What type of motor oil do you use in your RT?

[billybovine]

Royal Purple automotive oil not allowed by BRP because it meets ASTM SM or SN depending on the grade. Royal purple motorcycle oil specs look good and meets JASO MA2 clutch slippage test requirements.

Mobil 1 motorcycle oil not allowed by BRP because it meets ASTM SM. It only specifies that it meets JASO MA so it can be assumed that it only meets the JASO MA1 clutch slippage test requirements.

 

[major911]

:yes: been using the Amsoil motorcycle 10W 40. Everything, engine, shifting, etc. seem to run smoother. Go for it. :yes:

Would this also be a good choice for an RSS as well?

 

[mick ruhdorf]

choice?

havent got much choice in OZ no amsol no royal purple choices are: mobil , castrol , vaulvoline or penrite im going to use castrol power1 racing fully synth

cheers mick

 

[MarkLawson]

I use the BRP full synthetic so I don't have to worry about it.

 

[Sarge707]

I use the BRP full synthetic so I don't have to worry about it.

When I do get The RT sm5 I will buy the gallon of BRP Synthetic and filter from the dealer until the Warranty is up so I have proof of
Dealer Purchase. Amsoil for the SE5 09GS!

 

[billybovine]

Specs look good

havent got much choice in OZ no amsol no royal purple choices are: mobil , castrol , vaulvoline or penrite im going to use castrol power1 racing fully synth

cheers mick

Specs look good for Castrol.

 

[Dudley]

Royal Purple automotive oil not allowed by BRP because it meets ASTM SM or SN depending on the grade. Royal purple motorcycle oil specs look good and meets JASO MA2 clutch slippage test requirements.

Mobil 1 motorcycle oil not allowed by BRP because it meets ASTM SM. It only specifies that it meets JASO MA so it can be assumed that it only meets the JASO MA1 clutch slippage test requirements.

The question was what oil do we use. If you call Royal Purple and ask to speak to a rep he will tell you that RP doesn't use the same formula as other oils for their automotive oil. When I traded in the 2008 SE5 after 40,000 miles of using RP the tech told me that when checking the valve clearance they were all in within tolerance. That was the first time they were ever checked. And besides, what issues can the oil have on any other part of your Spyder? Only the engine. The only difference between the automotive and motorcycle oil that RP sells is the additional additives added to the M/C oil for use in air cooled engines. So, I will continue to use RP and believe in it, just like others will continue to use and believe in whatever oil they use.

 

[BajaRon]

The question was what oil do we use. If you call Royal Purple and ask to speak to a rep he will tell you that RP doesn't use the same formula as other oils for their automotive oil. When I traded in the 2008 SE5 after 40,000 miles of using RP the tech told me that when checking the valve clearance they were all in within tolerance. That was the first time they were ever checked. And besides, what issues can the oil have on any other part of your Spyder? Only the engine. The only difference between the automotive and motorcycle oil that RP sells is the additional additives added to the M/C oil for use in air cooled engines. So, I will continue to use RP and believe in it, just like others will continue to use and believe in whatever oil they use.

You're a great guy Dudley and I'm sure RP is a fine oil. It is one of the few True Synthetic oils on the market. But you're off a bit here.

No one takes their automotive oil and just puts more additives in and call it MC oil. At least I hope not as that is not going to work at all. Instead, what they MAY do is take the same base oil but add a completly different set of modifiers depending on the application. Friction Modifiers are added to automotive oils which gives them the SL or SM rating. This is exactly why BRP does not recommend these oils. They work fine in a car but are going to be big trouble in your Spyder.

Among other things, friction modifiers will cause your wet clutch to slip. Not good. You can't get rid of the Friction Modifier effect by simply adding additional chemicals. Plus the fact that good additives are expensive, the oil companies aren't going to put them in if they are not needed.

To get the MA-1 or MA-2 rating for wet clutch application a different additive package is required. You also need additives to address the issue of MC oil taking on the job of lubricating the transmission, which automotive oils do not have to deal with. Transmissions are much harder on oil, in some respects, than engines.

True synthetic oils, like Amsoil and RP, use a completely different base oil which requires much less in the way of additives or modifiers. In great part it is the additives and modifiers in Mineral Based 'Synthetic' oil that breaks down leaving your engine unprotected. That is why true synthetic oils last longer then mineral based 'synthetic' oil.

I know for a lot of people all of this is just mumbo-jumbo. Some understandably throw up their hands and say; "I'll go with what the manufacturer recommends". And this will work, of course. But for those who what to know more about what they are buying, how it works and what the true advantages/disadvantages are, the information is available to make a more informed decision on which oil you use.

 

[Bob Denman]

:firstplace: Another thoughtful, concise and understandable explanation! :clap: :bowdown:
Thanks Ron! :thumbup:

 

[Sarge707]

You're a great guy Dudley and I'm sure RP is a fine oil. It is one of the few True Synthetic oils on the market. But you're off a bit here.

No one takes their automotive oil and just puts more additives in and call it MC oil. At least I hope not as that is not going to work at all. Instead, what they MAY do is take the same base oil but add a completly different set of modifiers depending on the application. Friction Modifiers are added to automotive oils which gives them the SL or SM rating. This is exactly why BRP does not recommend these oils. They work fine in a car but are going to be big trouble in your Spyder.

Among other things, friction modifiers will cause your wet clutch to slip. Not good. You can't get rid of the Friction Modifier effect by simply adding additional chemicals. Plus the fact that good additives are expensive, the oil companies aren't going to put them in if they are not needed.

