Apple Car Play download initially failed! NOW Finally available....

[FROGMAN]

raccoon-thank you for your feedback! I will look again at the Operation Manual, I download and printed it so it's easier to read. I did connect using the glove box USB. I did not read that it needs the iPhone connection to run. I will connect again to see the results. Does apple car play need to be connected for the phone system to work correctly or can you make calls running the BRP system? Everything worked before downloading applecart play, phone, music and toggle. Does BRP have a customer service to answer question about applecart play and their 2024 Spyders?

 

[700wolvy]

raccoon-thank you for your feedback! I will look again at the Operation Manual, I download and printed it so it's easier to read. I did connect using the glove box USB. I did not read that it needs the iPhone connection to run. I will connect again to see the results. Does apple car play need to be connected for the phone system to work correctly or can you make calls running the BRP system? Everything worked before downloading applecart play, phone, music and toggle. Does BRP have a customer service to answer question about applecart play and their 2024 Spyders?

Yes. Call 1-888-272-9222 I believe there is an option to speak to someone about ACP. I called but, they said take it to a dealer. Appointment is on 8/16. My problem is no bluetooth after the update. I have to say, they were not helpful but, really nice about it.

 

[racoon]

So I just spent over an hour outside with my Spyder.

At first it said my headset was paired with the Spyder when I turned it on, and it also said my iPhone was paired, too.
And then I plugged the iPhone into the USB port in the glove box using an Apple cable, and my iPhone reported that Spyder was no longer connected via Bluetooth.

And I was able to hear the Spyder radio station through my headset when I drove around the block, so the Spyder was connecting to the headset.
Apple Carplay was showing my route/location on the display, but there were no directions being announced in the headset.

So one of the messages the Spyder gave me while trying to force the Bluetooth to connect was to delete the connection and re-pair the device.
So I deleted both the iPhone and the SENA headset from the Spyder's Bluetooth, and then tried to repair the headset.
Even though my headset indicated it was in pairing mode, the Spyder never "saw" it.

So now nothing is connected via Bluetooth to my Spyder.

I also checked to see if there was an update for my Spyder, and it easily connected to my home WiFi, but reported no updates available.


Maybe I should reconnect the Garmin Zumo XT GPS I bought while waiting for CAN-AM to release Apple Carplay, as it at least worked.



And now I need something cold to drink, as it was hot and humid outside.

 

[jfischer]

I have good news about my '24 RT's ACP.
I was using a Packtalk Bold headset to connect to my Spyder and an iPhone 8+ for ACP.
I had issues using the mic; and with getting Siri to listen to me.
Well, after doing some checking on the internet, ACP doesn't like a head set with BT 4.1
I tested this out by using my JBL 660NC headphones in the driver's head set location.
The unit paired and ACP was in color.
I talked to Siri, and she answered; I placed a phone call and heard the other party.
So I guess I will be replacing my old Packtalk Bold with a head set with BT 5.X

So I just checked and my Cardo Freecom+ is also only Bluetooth 4.1. Where did you find that ACP doesn't like 4.1? I hate this Cardo Freecom headset with a passion so if I knew updating it to a headset with BT 5.x would make ACP work better I'd do it. I've about thrown it on the ground and driven over it a few times I hate it so much.

I also see where there's some dongles that "fakes out" ACP to think there's a BT microphone attached. I'd be fine with that too since for short trips I'd just as soon not even use my headset to be honest I just want music and navigation and I don't care about voice input at all 99% of the time once I am moving.

Most of the BT wireless handset adapters go into cigarette lighter port and I am pretty sure the 2024's don't have that. I did find one that's USB powered with a microphone and speakers for $15. If I can put this in the trunk and pair that to the Spyder to satisfy the microphone requirement, then I don't care if the Spyder connects to my headset or not for the most part. Won't be able to answer calls or answer a text, but if the rest of the ACP ecosystem works then it's worth it for now.

Will also start looking into BT 5.1+ headsets if that truly does solve the majority of the problems I've been having as well.

 

[FROGMAN]

raccoon - I checked with the operating manual and found your feedback. I installed Slingmods GPS mount and mounted my XT2, connected GPS, phone, and Sena. All is functioning as designed. Now I can try and deal with the issue of applecart play. First, what does ACP mean, I'm not very IT knowlegeable.

 

[Peter Aawen]

raccoon - I checked with the operating manual and found your feedback. I installed Slingmods GPS mount and mounted my XT2, connected GPS, phone, and Sena. All is functioning as designed. Now I can try and deal with the issue of applecart play. First, what does ACP mean, I'm not very IT knowlegeable.

ACP = an acronym for Apple CarPlay - it's easier to type.

 

[baxter]

having no promlems with Carpuride Apple Carplay unit.

