What do you guys think of these pictures?

[Flanker]

Been on the Dragon before so here are my observations:

First off; you cannot really diagnose as much as you might think from a still-photo; however I will try.

The leg extension is intended to add extra weight to the outside of the corner in the attempt to reduce wheel-lift (when the Nanny kicks-in); thus improving their speed in the corner.

Keeping one's foot near the brake pedal is necessary when skill is absent. In other words, those that are physically fit, and know their machines can move their foot away from the brake pedal as demonstrated in the photos, because they have set themselves up properly with the vehicle (in their minds).

Lastly... I didn't see anything terribly wrong with any of the positioning in the photos, given that is was a snapshot (split-second) in time. Many times, when safe, you may cross or touch the "lines" if that helps in establishing your "line" into a corner... and apparently these riders where trying their best to do the run as fast as it allowed.

Just my two-cents...

I haven't been on the dragon, but I heartily second the rest, and add that's not much of a lean by sport bike standards (even at speed).

 

[daveinva]

A few items:

-- My vote goes to he's showing off. Everybody does it for the Dragon camera guys, stock practice.

-- Crossing the double-yellow at speed is a no-no in 99.9% of situations (i.e., emergency maneuvers excepted). Just don't do it, it's a bad habit that erases your margin for safety, and only needs to fail once for you and your loved ones to have a really bad day.

-- At speed, i.e. above parking lot speeds, your body weight is almost certainly meaningless to the Spyder. Shifting your weight to the inside does little to keep the wheel of the Spyder to the ground-- if it wants to come up, physics is going to force it to come up. Shifting your weight in this sense is better than NOT shifting your weight, but it's not a large contributor to keeping the Spyder planted at twisties speed (definitely in slow-speed cornering, though).

What shifting your weight to the inside *does* do is keep yourself balanced atop a vehicle that's trying to fling you off of it. It makes it easier to control the bike in the corners, and proper steering, throttle and braking can keep you planted in the corners.

-- Which leads me to my only gripe about having a footbrake versus a handbrake: again, I think the guy here is showing off for the camera, but that situation is a real-life one for anyone taking a Spyder into a sharp left turn. :shocked: More than once I've had to cool my speeds in lefts because I knew there was no way I was going to reach the brake hanging off all drunken-monkey style to the inside. A handbrake solves that problem, and would probably help any Spyder perform better in the twisties as a result.

-- Visit the Dragon on weekday mornings, just after dawn, and you'll never see a soul, let alone any weekend warriors who don't know how to ride. Keep an eye out for deer, and have fun! :doorag:

 

[bruiser]

The owners manual says to lean to the inside of a curve. Which is what this gentleman is doing, albeit somewhat exaggerated. Like others, I tend to hang cheek in a turn as well. I also put my weight on the pegs, this helps keep me in the saddle. I think someone else mentioned riding styles. Most of us have our own style. I have to blow my own horn here and say I was complemented by a gentleman and his wife on the "Veterans Ride" at Spyderfest this year about my riding style on the "twisties". I have ridden the Dragon. I wasn't really impressed that much and actually prefer the Rattler. Commenting on the lean of the sport bike, every one that I saw on the Dragon and in Dragon videos is doing that lean. IMHO, that's inherent of a sport bike rider. Doing that lean on a cruiser will probably result in one of two things, scrapping the heck out of the pegs or scrapping the heck out of your skin. Or both. Finally, I really don't see anything wrong with the way he (RS rider) is riding. He's having fun, and that's what riding a Spyder is all about. Can I get an amen??

 

[Yazz]

The owners manual says to lean to the inside of a curve. Which is what this gentleman is doing, albeit somewhat exaggerated. Like others, I tend to hang cheek in a turn as well. I also put my weight on the pegs, this helps keep me in the saddle. I think someone else mentioned riding styles. Most of us have our own style. I have to blow my own horn here and say I was complemented by a gentleman and his wife on the "Veterans Ride" at Spyderfest this year about my riding style on the "twisties". I have ridden the Dragon. I wasn't really impressed that much and actually prefer the Rattler. Commenting on the lean of the sport bike, every one that I saw on the Dragon and in Dragon videos is doing that lean. IMHO, that's inherent of a sport bike rider. Doing that lean on a cruiser will probably result in one of two things, scrapping the heck out of the pegs or scrapping the heck out of your skin. Or both. Finally, I really don't see anything wrong with the way he (RS rider) is riding. He's having fun, and that's what riding a Spyder is all about. Can I get an amen??

Amen! (This said by a drunk-monkey rider...)

 

[jerpinoy]

Lets have fun on our :spyder2: not on hospital bed and justifying the stupidness.

 

[daltmeyer]

Wut? The speed limit is 15? When I was there in July it was 35 I think.

 

[blambert]

I have never been on the dragon but if you want some twisters come to AZ and ride the devils highway route 666. Runs along the AZ NM border. On my RS I come in hard get out at a 45 degree angle on the bike and I am always looking at the end of the turn as I enter the turn - never looking down. I have a ICSI hand brake so I can get of the right peg when I need to but never brake in a curve unless emergency. Hit the apex and punch the gas the torque on the rear tire gives you grip from the apex to out of the curve and the prepare hard going into the next curve. I find it similar to skiing a mogul run on a ski slope.

