Questions about belt problem

[Spyderjockey]

We went on about a 200 mile ride today and started noticing like a knock up through the foot pegs like something going thru the sprockets on the belt. When I got home I took the left side tupperware off and discovered many of the teeth or cogs on the belt missing.....probably upwards of 30 or more. I had the front "sprocket problem" back at about 33,000 miles and the the belt and both sprockets were changed at that time. Since then the front sprocket had loosened up, I guess because that dealership didn't put any thread lock on the bolt. (I don't do business with them any more over the whole "belt and sprocket incident").

The dealer that I originally bought the bike from changed the front sprocket again at I'm guessing around 40,000 miles. So anyway I have about 59360 miles on the bike which only gives me about about 26,000 miles on this belt. The other thing is the belt is vey loose but in perfect alignment on the rear sprocket. One question I have is would loosing cogs off the belt allow the belt to stretch. From what I can tell both sprockets look to be in really good shape.... no roughness or chips or anything like that. Does any one have any ideas what would would cause this problem?

Here is a link to some pics. : http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/t...otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/

I put some tags on each picture over in the margin to the right.

Thanks for any help from anyone!

 

[NancysToy]

I would be skeptical of a fix that merely replaced the sprocket and retorqued the bolt. BTW, normally Loctite is not used on this bolt. Anyway, I suspect shaft damage in addition to the original sprocket wear, allowed the sprocket to loosen again. As to the damaged belt, missing teeth are just one symptom of belt failure. The belt is also likely stretched in that area, due to broken strands. Hard to say what the initial cause was. It could have been related to the sprocket problems, could be the result of picking up a rock, could be deterioration due to belt contamination from petroleum products or solvents, or could be due to improper belt tension. The mileage you have gotton out of your belts is less than I would expect under normal conditions. I think the drive shaft, sprocket, tension, and alignment need to all be looked at very carefully when you replace the belt. Other than that, considering the track record, you might consider keeping a spare belt around.

 

[BajaRon]

Like Scotty said... I'd say you may have bigger issues.

 

[Spyderjockey]

The mileage you have gotton out of your belts is less than I would expect under normal conditions.

I forgot to mention the 1st belt was in excellent condition when it was replaced ( I still have the belt and will probably put this belt back on...but want to find out what is going on with the drive train first) just the front sprocket was in bad shape inside the hub there was nothing wrong with the rear sprocket also. The mechanic told me that BRP requires if "1 sprocket has to be changed then the other sprocket and belt has to be replaced also". Other dealers do not do this and only replace what is needed. This is the problem I referred to as the "belt and sprocket incident" and because of the way the mechanic entered it into the system BRP would not cover the repairs even though I have the extended warranty. It ended up costing me over a $1,000 completely out of my pocket!

 

[SpydeRider2010]

too bad you had the entry problem with the mechanic. was the svc mgr no help...?

 

[Spyderjockey]

too bad you had the entry problem with the mechanic. was the svc mgr no help...?

It is a very small dealership and only has 1 mechanic. I always liked the owner but he would do nothing to help. They are 5 miles from my house but I travel over 60 miles to the dealer I go to now. They are the ones I bought the Spyder from and have been real good to us.

 

[r1100rider]

I would recommend that any time the sprocket bolt is removed it is drilled in the head and Safety wired then it can't. Come out or come loose

 

[Arthur---Mexico]

From the looks of the photos of your belt I think you are living on borrowed time. You HAVE to change the belt. If the present driver and driven sprockets have been in use for 33,000 miles they both should be replaced when the new belt is installed. The sprockets suffer wear that you can't see. Consequently when you install a new belt and run it on worn sprockets the deformed sprocket teeth will wear out the new belt. I have manufactured hundreds of thousands of toothed belt sprockets and have a bit of exprience in that field. Arthur---Mexico City

We went on about a 200 mile ride today and started noticing like a knock up through the foot pegs like something going thru the sprockets on the belt. When I got home I took the left side tupperware off and discovered many of the teeth or cogs on the belt missing.....probably upwards of 30 or more. I had the front "sprocket problem" back at about 33,000 miles and the the belt and both sprockets were changed at that time. Since then the front sprocket had loosened up, I guess because that dealership didn't put any thread lock on the bolt. (I don't do business with them any more over the whole "belt and sprocket incident").