 

[racoon]

So I deleted both the iPhone and the SENA headset from the Spyder's Bluetooth, and then tried to repair the headset.
Even though my headset indicated it was in pairing mode, the Spyder never "saw" it.

So now nothing is connected via Bluetooth to my Spyder.

Yes, I'm quoting my own post, and it is relevant.

Previously I had decided to sell my Garmin Zumo XT, so I did a "reset" on it, and put everything back in the boxes.

After the frustrations with CarPlay on my Spyder, I had dug the Zumo out of the box and connected it to my computer, started up the Garmin Express application on my computer so I could download any updates to the Garmin Zumo XT.

Then I looked at connecting my iPhone and the Sena headset in my helmet to the Garmin.
Connecting the iPhone is straight forward, since both the iPhone and the Zumo have screens that you can poke at to get them to communicate.

The headset does not have a screen, of course, and just has 2 buttons on the headset microphone.
So I opened the Acrobat copy of the full Users Guide for the Sena 3S Plus headset, and found

Chapter 4 Pairing the Headset with Other Bluetooth Devices

on Page 11.

4.1 Phone Pairing
4.1.1 Initially Pairing the headset (if it was not previously paired with anything)
4.1.2 Pairing When the Headset Is Turned Off (press and hold both buttons until it says "Phone pairing")
4.1.3 Pairing When the Headset Is Turned On (press and hold the + button until it says "Phone pairing")

4.1.2 and 4.1.3 are on the left side of Page 12.

The top of the right side of Page 12 is:

4.2 Second Mobile Phone Pairing

I had ignored that section, as I only have one cell phone, and didn't notice that the first step talks about accessing the "Configuration Menu", which becomes important. I don't remember looking at the rest of Page 12, but the bottom section of the right side of Page 12 is what made me want to bang my head against something hard.

Here's what the bottom right section of Page 12 of the SENA guide says:

4.3 GPS Pairing
1. To enter the configuration menu, press and hold the (+) Button for
10 seconds until you hear a voice prompt, “Configuration menu.”
2. Tap the (+) Button until you hear a voice prompt, “GPS pairing.”
3. Search for Bluetooth devices on the GPS navigation screen. Select Sena 3S PLUS in the list of devices detected.
4. If your Bluetooth device asks for a PIN, enter 0000.

So, you need to get into the Configuration Menu on the Sena headset; then tap the + button until the Sena headset says, "GPS pairing"; then go to the GPS navigation device you are trying to pair with (also known as a Can-Am Spyder RT Sea to Sky); and select Sena 3S Plus from the list of Bluetooth devices.

I haven't actually done the GPS Pairing yet, as I was dealing with some non-motorcycle related tasks around the house.
I am hoping that once I have done the GPS Pairing steps that Apple CarPlay will be able to send the audio commands from my Spyder to my headset.

:::fingers crossed:::

 

[jfischer]

I haven't actually done the GPS Pairing yet, as I was dealing with some non-motorcycle related tasks around the house.
I am hoping that once I have done the GPS Pairing steps that Apple CarPlay will be able to send the audio commands from my Spyder to my headset.

:::fingers crossed:::

My Cardo has 2 BT channels as well, one for phone and one for GPS. I've tried putting phone on Ch 1, and Spyder on Ch 2, and then reversed that to see if it made any difference. It did not for me. Doesn't work worth a hoot no matter which order I pair them up.

I am tempted to get the latest Cardo with BT 5.2, my current one is only 4.1. I just hate to drop $500 on new headsets if they don't work any better than my current ones, although my Freecom 4+ are discontinued and no longer supported either.

 

[racoon]

I am tempted to get the latest Cardo with BT 5.2, my current one is only 4.1.

I haven't paid much attention to the Bluetooth version, even though there have been a few comments about it.
The Users Guide I have for my headset does not mention the version it supports.

But after a bit of searching I found the information on the Sena website.

The 3S Plus Boom headset utilizes Bluetooth® 5.1 to deliver incoming and outgoing audio for music, phone calls, GPS directions, and intercom conversations with a passenger or a riding companion up to 400 meters away.

 

[racoon]

So I went into the Bluetooth settings on my Spyder and deleted the headset, and then plugged my iPhone into the USB cable in the glove box. I left the Spyder display showing the Bluetooth settings.

I then turned on the headset, held down the button until it said, "Configuration menu", and then I pressed the + key repeatedly until it said "GPS Pairing". The Spyder saw the headset almost immediately, so I selected it on the display and told it to connect, and it did.


We've had thunderstorms all day, so I wasn't able to go for a ride. And the forecast is for thunderstorms overnight and through most of the morning, but it's supposed to stop around Noon, so hopefully I can go for a ride and test it tomorrow afternoon.



I am still a little worried about the iPhone connection.
I did pair the iPhone via Bluetooth, but in order to use CarPlay the iPhone has to be connected to the USB cable. But as soon as you plug the cable into the iPhone the Bluetooth connection between the iPhone and the Spyder disconnects.

