Dealer says Car tires damage fenders - does this make sense???

[troop]

If those 165/60R15 Vredesteins touched your fenders at all, then be very wary about fitting Kanines :lecturef_smilie: One of the very few differences between them and the OEM Spec Kendas that I've been able to actually measure is their tread depth!

The Kanines have slightly more tread depth than the OEM Spec Kendas (IIRC it's less than 1mm, but that's probably juuuust enough to account for the reported 'better tire life' some claim from them... ) and I'm pretty sure the 'extra' all comes from a tad more 'rubber' added to the outside/rolling dia of the tire, rather than the tread pattern impression just being pressed in deeper than on the OEM Spec Kendas. Personally, I reckon that both OEM Spec AND the 'almost clone' Kanines are made so flimsily to start with that there's just not enough overall 'rubber' thickness in the tread area for the tread pattern to be pressed any deeper anyway!! :banghead:

So like I said - if the Vredesteins touched the insides of your fenders, you might wanta check that the Kanines don't too!! :lecturef_smilie:

There again, what air pressure did you have in the Vredesteins? Cos anything much more than 18 psi would've likely over-inflated them beyond what is strictly ideal &/or necessary for even a fully loaded & ridden hard Spyder's weight & performance capabilities, so with any higher pressures than that they'd blow up bigger, just like an over-inflated party balloon! :banghead:

Hi Peter,
I ran the Vredestein's at 17#, but also tried 15# on the Rt. As I mentioned, my Achilles ATR-K car tires are 165/55R15 in size and have 10/32" or 8mm tread depth and have no clearance issues. I also run those at 17#. Sadly, for whatever reason, no one (Federal/Achilles/etc) is bringing 165/55-15 tires to the states anymore. That said, I still can find a 165/55R15 auto snow tire but it has 11/32" or 9mm tread depth. It has a 22.1" overall diameter, which is the same as my All Season Achilles 165/55R15 .

 

[BajaRon]

I have one of those 2020+ RT Spyders I both shimmed the fenders and went to slimmer profile screws to no avail. My Vredestein 165/60r15 tires still made slight contact on both my OEM wheels and PPA wheels. Spent damn near $100 on tire swapping. Not going to do any more swapping. My three year old 165/55R15 Achilles ATR-K tires work just fine, but I'll likely replace them after this season with Kenda Kanine's. I sent the Vredesteins down the road on my F3S sale.

Now this is something that we have not encountered. Though we pretty much exclusively use Vredesteins for the front unless a customer brings in something else. We have modified the wire retention system on fenders that have broken or mangled the OEM retainers beyond function.

Why BRP felt it necessary to change the fender dimensions is beyond me. Some things I just don't understand. Why 'Fix' a good thing? But it happens all the time.

 

[Snoking1127]

When I was picking up my Spyder from recall last week my buddy who drove me there ask about getting a new rear tire mounted on his. I asked if we ordered a General would they mount that for him. Service said no, has to be a motorcycle tire. I said the Spyder has J style auto bead wheels!!! He said we can only mount Kenda and Kanines. Someone should take BRP to court on this issue.

 

[BajaRon]

When I was picking up my Spyder from recall last week my buddy who drove me there ask about getting a new rear tire mounted on his. I asked if we ordered a General would they mount that for him. Service said no, has to be a motorcycle tire. I said the Spyder has J style auto bead wheels!!! He said we can only mount Kenda and Kanines. Someone should take BRP to court on this issue.

Good luck with that. A dealership cannot be forced to mount any aftermarket product. It's their business and I fully support them running it they way they see fit. If they don't make the customer happy, that person can go elsewhere. Though I realize some dealerships are few and far between.

It is my understanding that corporate puts a lot of pressure on dealerships with this tire situation. I don't agree with them lying about safety and the 'Motorcycle' tire angle. But again, they own it, they should be able to run it the way they see fit.

The way forward has always been the same. An informed customer. Your pushback, while not an instant cure, may, over time, create change.

 

[troop]

3 of 4 local dealers will only mount Kenda tires. The 4th will mount anything you bring in, but will only sell Kenda's. They won't let BRP dictate their labor choices.