The dealer that I originally bought the bike from changed the front sprocket again at I'm guessing around 40,000 miles. So anyway I have about 59360 miles on the bike which only gives me about about 26,000 miles on this belt. The other thing is the belt is vey loose but in perfect alignment on the rear sprocket. One question I have is would loosing cogs off the belt allow the belt to stretch. From what I can tell both sprockets look to be in really good shape.... no roughness or chips or anything like that. Does any one have any ideas what would would cause this problem?

Here is a link to some pics. : http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/t...otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/

I put some tags on each picture over in the margin to the right.

Thanks for any help from anyone!

 

[Freddy]

I would recommend that any time the sprocket bolt is removed it is drilled in the head and Safety wired then it can't. Come out or come loose

I beg to differ on one point - it may come loose due to insufficient clamping force between the pulley and shaft sholder that the pulley sits on. If slight relative movement commences, the bolt will effectively become looser as material wears away. This is what the BRP retorque procedure was aimed at preventing.

 

[docdoru]

I beg to differ on one point - it may come loose due to insufficient clamping force between the pulley and shaft sholder that the pulley sits on. If slight relative movement commences, the bolt will effectively become looser as material wears away. This is what the BRP retorque procedure was aimed at preventing.

This is correct if applies to new engines; if he replaced allready 2-3 front sprockets over 40K miles, the damaged part is the mainshaft.

 

[SethO]

it should be replaced under warranty, I had a belt lose 50% of the teeth on my belt in 3 days, if its a little loose the teeth take more and once you lose one the take a ton more pressure, get a dealer that will warranty it or just get get a new front for the YEAR of the spyder, they are different per year.

I have had them replaced under warranty when mine front broke after the first spyderfest.

 

[Freddy]

This is correct if applies to new engines; if he replaced allready 2-3 front sprockets over 40K miles, the damaged part is the mainshaft.

AGREED!

 

[Spyderjockey]

Found something very interesting

I talked to the dealer about my problem with with my drive belt lossing about 30 or so cogs off the belt at about 23,000 miles. It happened last Sat. on a 200 mile long ride. He told me that he had never heard of that happening before and he wanted to talk to BRP to see if they would cover it under my extended warranty. I talked to him yesterday and he said BRP was not going to cover it under my warranty and that it was a wear item and even though the belt failed and did not wear out they still refused to cover it.

I still have the "original" belt that was taken off my Spyder at 33,000 miles and is still in excellent shape so I decided to put that belt back on the bike. So I took the failed belt off and was comparing it to the old "original" belt and found that just by looking at it the "original" was much more beefy in the width of the cogs and the valleys between the cogs had less width than the failed belt. So I got out my dial calipers and started measuring the differences between the 2 belts. I took some pics. of the actual belts, but they didn't turn out very well. It looks like the failed belt was defromed on the cogs but is not the cogs that are left on the belt are very unifrom in shape and in size. I also made a crude drawing with the dimensions that I was able to come up with.

I just think it is very weird that there is so much difference in apperance and dimesions of the 2 belts. I can see why the cogs on the failed belt would have popped off the way they did even at less mileage than the original belt. I just wondered if any one else had noticed the difference between original belts and the newer belts? Also wonder why BRP would have done this?


Just a quick update on this. I took the two belts to another dealer to get his opinion on what had happened to the belt and he had never seen anything like that before. As we looked at the 2 belts side by side we discovered that the original belt has like a "liner" on the inside of the belt about maybe 3/32 of an inch in thickeness, but the failed belt was missing this "liner" which explains the difference in the size of the cogs. Of course with that "liner" missing it created a lot of slop or gaps between the teeth on the sprockets teeth and subsequently it started popping the cogs off. My question now is why did that "liner" peel off in the first place?