Yes, I did check, and the Apple CarPlay section of the Operators Guide says that to use CarPlay you must connect a compatible smartphone to the display via USB cable, and also pair a helmet audio system to the display via Bluetooth. I did not find any information about needing to also pair the phone with the Spyder.

As for testing phone calls, the headset is also Bluetooth paired to the iPhone, so I'll test the sound on an outgoing call.

 

[700wolvy]

When bluetooth on my Spyder worked, I got the best results by pairing my phone and headsets to the Spyder.

So I went into the Bluetooth settings on my Spyder and deleted the headset, and then plugged my iPhone into the USB cable in the glove box. I left the Spyder display showing the Bluetooth settings.

I then turned on the headset, held down the button until it said, "Configuration menu", and then I pressed the + key repeatedly until it said "GPS Pairing". The Spyder saw the headset almost immediately, so I selected it on the display and told it to connect, and it did.


We've had thunderstorms all day, so I wasn't able to go for a ride. And the forecast is for thunderstorms overnight and through most of the morning, but it's supposed to stop around Noon, so hopefully I can go for a ride and test it tomorrow afternoon.



I am still a little worried about the iPhone connection.
I did pair the iPhone via Bluetooth, but in order to use CarPlay the iPhone has to be connected to the USB cable. But as soon as you plug the cable into the iPhone the Bluetooth connection between the iPhone and the Spyder disconnects.

Yes, I did check, and the Apple CarPlay section of the Operators Guide says that to use CarPlay you must connect a compatible smartphone to the display via USB cable, and also pair a helmet audio system to the display via Bluetooth. I did not find any information about needing to also pair the phone with the Spyder.

As for testing phone calls, the headset is also Bluetooth paired to the iPhone, so I'll test the sound on an outgoing call.

 

[jcthorne]

Has anyone seen a wireless adaptor that displays Android Auto on an Apple CarPlay system like this? I have been told they exist and keep seeing references to them in the Harley forums that have the same limitation (CP but no AA). If anyone knows of one, please post up. Thanks.

 

[jfischer]

Has anyone seen a wireless adaptor that displays Android Auto on an Apple CarPlay system like this? I have been told they exist and keep seeing references to them in the Harley forums that have the same limitation (CP but no AA). If anyone knows of one, please post up. Thanks.

I have an extra one that I used in my Jeep. Basically they plug into the USB port and then connect to your iPhone wirelessly just like newer head units do. Wireless ACP I think requires that the vehicle provide the GPS signal, which of course we don't have on a Spyder. The wireless box I have I think has an option to grab GPS from your phone which might fake out the head unit on the Spyder. Then there's the microphone issue, but I would think that would work OK as long as you had a headset paired to the bike just as you do now.

I will maybe try it briefly this afternoon to see if it works or not. The only other downside is that it does eat into your battery but if you're on a short trip (like a few hours) it probably is fine. I wouldn't use it for a full-day drive though without having some way to power the phone.


EDIT: I tried my CarLinkIt III and IV units on the Spyder. Neither one would cause the CarPlay icon to light up unfortunately. I did briefly get an error to the effect of "The iOS version you're using is not compatible" or something like that, then nothing. I put my phone back on via direct USB, works fine and no warnings about iOS versions. I was able to update the firmware to a newer version on the IV, but it made no difference.

The CarLinkIt IV is supposed to be able to translate wireless AA into wired ACP also, but since I only have iPhones I can't speak to how well that works. Since the adapter doesn't seem to be recognized by the Spyder anyway it's a moot point for now. I tried flipping the "GPS" option on and off in the CarLinkIt, and tried the "Compatible" mode but nothing seemed to get it to play with the Spyder.

I have used these things in 3 different cars with Wired Carplay and they work pretty seamlessly so not sure what CanAm did to break them but based on my limited testing they do not work.

 

[FROGMAN]

raccoon - are you using ACP or your XT? I'm using my XT2 (iPhone & sena 20s) because ACP is not working. Can you delete ACP?

 

[WRCLVR]

Sena 50S firmware 2.5.1 build-0 uses BT 5.0 according to Sena

 

[racoon]

raccoon - are you using ACP or your XT? I'm using my XT2 (iPhone & sena 20s) because ACP is not working. Can you delete ACP?

Since I got the headset to "GPS" pair to my Spyder, I haven't had a chance to test it, but my Spyder is showing Bluetooth pairing to my iPhone and my headset.
Once I post this I'm going to go for a ride.

