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Mobile 1 4T motorcycle oil 1st Gear SE6 clutch slipping

I did back to back oil analysis on the Mobil 1 and the Amsoil and can confirm the Amsoil is still a 40 weight at 9,666 miles while the Mobil 1 was a 30 weight at 8,600 miles in our 2016 F3l.

Ahhhh.. That was your post on BITOG. I wonder how shear stability varies from SE6 > SM6 transmissions? Rotella T 5w40 is notorious for shearing down in shared sump m/c use. The joys of oil debates :) :(
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru.../re-2016-can-am-spyder-amsoil-mmo#Post5190282
 
I wasn't referring to you, sorry if I implied that. Just stating that some not familiar with H-D three hole design may not know that primary = wet clutch.

Actually, the Harley XL engines only have 2 holes. The primary and the tranny are running the same oil.
 
It can catch you out if you're not paying attention: Walmart has, side by side on the shelf, two different flavors of Mobil 1 MOTORCYCLE oil.
One is made for wet clutches (Mobil 1 4T), one is for Harleys (Mobil 1 V-Twin) which have separate crankcase, primary, and transmission oil supplies.
Myself and most folks I know use Mobil 1 V Twin 20/50 for all lubrication needs in our Harleys, as well as most dealers!
 
I ran Mobil 4T Racing 10W-40 full synthetic oil for 19,000+ miles changing it every 6,000 or so but switched to Amsoil because the Mobil viscosity sheared down to 20 weight but gave me absolutely no problems and did shift smoother than BRP's synthetic blend. Have been using Amsoil Metric 10W-40 fully synthetic since 26K on the clock changing it at 9,300 and having it analyzed. It routinely gives 40 wt performance in the cSt 100 scale at the 9,300 distance.

Please post the analytical sheet for us all?
 
Is that Mobil 1 made for wet clutches??

Mikey,
I use Valvoline Full Synthetic Motorcycle Oil 10 W-40. This oil is "Ultimate Wet Clutch Transmission & Engine Protection"

1. Formulated for specific needs for high performance 4 stoke, motorcycles, including high temperatures, and WET CLUTCH Systems.

2. Full Synthetic formula for the ultimate protection against wear, deposits and corrosion that can decrease engine performance.

3. Outstanding wet clutch protection for maximum power and transfer & smooth shifting.

Meets or Exceeds JASO MA2 API SL

Also, Developed with advanced additives to resist oil thickening and maximize horsepower.

I have use the above oil for 4 years, until present. I haven't had any problems. I have a 2014 RTS-SE6.

I have the dealership change the oil when the spyder is in hibernation. ( Oct. April).
Deanna
 
Please post the analytical sheet for us all?

Attached below is the analysis record for my Spyder. Please note in the analysis reported 2 Apr 18 the water content was listed at 0.72% which prevented a physical viscosity test. I contacted the lab about the report and the technician I spoke with said the increased water percentage was due to condensation in the oil that was the result of me not running the engine long enough to get the oil to proper temperature. Yes, it was my fault because I was not riding the bike far enough each morning going to and from the gym. The subsequent analyses showed the Amsoil held its viscosity very well into the 9,000 mile range. My next oil change is due in about 1,300 miles. The learning points for me:

a. Since my bike is pretty much my daily transportation, don't use my Spyder for short ride trips during winter months. My winter route one way distance to the gym became 20 miles.

b. The Mobil 1 held its viscosity at shorter intervals but I made the switch because I wanted to run it the full 9,300 but didn't really know if it would go the full 9,300 and still retain 40 weight viscosity. Maybe, maybe not. With the demonstrated performance of the Amsoil I see no reason to switch back to Mobil 1.
 