 

[GRHorst]

I recently damaged a front tire and rim when we hit a road hazard (rock). I found a lot of car tires that are about the same size. But I had to look for a while to find some that are the same size as the originals. Since some people reported fender issues on some tires, I looked around and eventually settled on these. They are motorcycle tires the original size as the Kendas. I wasn't sure about the brand? We will see how they do ...

I had them mounted/balanced by my car mechanic. Then laser aligned at the Spyder dealer.

VEE RUBBER Vee Rubber VTR-350 Arachnid Touring 165/55R15 55H Front Motorcycle Street Tire
Size: 165/55R15
SKU: V35003

 

[Peter Aawen]

I recently damaged a front tire and rim when we hit a road hazard (rock). I found a lot of car tires that are about the same size. But I had to look for a while to find some that are the same size as the originals. Since some people reported fender issues on some tires, I looked around and eventually settled on these. They are motorcycle tires the original size as the Kendas. I wasn't sure about the brand? We will see how they do ...

I had them mounted/balanced by my car mechanic. Then laser aligned at the Spyder dealer.

VEE RUBBER Vee Rubber VTR-350 Arachnid Touring 165/55R15 55H Front Motorcycle Street Tire
Size: 165/55R15
SKU: V35003
View attachment 212653

Those Arachnid's are one of the early Kenda Clones - and just like the Kendas, no matter what anyone or any 'made up' label on the sidewall says, they ARE NOT 'Motorcycle' tires - they are lightly constructed CAR tires!

'Real' Motorcycle tires have a completely different design & construction and there's completely different bead profiles on both the tires themselves and the rims they run on, as those tires need to be able to lean to steer/turn and the tread wraps around the profile of the tire a lot more and because of that need to lean, their bead and the rim bead profile need to be significantly different and quite clearly legislated and designed differently to those of car tires/rims. 'Real' car tires, with their flatter tread, don't do that leaning thing, which puts a very different bundle of forces on the tire and their beads, so their beads and the 'J' type rim profile they run on are designed/constructed to handle those forces and in doing so, work to help keep the tread surface as flat as possible on the road in order to do their job, which is somewhat different to that of a motorcycle tire.

 

[GRHorst]

Thanks Peter. I don't doubt what you are saying. But since they say "Motorcycle Tire" on the side, have a rotation direction indicator, and fit, a shop can't complain about you putting on a car tire or improper size.

As far as "to be able to lean" well that would not seem to be a major concern compared with a 2-wheeler. In my previous days as a Goldwing owner, I stuck with motorcycle tires. But I knew plenty of Goldwingers who ran car tires. The Honda shop I dealt with refused to take a test ride on a wing that came in for service with a car tire on the back. I was always concerned about how safe it was to lean into a tight turn with their car tires.

 

[Peter Aawen]

Thanks Peter. I don't doubt what you are saying. But since they say "Motorcycle Tire" on the side, have a rotation direction indicator, and fit, a shop can't complain about you putting on a car tire or improper size.

As far as "to be able to lean" well that would not seem to be a major concern compared with a 2-wheeler. In my previous days as a Goldwing owner, I stuck with motorcycle tires. But I knew plenty of Goldwingers who ran car tires. The Honda shop I dealt with refused to take a test ride on a wing that came in for service with a car tire on the back. I was always concerned about how safe it was to lean into a tight turn with their car tires.

Yeah, I guess...

Buuut... That bit ^ just highlights to me that either the dealer &/or techs are just too scared to do anything but toe the (riduculous, and here in Oz, completely illegal! ) company line of 'Thou shalt not fit anything but OEM parts/tires etc'... OR they have abso-freakin-lutely NO IDEA about the reality, legalities, and practicality of fitting/using tires; and if it was me, I would have nothing more to do with them than is humanly possible; but instead, even if I hadta carry my Spyder to get it away from there, I'd RUN AWAY FROM THEM and never go back/let them touch my Spyder ever again, cos they clearly aren't competent or skilled enough to safely work on MY Spyder!


Just Sayin'

 

[Mikey]

Yeah, I guess...