And my Garmin Zumo XT is currently back in its box, and of course I hope it stays there. :joke:

Sena 50S firmware 2.5.1 build-0 uses BT 5.0 according to Sena

I was able to confirm on the SENA website that the headset in my helmet uses Bluetooth 5.1.
My headset is a SENA 3S Plus Boom Microphone Kit that I installed in my helmet.

https://store-us.sena.com/products/3s-plus-boom-1

According to the SENA documentation, you can pair two phones with the headset, and one GPS.
The method of pairing to a phone is very different than pairing to a GPS, so originally, I had mistakenly paired my headset to the Spyder as if the Spyder were a phone.
Now that I've paired my headset to the Spyder as if it were a GPS, I'm hoping that fixes the problem.

 

[racoon]

After a nice, hot, humid ride I have good news; not so good news; and a WTF is Can-Am doing moment.

So, equipment details:

2024 Spyder RT Sea to Sky
SENA 3S Plus Boom Microphone Bluetooth headset installed in
HJC C91 Modular helmet
iPhone SE 2nd Gen

Start the Spyder and bring up the Bluetooth connections menu.
iPhone listed, but showing as not connected.
SENA headset listed, but not connected.

Turn on the iPhone but don't plug it into the USB cable.
iPhone connects to Spyder Bluetooth.
Turn on the SENA headset and I see a connection message on the Spyder Bluetooth menu.

Navigate to the main menu and Apple CarPlay icon is not active.
I press on the CarPlay icon and the display shows a message about needing an iPhone connected via USB.
Plug the iPhone into the USB cable in the glove box.
iPhone disconnects from Spyder Bluetooth, but the Apple CarPlay icon is now active.

Bring up CarPlay maps and tell it to navigate to my local grocery store.
Gear up and go for a ride.
The Spyder correctly displays the CarPlay navigation map, and shows that I'm driving on the correct road.

What was interesting, is that the text of the directions ("turn left at stop sign") were also showing up on the iPhone display.
Eventually the iPhone appeared to go to sleep, or at least the screen powered off, and it ignored my attempts to reactive the screen with my gloves.

No directions are being heard in my headset.

Get to the grocery store, pull into the parking and find an out of the way place to park.
I leave the the bike running, and go into the Bluetooth menu disconnect the iPhone and power off my headset.
Both show up as disconnected.

Power on the headset and plug the phone into the USB port in the glove box.
Messages appear on the screen about the headset connecting, and then the iPhone connecting.

And I hear BOTH connection messages in the headset, so the Spyder is having no trouble sending audio to my headset.

So I tap on the CarPlay icon, and tell it to take me home.
Display changes and the map is showing the route to get home.
I follow the directions for the first portion of the route, but then turn off and drive an alternate route.
CarPlay adapts fairly quickly and starts displaying the correct directions for the alternate route.

Still no audio playing in my headset.


Oh, and in an unrelated matter, I also have an Apple Watch that I was wearing during the ride.
Each time the CarPlay screen display showed a new turn the watch vibrated, which is normal because my watch is paired with my iPhone.
I did check when I stopped, and it also showed the direction/turn information on the watch.

So my Spyder was able to send audio messages to the headset in my helmet with the headset and the iPhone connected, but the Spyder did not send the Apple CarPlay directions/messages to my headset.

I suppose I should try it with the Spyder audio output directed to the speakers rather than the headset, and see if CarPlay will play the audio directions through the Spyder's speakers?

 

[FROGMAN]

My issue; no phone sound.

Sena 20s connected, iPhone connected, plug in iPhone. Go to ACP and it opens, go to the phone and call, connects, shows on screen, and then nothing. No ring and no sound. The call goes through, but we hear nothing. We are both talking, and nothing. Any answers?

Question: Can you delete ACP and go back to the standard BRP setup. It worked great, all the toggles worked, music and phone.

 

[racoon]

I don't think you can delete ACP, but if you remove/delete the Bluetooth connection for the phone or headset then it is disabled.

One of the things I did, which I think addresses the issue of the phone sound in the headset, is that I first Bluetooth paired the headset directly to the phone, and then I used the GPS pairing instructions in the User's Guide for the headset to pair to Spyder as if it were a GPS, not a "phone".

I did a quick Google search on "SENA 20S" and found the full SENA 20S Evo User's Guide, and there are sections on pairing two phones, and a section for pairing a separate Bluetooth Stereo Device, and section 5.4.1 GPS Pairing.

I'd try the steps in the 5.4.1 section to pair your headset to your Spyder.



A bit of Googling about 'No sound for CarPlay directions' led me to a video on Youtube about fixing a "no sound" problem in Apple Maps.

I watched it, and checked the settings on my iPhone, and stumbled across one of the settings that might have been causing the problem.
In Apple Maps there is a setting for Spoken Directions that has several settings.

The video recommended changing the Voice Volume from "Normal Volume" to "Louder Volume".

It also suggested turning on the "Directions on Radio", which was off on my iPhone.

We'll see if those changes work.

The video is:

How To Fix No Sound In Apple Maps

https://youtu.be/9k2JygSpHEg?si=YIfPTegrkEOS-Mck