in the manual does it say "minimum 91 octane required". In what world would the legalize folks of BRP state "a minimum of 87 octane" if they thought it would harm the motor? Why would BRP want to pay the cost of motor repairs if caused by 87 octane fuel? I'm sure all this would only apply to a STOCK 1330cc motor. Cat deletes? Aftermarket exhausts or intakes? FI changes? Nope .. All bets would be off with BRP.

 

[spyder01]

Being a fully certified technician for 30 years you develop a certain feel for the engine and whats going on inside of it. My Spyders 1330 engine has told me that its fine with 87 octane out on the highway just cruising. But lower speed more spirited, twisty or mountainous driving on hot days it wants higher octane. I always listen to what its telling me.

 

[SkipH]

Octane?

Being a fully certified technician for 30 years you develop a certain feel for the engine and whats going on inside of it. My Spyders 1330 engine has told me that its fine with 87 octane out on the highway just cruising. But lower speed more spirited, twisty or mountainous driving on hot days it wants higher octane. I always listen to what its telling me.

What happens when you go up in altitude and there is only 85 octane regular?

 

[BertRemington]

Engine health is a partnership

The 1330cc engine control response is retard the spark and adjust the AFR to compensate as best it can. Your response is to drive less aggressively, shift into a lower (higher-revving) gear and monitor the temperature gauge.

 

[KnurledNut]

This is from my Ryker manual, which is a Can-Am product.

I don't believe the Spyder is the same as it has a different motor.

 

[Baron14y]

I'm a bottom line type guy.
Premium fuel generally runs about 10 cents a gallon over midgrade and 15 - 20 over the base.

Lets say the Spyder gets 30 miles per gallon.
Over 100,000 miles - you will burn 3333 1/3 gallons of fuel.
Premium will cost you an additional $333 to $666 over that 100k miles. Or for most riders a savings of a whole $25 to $40 a year. So on your $30,000 bike - you decide.
Ill be running premium in mine.

Around here, it is about $.50 - $.55 more per gallon.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

This is from my Ryker manual, which is a Can-Am product.

I don't believe the Spyder is the same as it has a different motor.

View attachment 194386

Interesting that BRP starts with - REGULAR 87 ..... then says you can use Premium ..... My RT gets 87 only ..... Mike :thumbup:

 

[SportsterDoc]

Interesting that BRP starts with - REGULAR 87 ..... then says you can use Premium ..... My RT gets 87 only ..... Mike :thumbup:

Most likely using higher octane allows for maximum spark advance = longer burn time / more efficiency / more power...using lower octane has no issues with harming engine, as the knock sensor will retard timing, as necessary.

 

[SportsterDoc]

What happens when you go up in altitude and there is only 85 octane regular?

Higher altitude results in less dense air, so less air compressed into the cylinders, corresponding to a lower compression ratio, which requires less octane.
Therefore, not an issue.
May be an issue with 85 in the tank at lower elevation.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

What happens when you go up in altitude and there is only 85 octane regular?

? ? ? .....I don't Think 85 octane is even sold in the US ...... jmho .... Mike :thumbup:

 

[Knizar]

? ? ? .....I don't Think 85 octane is even sold in the US ...... jmho .... Mike :thumbup:

We have E-85 here in Minnesota.

 

[BertRemington]

You'll wonder where the zing went...

Many states with populations at higher altitudes (I can't find an exact number but it seems to be 4,000ft) like Nevada derate their octane on offer by typically 2 points (ie, 87 becomes 85). So 85 is not an issue as SportsterDoc described above.

However the air is less dense so cylinder filling will be less and the Spyder engine control will compensate by injecting less gasoline. The result is, per Ford (and other OEMs) "Gasoline engines lose power by 3-4% per 1,000 ft. elevation. To maintain performance, reduce GVWs and GCWs by 2% percent per 1,000 ft. elevation."

So your throttle opening will be larger to obtain sea level performance and you'll probably want to keep engine RPM around 4K, which is the basis of my guidance above. At very high altitudes (think Pikes Peak in Colorado Springs) your cooling performance will be reduced too, although the Spyder seems to have excellent reserve capacity.

When I took my naturally-aspirated track Mustang to Reno-Fernley, it was sucking wind while the turbo guys flashed on by.

And don't worry about 85 octane when you return to lower altitudes because, as SportsterDoc described above, the Spyder engine control will adapt (again with lower performance because the spark will be retarded). Refill with your preference at your leisure.

Please note all these responses are based on an unmodified engine control with stock exhaust system (Power Commander/Pedal Box don't modify the engine control).