Buuut... That bit ^ just highlights to me that either the dealer &/or techs are just too scared to do anything but toe the (riduculous, and here in Oz, completely illegal! ) company line of 'Thou shalt not fit anything but OEM parts/tires etc'... OR they have abso-freakin-lutely NO IDEA about the reality, legalities, and practicality of fitting/using tires; and if it was me, I would have nothing more to do with them than is humanly possible; but instead, even if I hadta carry my Spyder to get it away from there, I'd RUN AWAY FROM THEM and never go back/let them touch my Spyder ever again, cos they clearly aren't competent or skilled enough to safely work on MY Spyder!


Just Sayin'

WOW, Peter tell us what you really think!!

 

[bikerbillone]

:agree: X's 10 .... Total HOOEY .... I seriously doubt that a wider tire could physically damage the fender, the space between the tire and SWING ARM & and the DRIVE BELT is what would cause issues long before the fender would .... It's too bad they didn't tell what that tire size was ..... Actually the OEM KENDA's are wider than any car tire that is recommended by members here. ..... I love Vredestein's they are the highest rated tire currently available .... however I discovered the RIKEN RAPTOR HR in 215/6-15 and recommend it over the Vredestein because at tire rack it sells for $ 80.xx which is $ 50.00 less than the Vredestein's, and it's only slightly less performance-wise ....Mike

Missing the Blue Knight's comments. He was 'the go to Spyder Tire Man'

 

[Jackhartjr]

Missing the Blue Knight's comments. He was 'the go to Spyder Tire Man'

You are exactly correct sir!
Missing Mike!

 

[BajaRon]

Those Arachnid's are one of the early Kenda Clones - and just like the Kendas, no matter what anyone or any 'made up' label on the sidewall says, they ARE NOT 'Motorcycle' tires - they are lightly constructed CAR tires!

'Real' Motorcycle tires have a completely different design & construction and there's completely different bead profiles on both the tires themselves and the rims they run on, as those tires need to be able to lean to steer/turn and the tread wraps around the profile of the tire a lot more and because of that need to lean, their bead and the rim bead profile need to be significantly different and quite clearly legislated and designed differently to those of car tires/rims. 'Real' car tires, with their flatter tread, don't do that leaning thing, which puts a very different bundle of forces on the tire and their beads, so their beads and the 'J' type rim profile they run on are designed/constructed to handle those forces and in doing so, work to help keep the tread surface as flat as possible on the road in order to do their job, which is somewhat different to that of a motorcycle tire.

Peter! You're a man after my own heart! But I fear we are a couple of Don Quixotes' tilting at windmills!

May we never give up!

 

[Yowzer]

Peter! You're a man after my own heart! But I fear we are a couple of Don Quixotes' tilting at windmills!

May we never give up!

I read recently that Miguel de Cervantes, the author of Don Quixote, was a Spyder rider.
Food for thought....

 

[GRHorst]

Yeah, I guess...

Buuut... That bit ^ just highlights to me that either the dealer &/or techs are just too scared to do anything but toe the (riduculous, and here in Oz, completely illegal! ) company line of 'Thou shalt not fit anything but OEM parts/tires etc'... OR they have abso-freakin-lutely NO IDEA about the reality, legalities, and practicality of fitting/using tires; and if it was me, I would have nothing more to do with them than is humanly possible; but instead, even if I hadta carry my Spyder to get it away from there, I'd RUN AWAY FROM THEM and never go back/let them touch my Spyder ever again, cos they clearly aren't competent or skilled enough to safely work on MY Spyder!


Just Sayin'

I suppose dealers come in all shapes and sizes, just like people But so far my dealer seems very good (compared with some of the others people have talked about).

 

[Peter Aawen]

I suppose dealers come in all shapes and sizes, just like people But so far my dealer seems very good (compared with some of the others people have talked about).

Even if they have (seemingly... ) been 'very good' to you, for my part, I'd still be quite concerned, cos either they are knowingly outright lying to you in order to push BRP's directive, or they are truly ignorant - and neither bodes well for how they are REALLY treating you &/or your Spyder, does it!! I know I would (and do!) but surely, you hafta ask yourself, "What else are they lying about; or what else are they truly ignorant about?" - Don't you??

Just Sayin'