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Ahhhh.. That was your post on BITOG. I wonder how shear stability varies from SE6 > SM6 transmissions? Rotella T 5w40 is notorious for shearing down in shared sump m/c use. The joys of oil debates :) :(
https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/foru.../re-2016-can-am-spyder-amsoil-mmo#Post5190282

I have accumulated a fair number of oil analysis. People send me copies because they know it interests me. There doesn't seem to be any significant difference between any of the engines or configurations. I'd say that riding style makes more difference. The 998 and the 1330 (both SE and SM models) seem to do test with about the same results with both the BRP oil and Amsoil (the 2 oils I have the greatest number of test results for). In other words. BRP oil tested about the same with both engines and Amsoil tested out about the same with both engines. I would have thought the 1330 with more HP and Torque would degrade the oil sooner than the 998. But it didn't work out that way. I am guessing that the gears have more surface contact area on the 1330 engine and thus the pressure per square inch may be about the same. It is the transmission that destroys the oil. Not the engine.

Typically, the BRP oil begins to shear at about 4,500 miles and gets down to 20 weight at around 5,500 miles. It then stabilizes at 20 weight until changed. Even when going 10,000 miles. Amsoil tends to start showing a slight reduction in viscosity around 7,000 miles and tests out in the mid 30's at around 10,000 miles. There is, of course, some variation. But not as much as you'd think.
 
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Myself and most folks I know use Mobil 1 V Twin 20/50 for all lubrication needs in our Harleys, as well as most dealers!

you should try the mobil 1 syn 75/90 gear lube in the tranny, in my last 88, 96 and current 103 it shifts smoother than the 20/50 v twin oil, especially when its hot.
 
Attached below is the analysis record for my Spyder. Please note in the analysis reported 2 Apr 18 the water content was listed at 0.72% which prevented a physical viscosity test. I contacted the lab about the report and the technician I spoke with said the increased water percentage was due to condensation in the oil that was the result of me not running the engine long enough to get the oil to proper temperature. Yes, it was my fault because I was not riding the bike far enough each morning going to and from the gym. The subsequent analyses showed the Amsoil held its viscosity very well into the 9,000 mile range. My next oil change is due in about 1,300 miles. The learning points for me:

a. Since my bike is pretty much my daily transportation, don't use my Spyder for short ride trips during winter months. My winter route one way distance to the gym became 20 miles.

b. The Mobil 1 held its viscosity at shorter intervals but I made the switch because I wanted to run it the full 9,300 but didn't really know if it would go the full 9,300 and still retain 40 weight viscosity. Maybe, maybe not. With the demonstrated performance of the Amsoil I see no reason to switch back to Mobil 1.

Any details on why the Iron contamination is 5 times worse with Amsoil vs Mobil 1?

Never fail to realize that while viscosity retention over time is important, lubricity is even more critical. The elevating Iron amounts would be a concern to me. In Nikasil cylinders, often that can be piston ring wear.
 
Y'all worry too much. Back in the 60s I was riding Japanese Sport bikes with integral crankcase and gearbox. They all had wet clutch. Nobody ever heard of any special oil just for motorcyles. Didn't have no Internet so we couldn't ask no questions. We just dumped 10W-40 car oil in them and rode the hell out of them. If a clutch blew out, it was because we was drag racing on any straight strip of country road we could find. Don't worry about it. Just dump the best oil you know of in it and ride hell out of it.

350honda-taiwan1250px.JPG
 
Y'all worry too much. Back in the 60s I was riding Japanese Sport bikes with integral crankcase and gearbox. They all had wet clutch. Nobody ever heard of any special oil just for motorcyles. Didn't have no Internet so we couldn't ask no questions. We just dumped 10W-40 car oil in them and rode the hell out of them. If a clutch blew out, it was because we was drag racing on any straight strip of country road we could find. Don't worry about it. Just dump the best oil you know of in it and ride hell out of it.

