Ryker Issue Alert!

[Freddy]

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/VehicleComplaint/

 

[Easy Rider]

https://www-odi.nhtsa.dot.gov/VehicleComplaint/

Good luck with that one.
They generally don't care about motorcycles.
And they don't REALLY care about other complaints either unless and until they get enough of them that it looks like a serious, widespread and verifiable problem.

Most of the handling "problem" with a 3 wheel vehicle is just inherent in having 3 wheels running in different tracks on the road.
A proper alignment will help.
Proper and balanced tire pressure will help.
Better tires might help......but the tread pattern is important.
Time-in-seat helps a LOT too.
But when one wheel wants to move in a direction that the other two do NOT, that is a problem that "design" can't fix.

 

[ARtraveler]

A word of caution for those involved in the above mechanical issues.

Do NOT threaten BRP with any litigation. They will immediately "let their lawyers" take care of businesss. The result will be...no more direct communication with BRP.

 

[QuasiMotard]

A word of caution for those involved in the above mechanical issues.

Do NOT threaten BRP with any litigation. They will immediately "let their lawyers" take care of businesss. The result will be...no more direct communication with BRP.

Yep, so I've heard.

That posture is to be expected of any large corporation because of the intricacies and liabilities of any communication with the consumer after their intention to litigate has been made. I have tried to keep this as level and open as possible without even discussing the dealer buy-back or other remediation paths. I just want the dealer to fixed their mistakes and certify that the machine is operating "safely". Then I plan to try going down the "BRP Cares" path to get an extension to my warranty... just in case I have any other surprises ahead of me. I typically keep my bikes for 6+ years, so my current 4-year warranty (and my current set of circumstances) lends me to believe that might not be enough.

--
QM

 

[karg]

Hi,

I was going to buy a Ryker, but because of the previous comments, I have decided not to, at least not until they have these issues resolved. If enough of us won't buy, then maybe, just maybe, someone will take care of these issues.
-Thanks

 

[Freddy]

There's a world of difference between threatening litigation and reporting valid vehicle safety issues to the appropriate authority, regardless of dealer diligence.

 

[Freddy]

Hi,

I was going to buy a Ryker, but because of the previous comments, I have decided not to, at least not until they have these issues resolved. If enough of us won't buy, then maybe, just maybe, someone will take care of these issues.
-Thanks

It hasn't stopped BRP from unloading unroadworthy trikes on the general public in the past. This is just another example. :banghead:

 

[007james]

I really believe BRP will eventually take care of this problem. Its too serious to keep ignoring, considering the 20 Units per Dealer, plus the Ten Grand Display they forced each of their Dealers to invest in , in order to remain a Dealer. But considering they have had this Alighnment problem since Spyders came out in 2008, and their Alighnment procedures have never worked, I knew these Rykers would be even more hazardous to drive in traffic on the Freeways over 50 MPH. My 2012 RT Limited was aligned several times using the Factory procedures, but kept wearing my front tires to the cord on the inside walls at 12,000-13,000 miles for the first 44,000 miles, until I finally caved in and paid the $169.00 charge to get the ROLO Alighnment done by a Dealer close by whose’s Service sucks to High Heaven. But they did invest in the ROLO Alignment Kit, where my preferred Dealer, 50 miles away has not. But with these Rykers, BRP will be forced to either provide the ROLO Kit to all Dealers, or make 100% certain they come out of the Factory properly aligned. My 2012 was fine, after the ROLO $169 Alighnment, plus, I had my 2016 RT Limited alligned before I took delivery, and my front OEM Kenda tires did still wear a lot more on the inside, but lasted 27,500 miles before I changed them out to Car tires. BRP finally worked with the Guy’s Dealer who got stuck in Winslow, Arizona, to finally get his entire Wiring Harness replaced, after his Waurentee expired, as I remember, so the “ Squeaky Wheel” finally got greased with out Litigation. Keep squeaking! Also, last Summer, when I was getting blown off with bogus excuses by tne Dealer who sold me my 2016 RT Limited, and my Spyder was tied up for 2-1/2 months in the Shop not getting fixed for the failing front Sprocket Pulleys, I contacted BRP direct, and their Service Rep. got my Spyder Fix expedited by the Dealer who kept blowing smoke up my Butt and treating me like a Mushroom. ( keeping me in the dark and feeding me poop.) I asked BRP to extend my Factory Waurentee, and they came through, and granted me an Extra 4 months for my 2-1/2 months of Summer down time and my Dealer related aggrivation and Stress. So, BRP came thru for me as they did for the Winslow Arizona Wiring Harness Guy, plus we Spyder Owners should NEVER forget the 2013 Spyders with the Hot Seats that were catching on fire before BRP finally had a Recall on all 2013s and did Custom fixes to cool them down. But all the 2013 Owners and Dealers who still had unsold 2013s lost their butts on resales, because only Fools or Neophites would buy any 2013 at normal prices with out getting almost Salvage Deals on them. So, it will be intersting to see how the Ryker Allignment problems are going to be played out by BRP and their Dealers. I know if I was a BRP Dealer and had my Order in for the 20 Rykers BRP had forced on me, and I only had 4 of them dilvered so far, I’d surely cancel the order for the remaing 16 Units until BRP either guranteed Alignment out of the Factory, or cut me one hell of a deal on a ROLO Allghment Kit along with a week end Training Course for my Tech training him how to use it!