To get the MA-1 or MA-2 rating for wet clutch application a different additive package is required. You also need additives to address the issue of MC oil taking on the job of lubricating the transmission, which automotive oils do not have to deal with. Transmissions are much harder on oil, in some respects, than engines.

True synthetic oils, like Amsoil and RP, use a completely different base oil which requires much less in the way of additives or modifiers. In great part it is the additives and modifiers in Mineral Based 'Synthetic' oil that breaks down leaving your engine unprotected. That is why true synthetic oils last longer then mineral based 'synthetic' oil.

I know for a lot of people all of this is just mumbo-jumbo. Some understandably throw up their hands and say; "I'll go with what the manufacturer recommends". And this will work, of course. But for those who what to know more about what they are buying, how it works and what the true advantages/disadvantages are, the information is available to make a more informed decision on which oil you use.

How would you rate the BRP Synthetic? Is it just repackaged Castrol RS 4T Syn? The castrol is MA2.

 

[BajaRon]

How would you rate the BRP Synthetic? Is it just repackaged Castrol RS 4T Syn? The castrol is MA2.

BRP oil is indeed, repackaged Castrol products (though this can change at any time).

The real debate, which I'm pretty sure will never be resolved, is whether a mineral based oil (Group III) highly modified with additives should be called 'Full Synthetic' just like products using Group IV true synthetic base oil.

The whole thing started in the late 90's when Castol Syntec, Full Synthetic (which used true synthetic, Group IV base oil) switched to a mineral base (Group III) with a lot of additives.

Mobil 1 sued Castrol asserting that since they were no longer using a true synthetic Group IV base oil, they could no longer call it 'Full Synthetic'. But to everyone's surprise, Castrol won the court case (how much do judges know about oil?)

Since mineral oil base (Group III) cost about 1/2 as much as true synthetic Group IV, almost every motor oil manufacturer switched their 'Synthetic' oils to the new standard using Group III mineral base oil with additives. The additives are expensive but are relatively small in volume. Additives also vary in quality and cost. Over all, the end product is much less expensive to produce using Group III base.

Personally I feel it is consumer fraud since the average person has no idea that there are 2 very different standards, both labeled 'Full Synthetic'. But you have to hand it to Castrol, they got the job done where it counts, in court.

Don't get me wrong, Castrol makes a quality product and I personally have used Castrol in my vehicles at times. I blame the court for this identity chrisis. But the facts of this consumer deception, if that's what you want to call it, are not lost to those in the marketing or accounting offices.

 

[billybovine]

I knew you could not stay out of this one Ron.

Dudley, you can use any type oil you like, that is up to you. I felt that had to point out that some types oil are not recommended by BRP, specifically those that specify meeting API ASTM rating of SM because it will cause clutch damage. This is so people reading this thread can make a more informed choice of oil. Royal Purple have reputation for making high quality products and I would not have any issue using any of their products for the correct application. I strongly feel that Royal Purple's motorcycle would be a better choice.

 

[BajaRon]

I knew you could not stay out of this one Ron.

Hmmm.... Well, I did try!

Dudley, you can use any type oil you like, that is up to you. I felt that had to point out that some types oil are not recommended by BRP, specifically those that specify meeting API ASTM rating of SM because it will cause clutch damage. This is so people reading this thread can make a more informed choice of oil. Royal Purple have reputation for making high quality products and I would not have any issue using any of their products for the correct application. I strongly feel that Royal Purple's motorcycle would be a better choice.

Though I have never used it Royal Purple is a good product, as far as I know, and a true synthetic. I hope it didn't sound like I was bashing Dudley (NEVER!) or RP. Just trying to set the record straight, if that is even possible! :yikes:

 

[Charlie329]

Specs look good for Castrol.

View attachment 53619

:agree: I agree with the Castrol comment. My initial oil change was done at my dealer, presumably using BRP oil. Whatever that product is, my bike used it up almost as fast as gas! :joke: Not really, but with no leaks and no burning, it was disappearing so fast that I would have to add oil every few hundred miles. After exhaustive research on thisnojoke, especially within the MANY, MANY threads here on Syderlovers (this topic has been discussed to death:bdh, I found that there are almost as many opinions as threads! As for me, I finally settled on Castrol Power RS Racing 4T, 10W40 full-synthentic (although as BajaRon previously mentioned, this may not actually be a full-syn). I chose the Castrol because it was one of very few oils I found that meet API SL & JASO MA-2 (so there should be no whining from BRP), it's readily available at local stores, and it's relatively inexpensive (~$9/qt).

 

[Dudley]

I can only go on my experience with the RP oil and what the RP tech told me. He said that the only difference between RP M/C oil and the RP automotive oil is that the M/C oil is formulated for air cooled engines and costs more. He said that a wet clutch liquid cooled engine on a motorcycle can use the automotive oil without any transmission issues. I would encourage anyone interested in exploring this farther to contact RP and discuss the more technical questions with them. I DO NOT encourage anyone to do what I have done because if anything "goes South" I don't want to be blamed. I just answered the question about what oil I used.

By as other oils I meant as other oils manufactured by other oil companies, not as other oils by RP.

 

[liketoride2]

I use Valvoline 10-40 4T full synthetic motorcycle oil for both my Spyder and other cycles. It is specifically formulated for motorcycles with wet clutches, is manufactured by a company with a very long experience making quality motor vehicle lubricants, and is readily available (Walmart, Autozone, etc.) at a reasonable price. I think it's doubtful if any oil is superior, but's that just my non-expert opinion.

Mike
Idaho
www.rtwrider.net