 

[rabtech]

The dragon is a blast. However it will bite you. Most of the dragon is in Tennessee. The North Carolina side has just a couple of miles of the actual 11.
I have the scratches to prove it. And I never crossed the center line.:joke:

 

[Bob Denman]

...And if the Dragon can dump a "Duck"; what do you think it can do to someone that's not set up real well for the twisties?? :yikes:

 

[Barlock]

“Aerodynamically the bumblebee shouldn't be able to fly, but the bumblebee doesn't know that, so it goes on flying anyway.” ~ Mary Kay Ash

 

[Desert Spyder]

Wut? The speed limit is 15? When I was there in July it was 35 I think.

I was quoting the ryder in the pictures.

 

[WackyDan]

He is leg up and foot off the brake in order to showboat for the camera... Many riders do it. Doesn't make it safe to do, but if you want to have a neat shot go for it. I prefer to have pictures of myself actually riding hard then showboating.

 

[Desert Spyder]

This isn't the Dragon, its somewhere in Europe, I think. I'm not a pro and I am sure the VSS may have been altered on this. I hear this is pretty easy in a parking lot vs. not.

 

[Spyder Tony]

-- At speed, i.e. above parking lot speeds, your body weight is almost certainly meaningless to the Spyder. Shifting your weight to the inside does little to keep the wheel of the Spyder to the ground-- if it wants to come up, physics is going to force it to come up. Shifting your weight in this sense is better than NOT shifting your weight, but it's not a large contributor to keeping the Spyder planted at twisties speed (definitely in slow-speed cornering, though).

What shifting your weight to the inside *does* do is keep yourself balanced atop a vehicle that's trying to fling you off of it. It makes it easier to control the bike in the corners, and proper steering, throttle and braking can keep you planted in the corners.

I respectfully disagree. Mathematics would disprove this with the equation on how Mass & velocity affect Centrifugal force...F=ma (Force equals Mass times Acceleration). For Example...it would require you to exert less force to swing a golf ball suspended on a string in a circular motion than it would to swing a bowling ball suspended on a string in a circular motion...because the bowling ball has more mass (weighs more).
I have a GS and an ST and both machines benefit from my leaning in twisties at high speeds. Simply put...I have tried both leaning & not leaning, or leaning very little. My experience has been that the more pronounced my lean, the greater speed I can take the turn in the twisties. I agree that it also has an added benefit of keeping the rider in the seat rather than succumb to the centrifugal force...but when my lean is less pronounced, the Nanny is much quicker to intervene and slow things down. My lean is much more pronounced than the lean depicted in the photos...but my leg (Knee specifically) is firmly planted on the Spyder body holding me in place, not hanging out.

 

[Desert Spyder]

I respectfully disagree. Mathematics would disprove this with the equation on how Mass & velocity affect Centrifugal force...F=ma (Force equals Mass times Acceleration). For Example...it would require you to exert less force to swing a golf ball suspended on a string in a circular motion than it would to swing a bowling ball suspended on a string in a circular motion...because the bowling ball has more mass (weighs more).
I have a GS and an ST and both machines benefit from my leaning in twisties at high speeds. Simply put...I have tried both leaning & not leaning, or leaning very little. My experience has been that the more pronounced my lean, the greater speed I can take the turn in the twisties. I agree that it also has an added benefit of keeping the rider in the seat rather than succumb to the centrifugal force...but when my lean is less pronounced, the Nanny is much quicker to intervene and slow things down. My lean is much more pronounced than the lean depicted in the photos...but my leg (Knee specifically) is firmly planted on the Spyder body holding me in place, not hanging out.

Tony, what about going downhill vs uphill? What does physics say about that? I don't know why but I can go around a corner in the twisties at say 35 mph and I feel more in control going uphill than down at the same speed, and I don't know why.

BTW, I tried holding my leg out today rounding a corner. My hip cramps up. You have to be in shape to do the hokey pokey apparently.

 

[Spyder Tony]

Tony, what about going downhill vs uphill? What does physics say about that? I don't know why but I can go around a corner in the twisties at say 35 mph and I feel more in control going uphill than down at the same speed, and I don't know why.

BTW, I tried holding my leg out today rounding a corner. My hip cramps up. You have to be in shape to do the hokey pokey apparently.

I confess that I don't know about the physics of going uphill vs downhill although I suspect that inertia would play a factor on downhill force...this is strictly conjecture, however.

As far as the hokey pokey part, that was just plumb funny!!!

 

[Bob Denman]

This is tarting to sound a lot like Math Class again... :shocked:

 

[Silvervette05]

I've been on the tail of the dragon in my 95 vette, a may try it with my 08 rs

 

[Dan_Ashley]

I confess that I don't know about the physics of going uphill vs downhill although I suspect that inertia would play a factor on downhill force...this is strictly conjecture, however.

As far as the hokey pokey part, that was just plumb funny!!!

I am fairly confident that given a 600 pound to 950 pound machine plus rider, that most uphill vs downhill forces would become nearly unnoticed, if that were the only difference. What I think may make a difference is the camber of downhill twisting roadways. The camber of the same roadway could merely be the inverse of the other direction. But inside turns are tighter than outside turns. Camber during design would probably be an average of some sort of the two turns at expected speed. Normalizing an engineering statement to handle all these variables could be quite challenging.