Yep, so I've heard.

That posture is to be expected of any large corporation because of the intricacies and liabilities of any communication with the consumer after their intention to litigate has been made. I have tried to keep this as level and open as possible without even discussing the dealer buy-back or other remediation paths. I just want the dealer to fixed their mistakes and certify that the machine is operating "safely". Then I plan to try going down the "BRP Cares" path to get an extension to my warranty... just in case I have any other surprises ahead of me. I typically keep my bikes for 6+ years, so my current 4-year warranty (and my current set of circumstances) lends me to believe that might not be enough.

--
QM

 

[jcthorne]

Its not just the cost of the tools. MANY dealers bought the Rolo laser alignment tools for the Spyders and never did one alignment for customers. Or worse, did them VERY wrong. Its not like using a Hunter alignment machine that tells you to move bolt A 3 turns. There are angles, measurements etc to be calculated and while not rocket science, for those not familiar, there is a learning curve that has shown to be too difficult for some dealers to master. Many dealers refer their customers to local shops that specialize in the Rolo laser alignments. Our local dealers do this.

For the Ryker, there is one more fly in the ointment at the moment. Soon to be resolved. Rolo does not yet have the hub adaptors for the Ryker available. They are a few weeks out. We and other Rolo shops have them on order.

They Spyders went through this as well. A proper laser alignment will sort out a lot of the driving twitch issues being complained about. BRP has never covered these alignements under warranty. I suspect its one more reason dealers do not bother investing in the tools. There is no return on the investment, all owners would expect the alignment for 'free'. Its easier to send them to an outside shop. Not saying the situation is right, just what it is and has been for years now. If its any consolation, Polaris and Vanderhall are the same way.....(we align those too).

 

[Easy Rider]

Hi,

I was going to buy a Ryker, but because of the previous comments, I have decided not to, at least not until they have these issues resolved. If enough of us won't buy, then maybe, just maybe, someone will take care of these issues.
-Thanks

This "issue" is similar or exactly the same as how the original Spyders handled......and still do to this day.
They could help the problem a LOT by being sure that the alignment is right when new machines go out the door......but that would first require them to admit the problem.......which they aren't likely to do.
BRPs customer service generally SUCKS.
Don't hold your breath for it to get better.

 

[Easy Rider]

There are angles, measurements etc to be calculated and while not rocket science, for those not familiar, there is a learning curve that has shown to be too difficult for some dealers to master.

I'm surprised that some of the "grease monkeys" that call themselves mechanics these days can find their way to work every morning BUT.......

