Spyder RT anti sway bar

[Black Pig]

Top answer, cheers for that.. :clap: :thumbup:

 

[BajaRon]

Steel is steel and has a modulus of elasticity of 30,000,000 psi (29 to 30.5M). High strength steel changes the yield point, or strength, not the spring constant. The lever arm will change the response of the bars as well as the angle of attachment. The RT bar improves stiffness by about 40% over the stock F3 bar (nearly half again stiffer). I personally don't like to get too stiff otherwise one loses the "independent" front suspension.

A 2014 or newer RT bar with the mounting blocks will fit on an F3. A new RT sway bar from BRP was about $65 USD a few years ago. I also installed steel heimlink joints to replace the stock plastic links: they don't look as classy as the billet aluminum ones, but they are functional. I used a 5/16 male and female heimjoint end and adjusted the length to meet the OEM plastic length.

Wayne

Steel is not steel. Otherwise, everything steel would react the same. There are different metallurgical alloys (combination of differing amounts of different elements) which produce different characteristics used for different purposes. Not all steel is spring steel, just to name one difference. And not all spring steel is the same either.

It is not uncommon to find 2 springs of the same diameter which function very differently. Ink pen springs are an easy example. Though they may be of the same diameter with the same number of coils. One may be much easier to compress than another. Some springs will lose their ability to resist compression or extension more easily and fail to return to their original length sooner than others as well.

But the real question here is: Will the OEM RT mod give comparable handling improvement when compared to the BajaRon bar kit? And the answer is no. Though the OEM RT bar mod does produce noticeable improvement. It is not comparable to the improvement you will get from the BajaRon bar. Believe me, if it were anywhere near the same I would quit producing the bar kit for these model Spyders.

There have been a number of F3/RS/RSS/ST customers who started out with the OEM RT bar mod, who have since replaced them with my bar kit. They report a noticeable improvement.

I resist posting replies like this because it comes off as a tacky sales pitch. I am sincere when I say that if the OEM RT bar is the way you want to go, that is absolutely fine with me. It certainly is less expensive and will give you the noticeable improvement others have reported. My only purpose here is to set the record straight so that people can make an informed decision.

And though it is true that you can have a 'Too Stiff' sway bar. In all the years I've been producing these suspension components. I have never received a complaint that my bars were too stiff.

My wish is that each person has all the information necessary so that they are thrilled with whatever they decide to do. It's all about enjoying the ride and the machine and doing it your way. My products are not the only option. They are just another option. hyea:

 

[monkeyboymorton]

The RT bar gets another vote from me. Got one for free from a fellow member whilst on holiday in Florida. Makes a big difference compared to stock.

I didn't feel a need to change the plastic end links - the exact same part is on the RT so if they are good enough for a bike with +25% more weight (passenger factored in) they are fine on my F3 solo.

So if you can find one for next to nothing (from an RT owner who has upgraded) go for it.

I'm not saying the Ron Bar won't be better, I'm sure it is, but it all comes down to a cost-benefit analysis. £0 vs £3-£400 = no brainer!!

Are you a member on the ukspyderweb facebook site? If so put up a message on there and see if any RT owners have one lying around. Might also be worth trying 158 / OHG to see if they've fitted a Ron Bar for someone and have one lying around.

 

[pauly1]

Steel is not steel. Otherwise, everything steel would react the same. There are different metallurgical alloys (combination of differing amounts of different elements) used for different purposes. It is not uncommon to find 2 springs of the same diameter which function very differently. Ink pen springs are an easy example. Though they may be of the same diameter material with similar number of coils. One may be much easier to compress than another. Some springs will lose their ability to resist compression or extension more easily and fail to return to their original length sooner than others as well. ... hyea:

First, I respect that you sell excellent products. However, the spring in steel is an engineering property call Modulus of Elasticity, closely associated with Young's modulus. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elastic_modulus). What changes in high strength steels is the yield stress of the material. Dead soft AISI 1018 cold rolled steel and AISI A2 tool steel hardened to 62 Rc both have the same spring constant. If a material is stressed below their yield stress, it will return to the starting position; if stressed beyond the yield limit, it will take on a permanent set, e.g., bend. Hardened steel, and high strength steel, have higher yield stress than does common steels but they flex at the same spring constant (https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/young-modulus-d_773.htmlZ). The pen springs is an excellent example.

Given the same diameter wire and coil dimensions, the only difference being one is harder or of a high strength steel alloy, they will have similar compression values (wt/unit displacement) until the lower strength material begins to deform. The higher strength material will return to its original length, and furthermore, could have been displaced (compressed) more without damage.

Respectfully,
Wayne

 

[StickerPatch]

Steels..

First, I respect that you sell excellent products. However, the spring in steel is an engineering property call Modulus of Elasticity, closely associated with Young's modulus. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Elastic_modulus). What changes in high strength steels is the yield stress of the material. Dead soft AISI 1018 cold rolled steel and AISI A2 tool steel hardened to 62 Rc both have the same spring constant. If a material is stressed below their yield stress, it will return to the starting position; if stressed beyond the yield limit, it will take on a permanent set, e.g., bend. Hardened steel, and high strength steel, have higher yield stress than does common steels but they flex at the same spring constant (https://www.engineeringtoolbox.com/young-modulus-d_773.htmlZ). The pen springs is an excellent example.

Given the same diameter wire and coil dimensions, the only difference being one is harder or of a high strength steel alloy, they will have similar compression values (wt/unit displacement) until the lower strength material begins to deform. The higher strength material will return to its original length, and furthermore, could have been displaced (compressed) more without damage.

Respectfully,
Wayne

I think the one thing you are missing that Baja Ron mentioned is "alloyed"...you are correct about steel being steel but when you start alloying steel..i.e. mild steel and chrome moly steel you have very different steels..I used to build off road cars and for years the industry felt mild steel was OK..you look now and all you see is chrome moly period..I could take it further but won't..

 

[Black Pig]

Whoa! steady on kids, I didn't want this to turn into a physics debate.

I now know that (A), a post 2013 Rt sway bar is stiffer than the stock F3 and will improve handling.

And (B), the Baja Ron bar is better still, with an even greater degree of improvement to handling.

This is all I needed to know, so I am going to try an RT bar first because I can get one for next to nowt and if I feel the need, I'll shell out the bigger bucks and score one of Ron's bars.

Some great info on here by the way, let's not get into a morass and FWIW, I have bought stuff from Ron before for my RS, so I have no doubts about the quality of gear he vends.