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Mobile 1 4T motorcycle oil 1st Gear SE6 clutch slipping
- Thread starter Wildrice
- Start date
Yes! I have some to try, just didn't get to ride my Harleys this year as the weather was terrible. When we would get a nice day had to cut the grass. The thinner oil in the trans does cause a little sticking on the shift forks.
I have a complete work load for the winter if I can get myself going!
I also have some 75/140 to try in the front and rear of my truck.
PMK
Active member
True it is a tool of sorts. Having been involved with aircraft oil analysis on many different aircraft for a long time, certain items tend to stand out and / or have often got typical sources. Many times elevated silica is simply poor air filtration.
The iron being elevated would concern me though. Doubtful it is a ball bearing, and other bearings use a soft bearing material against steel. As mentioned could be gearbox related or piston rings.
The increase in iron, not the actual number but the comparison to previous results to me is quite a change. The owner states it may be mileage related. Which in that case I would collect and analyze a sample taken at similar mileage as the Mobil 1 that had lower iron amounts.
I would also inquire with the lab as to what they use for the above normal threshold for these engines, and see if they have ideas on why the iron increased as it did.
opcorn:
JayBros
Well-known member
Sorry, try this one https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/viscosity-charts/ and then click the menu in the upper right corner of the page and select Engine Oil Analysis under the Oil Analysis topic section.
Y'all worry too much. Back in the 60s I was riding Japanese Sport bikes with integral crankcase and gearbox. They all had wet clutch. Nobody ever heard of any special oil just for motorcyles. Didn't have no Internet so we couldn't ask no questions. We just dumped 10W-40 car oil in them and rode the hell out of them. If a clutch blew out, it was because we was drag racing on any straight strip of country road we could find. Don't worry about it. Just dump the best oil you know of in it and ride hell out of it.
Yup! The Rayolube wonders LOL!!! But back then those were $100.00 not $30,000? I believe most folks are more protective of their babies these days?
The next analysis will tell if there is a trend? Yes indeed, aircraft are a much more refined animal. There is no margin for error. I was involved also, my father mostly, he was an A&P and rebuilt older Ceconite (hope I spelled that correct) covered aircraft and I painted them. I used to help him when I was very young into my late teens. I spent quite a bit of time sampling fuel, oil, checking plugs, removing mags for inspection and on and on. Note to the younger folks, spend as much time with your dad as you can, another topic all together!
PMK
Active member
Regarding his last three oil analysis, my opinion is the levels are trending upward. I did a quick Google search for what is deemed unacceptable iron ppm amounts and it appears 200 ppm and above is cause for concern.
Modern aircraft piston engines are very reliable, partially because the do not produce huge horsepower per cubic inch, and the bearing surfaces are quite large in surface area. Add to this, oil filters are opened and inspected by most shops, so visually a lot can be seen there.
I need to revisit the oil rating webpage I prefer and see if Amsoil moto oils have been tested yet.
007james
Member
PPM of Iron in the Oil has much to do with the Micron rating of the Filter, and how many ounces of particulate the Filter will hold, before becoming fully loaded. Also, the Quality of the Filter makes a big difference, as well, and no by passing of the filter element is occurring once the filter is loaded. I know my Harley Filter is a 20 Micron Filter, but I am uncertain what the Spyder Filters are. Remember on our 998 V-Twin Spyder engines, the Owner Manuals had us changing the Oil and filter every 3,000 miles. On my 2012, I did 5-6 Oil and filter changes every 3,000 miles. Then, BRP decided we could go 4,600 miles, on Oil changes, but they increased the size of the Filter, so it would hold more particulate before loading , and not filtering the iron and particulate from the oil. Most likely, a lot of the particulate comes from the clutch discs, as well as the tranny gears. So, if iron is being checked after the Filter is plugged, then more iron in the oil after more miles, is not necessarily the oil breaking down, but the Filter plugging up . Also, using full a Synthetic Oil VS. Blends, that are lucky to contain even 10% Synthetics, also is a no brainer, for any one that has experimented using them both.
007James
007James
PMK
Active member
I often considered that, but the last look at oil ratings did show some Amsoil types had been tested with favorable results. Simply time will see if the moto oils do get tested. At that point it will be interesting to see how they compare.
While popular and likely good, Shell Rotella T6 rates lower than Mobil 1 Sportbike 10w40. Therefore that is what I prefer to use.
PMK
Active member
All valid and true points, however this report is in regards to a 1330 triple, not the V Twin, and the oil / filter change interval is not being exceeded.
007james
Member
My reply was to question the durability of the Oil Filter, not the Oil. The 9300 miles Oil change recommended by BRP, on the 1330 Engines, was with using their standard Blend oil, not full synthetic Multigrade Oils. Also, they must have tested their own filter with the standard Blend, so
in order to get a much more revealing Test, different Quality Oil Filters, with different Micron ratings, as well as various filter fabric materials, O- Rings, should be used , and even with out changing the present filter design, my best guess is, that using Mobil 1 4T full Synthetic Racing Oil will not show much difference at 12,000 miles, than BRP’s recommenced 9300 using using standard blend oil.
007James
in order to get a much more revealing Test, different Quality Oil Filters, with different Micron ratings, as well as various filter fabric materials, O- Rings, should be used , and even with out changing the present filter design, my best guess is, that using Mobil 1 4T full Synthetic Racing Oil will not show much difference at 12,000 miles, than BRP’s recommenced 9300 using using standard blend oil.
007James
PMK
Active member
Yeah but, the guy with high iron ppm levels had previously been using Mobil 1 Sportbike oil and switched to Amsoil and the iron levels increased, but has been basing his oils capability, and possibly change interval, on how well the viscosity is holding up.
JayBros
Well-known member
Thanks for posting the 200 ppm number. I noted the increasing Fe contamination but didn't know the concern number and knew that if the analysis did exceed it the report would have said so.
Forgot to mention in original post that when I replaced spark plugs at 56K service the old ones were clean as a whistle and could probably gone on for a good number of more miles
At my age, if the Spyder continues to perform as it has for the last five years and 63K miles I hope to get at least another five out of it and hopefully more. It may wind up my last motorcycle.
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PMK
Active member
If it were me, I would do the next sample at a similar mileage you were testing the M1 at. Then compare.
007james
Member
PMK,...there are so very many, unstable, CHANGING variables, in testing ANY Liquid, including Oils for impurities, at any duration of time, miles, hours, etc., that the promotions of certain Oils, like Amsoil and Mobil 1 will never become Science. Among the many Filtration Systems I was involved with, during my Career in my past life, one of the Products was a Portable Oil Reclamation Filtration, / Oil Water Separation System. In the thousands of tests we did on all sorts of oils, in Elevators, Industrial Hydraulic presses, etc., the test results most always came back different . Operators lie thru their teeth, and never tell the truth of exactly what they did different to the Oils each time. Spyder Drivers are just a different Breed of Operators. HaHa. Here is a Link to an Article I wrote when I was in the Filtration and Pump Business. Scroll to the Filters section, to sample a small taste of the possible variables, which no doubt, applies to testing Oils in the 1330 Spyder engine as well.
https://www.pfonline.com/articles/choosing-pumps-and-filters
007James
https://www.pfonline.com/articles/choosing-pumps-and-filters
007James
Highwayman2013
New member
As to oil filters I ran the Mobil 1 with the BRP filter and the Amsoil with the Hi Flo filter from Bajaron. Still I did get 6 more ppm of Iron. The Mobil1 definitely breaks down quicker than Amsoil as shown by my tests. The earlier loss of viscosity shocked me on the Mobil 1. Not saying its a bad oil but Amsoil holds up better.