I think that statement above is just a bit misleading.
There is only ONE parameter in the alignment that can be adjusted, right ? And there is only ONE adjustment to change that setting.....right ??
And the math involved is really complicated; something like multiplying the desired actual setting by 5 to get the setting on the laser target.....right ??

MY problem so far hasn't been finding a dealer with the equipment but with convincing them to go just a tiny bit beyond the BRP recommended setting.......and that nothing will blow up if they do that.

I'm about to give up on them, which is sad because I really liked dealing with them most of the time.

 

[jcthorne]

I'm surprised that some of the "grease monkeys" that call themselves mechanics these days can find their way to work every morning BUT.......

I think that statement above is just a bit misleading.
There is only ONE parameter in the alignment that can be adjusted, right ? And there is only ONE adjustment to change that setting.....right ??
And the math involved is really complicated; something like multiplying the desired actual setting by 5 to get the setting on the laser target.....right ??

MY problem so far hasn't been finding a dealer with the equipment but with convincing them to go just a tiny bit beyond the BRP recommended setting.......and that nothing will blow up if they do that.

I'm about to give up on them, which is sad because I really liked dealing with them most of the time.

And that is why most dealers never figured it out. Nope there is more to it than that. I know what you think you know, toe, is all that is adjusted but its not that simple. First its adjusted on both sides to reference the correct thrust vector, then there is aligning the DPS and torque sensors to match the new alignment settings. IE the toe has to be centered on the rear wheel thrust line and the DPS zero point must match as well as zero steering torque at that point.

Lastly, there ARE NO BRP SPECS for a proper laser alignment setting. The specs they reference are to the frame, not the rear wheel thrust line. Also they are with fixed length struts bolted in where the shocks and springs are normally. For most Spyders they are NOT the same and the BRP method results in a very poor alignment. BRP has endorsed the Rolo laser method but does not provide specs for it. Rolo does.

 

[WilliamTRyker]

For most Spyders they are NOT the same and the BRP method results in a very poor alignment.

I was considering bringing in my Ryker to the dealer for a manual (non-laser) alignment but from what was just explained, would that make things worse from the OOTB alignment issues that folks have been having?

 

[jcthorne]

Just take it to a Rolo laser alignment shop. Forget the BRP method. Could be better, could be worse, will not be right.

 

[ryker]

I had a 2012 spyder RS, traded it in 2016. During that time i never noticed any alignment issues. So was i just not savvy enough to notice or is it a sporadic problem? i pick up my ryker tomorrow

 

[jcthorne]

Some are worse than others. But I can tell you of the many we have had in our shop for alignment, only one was correct from the factory. He got a freebie. I think Ann (Squared Away) has had 2 or 3. Its a very small number.

 

[Freddy]

This "issue" is similar or exactly the same as how the original Spyders handled......and still do to this day.
They could help the problem a LOT by being sure that the alignment is right when new machines go out the door......but that would first require them to admit the problem.......which they aren't likely to do.
BRPs customer service generally SUCKS.
Don't hold your breath for it to get better.

Amen to that bro.

 

[Easy Rider]

BRP has endorsed the Rolo laser method but does not provide specs for it. Rolo does.

My dealer has the equipment but doesn't seem to know THIS.
I may need to remind them.

Actually I'm going to Daytona in a couple of weeks and might just visit "the factory" while I'm there and get it done right.

 

[Easy Rider]

So was i just not savvy enough to notice or is it a sporadic problem? i pick up my ryker tomorrow

It is not a matter of "savvy" but one of rider sensitivity.
And what kind of riding and roads you do.

Some riders never experience any problem.......or just adapt without thinking about it.

I bet there are THOUSANDS of owners out there who would be amazed if they got to ride one that is properly aligned.

 

[RykerUSA]

To this point, I have always been amazed at how many spyders are for sale with less than a 1000 miles on them. My hunch is these owners don't realize that they are not in proper alignment and do not like the ride.