Gwolf, I was really only a young tacker, but I had the same experience - altho in all honesty, it's not really a fair statement, cos waaayy back then, NO oil had anything much in the way of friction modifiers added; so whatever oil you got, at its functional level, it was really pretty much all the same stuff!! :lecturef_smilie: nojoke

However, all that started changing big-time in the 70's.... oils (& a lot of other things too :opps: ) started to get heaps of esoteric stuff added, some of which helped make the oils 'slippery-er' :p Which was good for some things, like cars that got driven hard, or that only got driven once a week; just really not so good for motorcycles with wet clutches! :gaah: As many of us learnt.... the hard way! :sour:
 
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I believe I posted the link on the #21 post

Ok found it! Looks black and white! I just have too much history with Mobil 1 to change. Only oils I have used in 40 years are Mobil 1 and Valvoline in 4 strokes and Maxima and Klotz in 2 strokes. Quite a bit of drag racing, all Chevrolet engines, Suzuki engines in 4 stroke and Yamaha 2 strokes. Many engine teardowns to see oil effects. Only bearing damage was in early years from Pennzoil, had bearing damage on 2 big block Chevrolet engines, changed to Valvoline and never looked back. 13 years in the auto repair business, many years of drag racing and performance engines told me this, on a stock street driven vehicle its possible to exeed 100,000 miles and never change the oil just keep level up, I have seen it and the effects. I have seen the effects of 3,000 mile oil changes with many brands that look like new after 100,000 miles. In the mid 80s Toyota had a 22RE 4 cylinder turbo available in the pickup and 4 Runner, they were eating turbos due to oil coking in the turbo bearing and oil supply line. Some with low mileage in the teens. I had the 1985 pickup with some modifications and boost at 9lbs. I run the truck 38,000 miles then removed the modifications except the exhaust and sold it to my fathers best friend. I advised him to ONLY use Mobil 1 and he followed the recommendation. over 300,000 miles, original turbo and engine never opened. I cannot remember the exact mileage but I believe it was mid 300,000ish when he sold it. The most I push Mobil 1 in my everyday drivers is 5000 miles, I worry about the filters. Just my .02c!!
 
Any details on why the Iron contamination is 5 times worse with Amsoil vs Mobil 1?

Have no idea. With the engine and transmission using the same oil one can not rule out the trans gears contributing to Fe contamination. See this link for other possible engine sources and the Amsoil had been run many more miles than the Mobil 1: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/engine-oil-analysis/http://. Engine still uses absolutely no oil, has no smoke in exhaust nor indications in pipes. Mileage has also improved a bit over the last year. It will be interesting to see what the next analysis says about Fe contamination.
 
Attached below is the analysis record for my Spyder. Please note in the analysis reported 2 Apr 18 the water content was listed at 0.72% which prevented a physical viscosity test. I contacted the lab about the report and the technician I spoke with said the increased water percentage was due to condensation in the oil that was the result of me not running the engine long enough to get the oil to proper temperature. Yes, it was my fault because I was not riding the bike far enough each morning going to and from the gym. The subsequent analyses showed the Amsoil held its viscosity very well into the 9,000 mile range. My next oil change is due in about 1,300 miles. The learning points for me:

a. Since my bike is pretty much my daily transportation, don't use my Spyder for short ride trips during winter months. My winter route one way distance to the gym became 20 miles.

b. The Mobil 1 held its viscosity at shorter intervals but I made the switch because I wanted to run it the full 9,300 but didn't really know if it would go the full 9,300 and still retain 40 weight viscosity. Maybe, maybe not. With the demonstrated performance of the Amsoil I see no reason to switch back to Mobil 1.

I find the analyticals interesting as there are so many variables that affect the results. Air filter, temperature, humidity, fuel etc, very interesting.
 
Have no idea. With the engine and transmission using the same oil one can not rule out the trans gears contributing to Fe contamination. See this link for other possible engine sources and the Amsoil had been run many more miles than the Mobil 1: https://www.bobistheoilguy.com/engine-oil-analysis/http://. Engine still uses absolutely no oil, has no smoke in exhaust nor indications in pipes. Mileage has also improved a bit over the last year. It will be interesting to see what the next analysis says about Fe contamination.
Your link says could not be found
 
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