Here is the link to the pics: http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/t...otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/

 

[MikeinGA]

I talked to the dealer about my problem with with my drive belt lossing about 30 or so cogs off the belt at about 23,000 miles. It happened last Sat. on a 200 mile long ride. He told me that he had never heard of that happening before and he wanted to talk to BRP to see if they would cover it under my extended warranty. I talked to him yesterday and he said BRP was not going to cover it under my warranty and that it was a wear item and even though the belt failed and did not wear out they still refused to cover it.

I still have the "original" belt that was taken off my Spyder at 33,000 miles and is still in excellent shape so I decided to put that belt back on the bike. So I took the failed belt off and was comparing it to the old "original" belt and found that just by looking at it the "original" was much more beefy in the width of the cogs and the valleys between the cogs had less width than the failed belt. So I got out my dial calipers and started measuring the differences between the 2 belts. I took some pics. of the actual belts, but they didn't turn out very well. It looks like the failed belt was defromed on the cogs but is not the cogs that are left on the belt are very unifrom in shape and in size. I also made a crude drawing with the dimensions that I was able to come up with.

I just think it is very weird that there is so much difference in apperance and dimesions of the 2 belts. I can see why the cogs on the failed belt would have popped off the way they did even at less mileage than the original belt. I just wondered if any one else had noticed the difference between original belts and the newer belts? Also wonder why BRP would have done this?

Here is the link to the pics: http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/t...otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/

I seen belts like this this before. The belts dryout due to heat. The belt runs very close to the exhaust headers that heats up to 300+ deg. F. When you stop at red light or park the Spider ater running it the heat builds up and that's shortens the life of the belt. Till I get my sheilds made and installed I spray the belts with water to cool the belt down when I park my Spider RS. I hope to get 80,000+ miles out of my belt. That's IMHO.


Mike

 

[Spyderjockey]

Bump

I talked to the dealer about my problem with with my drive belt lossing about 30 or so cogs off the belt at about 23,000 miles. It happened last Sat. on a 200 mile long ride. He told me that he had never heard of that happening before and he wanted to talk to BRP to see if they would cover it under my extended warranty. I talked to him yesterday and he said BRP was not going to cover it under my warranty and that it was a wear item and even though the belt failed and did not wear out they still refused to cover it.

I still have the "original" belt that was taken off my Spyder at 33,000 miles and is still in excellent shape so I decided to put that belt back on the bike. So I took the failed belt off and was comparing it to the old "original" belt and found that just by looking at it the "original" was much more beefy in the width of the cogs and the valleys between the cogs had less width than the failed belt. So I got out my dial calipers and started measuring the differences between the 2 belts. I took some pics. of the actual belts, but they didn't turn out very well. It looks like the failed belt was defromed on the cogs but is not the cogs that are left on the belt are very unifrom in shape and in size. I also made a crude drawing with the dimensions that I was able to come up with.

I just think it is very weird that there is so much difference in apperance and dimesions of the 2 belts. I can see why the cogs on the failed belt would have popped off the way they did even at less mileage than the original belt. I just wondered if any one else had noticed the difference between original belts and the newer belts? Also wonder why BRP would have done this?


Just a quick update on this. I took the two belts to another dealer to get his opinion on what had happened to the belt and he had never seen anything like that before. As we looked at the 2 belts side by side we discovered that the original belt has like a "liner" on the inside of the belt about maybe 3/32 of an inch in thickeness, but the failed belt was missing this "liner" which explains the difference in the size of the cogs. Of course with that "liner" missing it created a lot of slop or gaps between the teeth on the sprockets teeth and subsequently it started popping the cogs off. My question now is why did that "liner" peel off in the first place?

Here is the link to the pics: http://www2.snapfish.com/snapfish/t...otsc=SHR/otsi=SALBlink/COBRAND_NAME=snapfish/