2022 all new ghost model

[Possible]

Seems to me that if you lose traction with one tire, you'll lose traction with both. And I wonder if you could lean far enough to pull that off tire from
contact with the pavement. Pure speculation though, unless you've actually ridden the thing to its limits. I think I'll stick to two wheels for now though.

I was amazed at how cheap, relatively, they are considering the complexity of that front end.

 

[RayBJ]

I had an MP3-500 (leaning scooter reverse trike). It handled exactly like any other leaning 2-wheeled bike. Did a week in the Smokies tearing up the attraction roads. There is no concept of a nanny so you're free to over-drive the s**t out of it in corners. The 2nd front tire adds 50% more traction and makes a world of positive difference on wet/slick/loose surfaces.

 

[Cobwebs]

I had an MP3-500 (leaning scooter reverse trike). It handled exactly like any other leaning 2-wheeled bike. Did a week in the Smokies tearing up the attraction roads. There is no concept of a nanny so you're free to over-drive the s**t out of it in corners. The 2nd front tire adds 50% more traction and makes a world of positive difference on wet/slick/loose surfaces.

Want to have a stab at which would corner quicker, a leaner or fixed ?

 

[Peteoz]

Haven't ridden one myself Pete but interested to get your opinion on how you think it would stack up in the cornering ability v a Spyder. Far as I know the Niken doesn't have a nanny as such but could be wrong. I am aware that if overcooked they can be dropped into the weeds albeit happens at a far more predictable rate than a regular motorcycle.
I can see nanny wars and tyre development becoming major factors if these things get a hold in the market.

Very hard to compare, Cobwebs. The Niken certainly inspired confidence when cornering. I was able to take the same corners faster on the Niken than I can on the F3...... but it is sooooooo subjective. I am not a particularly skilled, fast rider. I was far more confident, and I believe faster, on the Niken than I was on the Victory Vision, and it did handle well, but the Vision was a big beast. I’ll see if I can find a review I saw by a very good Aussie rider who has ridden just about everything, and ridden them fast. He was extremely impressed......plus, he is a straight shooter.

Pete

 

[Peteoz]

Here’s the review.....it’s long, and he’s an Aussie so he is a straight shooter, and his first hand experience is at odds with many of the “guesses” re handling and cornering ability espoused above......believe me, it is well worth the long read :thumbup:

https://www.bikeme.tv/index.php/2018-yamaha-niken-review-the-holy-trinity/

Pete

 

[ThreeWheels]

I heard a rumor that this was the next version of the Spyder

 

[barbarosa]

A quick search resulted in this article.

https://journaltimes.com/news/local...cle_a0029831-dda7-52ec-9d15-034224bc11c6.html

 

[Cobwebs]

Here’s the review.....it’s long, and he’s an Aussie so he is a straight shooter, and his first hand experience is at odds with many of the “guesses” re handling and cornering ability espoused above......believe me, it is well worth the long read :thumbup:

https://www.bikeme.tv/index.php/2018-yamaha-niken-review-the-holy-trinity/

Pete

:roflblack:Thats it I'm in! Just need to yellow up for my trip to the bedroom.Thanks Pete:thumbup:

 

[BajaRon]

Not to be the guy with a pin in a room full of balloons. But, as already mentioned above, there are some big hurdles to get to a leaning Spyder.

1- Cost or Value for the Money. How much is a novelty worth to you? It's going to be expensive. Not only getting it off the showroom floor. But maintenance costs will be higher as well. Not something that marketing is going to push.
2- Car tires don't lean well. Which means you'll have to go to Motorcycle tires. Check out the difference in contact patch! This does not bode well for 'Cornering at twice the speed'.
3- Tire wear is going to increase exponentially. With people already complaining about tire wear. I don't see this as a plus for a leaning Spyder.



4- Look at these Spyder pictures. There isn't enough ground clearance with our WIDE and LOW Spyder platform to lean much before you have hard parts hitting the ground. This means 1 of 3 things have to happen to get this to work.
A. Make the Spyder quite a bit narrower. Not going to happen.
B. Raise the Spyder up quite a bit. This will elevate the center of gravity, greatly reducing stability and the amount of G's it can handle. This will force you to go slower in corners.
C. Restrict lean angle by quite a bit, defeating the purpose for the lean capability in the first place.

I suppose that a combination of these 3 things could bring you to a leaning Spyder. But that's a lot of fundamental, and expensive changes to a platform that is already working very well.

 

[FIRECAT]

Brp ghost project has nothing to do with spyders.

Joel what do you know about the ghost model? Is it the PWC Marine division? It could be that maybe an all electric Sea-Doo?

 

[BajaRon]

And, there are other ways to "Lean your Spyder" if you really want to...

 

[Schreckftw]

" :roflblack::roflblack::roflblack: TWICE THE SPEEDS " .... I don't believe a " tilting " spyder will be able to generate the " G " forces our current models do .... if the front wheels " tilt " they will ONLY work with REAL motorcycle tires .... and they will have far less traction than any Auto tires that are now running with complete Tread contact with the road surface. I don't believe BRP will be able to have Just the spyder body LEAN ..... No I don't have any engineering degree's, just a general understanding of how things work ..... good luck BRP ..... I'm not holding my breath on this ...... Mike :thumbup:

I have to agree. I rode mainly Sport and adventure bikes until I got my Spyder a few months ago. I will say when I got this I rode very aggressive until around 1000 miles. Then I figured out what the Spyder was and started adjusting how I drove it. They are IMO radically different drive styles.

I think a leaning Spyder would appeal to a much different rider then most who own one now.

 

[FIRECAT]

Sorry guys my Intel was a bit off there is a new ghost platform coming but apparently it’s not on the spiders it’s on a new retooled boat and yes I have driven a Yamaha Niken took one for a very nice test ride! it basically feels like a large two wheeler that is much safer and planted better in corners and in breaking and handling then a conventional two wheeler! I was looking at buying it but it feels too much like two wheels and feet still need to come to the groundAnd very expensive here in Canada the thing is about 20,000 when the two wheeler model with same drive line is about 12,000 almost double for third wheel! it actually has become a huge sales flop!

 

[FIRECAT]

Sorry guys looks like the ghost project is a new retooled boat that BRP is working on I see they terminated the Evinrude E tech to stroke they were are probably going to come out with an electric outboard motor and that’s why it’s called the ghost it will be very quiet sorry to stir up the beehive on the three wheeler I also have driven the Niken basically a glorified two wheeler did not feel like a trike whatsoever very planted handled very nice but not extremely confident like a spider basically I felt like I was just on a very tall two wheeler

 

[MONK]

...it did handle well, but the Vision was a big beast.

Pete---I had a 2012 Vision and I could scrape the floorboards. It handled much better once you removed the trunk (which I did on day 1). Damn sexy that way, too.

 

[blacklightning]

I love my spyder. The handling is great and I feel confident on it. I feel like I will always have one in some form or another. But I must say that the looks of the F3 series looks like a lawnmower to me. I like the looks of the 2020 and up RT better than anything that they have had out so far. As for the goldwing 3 wheeled thing, I would definitely give it a ride if I got a chance. But I feel like I would want a more comfortable seat and saddle bags for some light touring. I know that would take away from the cornering capabilities, but that would be fine with me.

 

[Joe T.]

Humm, let's see.

Do you think it will look like this or this??

:dontknow:

Joe T.

 

[Possible]

Well, neither of those will win any beauty contests, that's for sure.

 

[BajaRon]

Sorry guys looks like the ghost project is a new retooled boat that BRP is working on I see they terminated the Evinrude E tech to stroke they were are probably going to come out with an electric outboard motor and that’s why it’s called the ghost it will be very quiet sorry to stir up the beehive on the three wheeler I also have driven the Niken basically a glorified two wheeler did not feel like a trike whatsoever very planted handled very nice but not extremely confident like a spider basically I felt like I was just on a very tall two wheeler

No 'beehive' issue here. A great conversation on a topic that many are interested in.

 

[Cobwebs]

Reinflating the balloon

Not to be the guy with a pin in a room full of balloons. But, as already mentioned above, there are some big hurdles to get to a leaning Spyder.

1- Cost or Value for the Money. How much is a novelty worth to you? It's going to be expensive. Not only getting it off the showroom floor. But maintenance costs will be higher as well. Not something that marketing is going to push.
2- Car tires don't lean well. Which means you'll have to go to Motorcycle tires. Check out the difference in contact patch! This does not bode well for 'Cornering at twice the speed'.
3- Tire wear is going to increase exponentially. With people already complaining about tire wear. I don't see this as a plus for a leaning Spyder.

View attachment 187241 View attachment 187242

4- Look at these Spyder pictures. There isn't enough ground clearance with our WIDE and LOW Spyder platform to lean much before you have hard parts hitting the ground. This means 1 of 3 things have to happen to get this to work.
A. Make the Spyder quite a bit narrower. Not going to happen.
B. Raise the Spyder up quite a bit. This will elevate the center of gravity, greatly reducing stability and the amount of G's it can handle. This will force you to go slower in corners.
C. Restrict lean angle by quite a bit, defeating the purpose for the lean capability in the first place.

I suppose that a combination of these 3 things could bring you to a leaning Spyder. But that's a lot of fundamental, and expensive changes to a platform that is already working very well.

View attachment 187243 View attachment 187244 View attachment 187245 View attachment 187246

Just on the centre of gravity thing Ron, doesn't that improve as the bike is cranked over if designed correctly? Could be the front tilts and the rear is fixed if necessary.
As for the tyres there's 16'' wide motorcycle rubber available if needed for untold amounts of traction.
I don't really see the maintenance issue playing a big part same as the build cost if they follow the Ryker theory of design with less parts.