rjinaz86323
Active member
With the 225 60 my Spyder speedometer matches my GPS speed.
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Tires.... discussing tread types & patterns.
- Thread starter BajaRon
- Start date
bigbadbrucie
New member
Don’t know if this still holds true, but a number of years ago my NEW THEN GPS came with a notice that it could be out by up tp 10% depending on the number of satellites it was able to connect with. Still true, or.....? Of course there is also the fact that “as your tire wears”, its rolling distance changes, hence your speedo accuracy changes. just my thoughts on this subject. Mike has forgotten way more on this subject than I’ve ever learned, so listen to the experts.
K80Shooter
New member
About 3 mph.
Jetfixer
Well-known member
For those interested in comparing stock sizes to other available sizes, here's a very handy calculator that will give you a graphical depiction of the differences and describe all the changes. (such as speedo change).
http://www.tire-size-calculator.info/
http://www.tire-size-calculator.info/
IdahoMtnSpyder
Active member
MarkN
Member
I have read this thread with great interest and appreciate everyone’s comments. Tire pressures have been commented on. Everything I’ve read says to run the pressures on the frame tag which would be for the stock tires. My question is, with the stiffer sidewall construction of car tires, what would be a good starting point for pressures?
I thought I read some where that the 225 60 15 would put the tire very close to the front of the swing arm on a 2020 RTL is this right?? That's why the 215 60 15 was the one to use because of the outside diameter of the tire and also it raised the back of the spyder up higher because the air adjustment went off swing arm not true height of rear of bike say back fender from ground. Lots of good info THANKS. TO EVERYONE
That was only on your Spyder K80, and the variation may not be the same on anyone else's Spyder or vehicle! :shocked: The variation can be & quite likely IS different for each different machine, altho because the gauges are all made basically the same way, some errors may be juust something vaguely similar; others may be very close to yours; but just as equally, there's very likely some out there that are waaayyy off that 3mph error you were lucky enough to get!! So please, be aware that while your error might be close to someone else's, THE ERROR CAN BE DIFFERENT FOR EACH MACHINE &/OR GAUGE! :lecturef_smilie:
For example, when it was new, the 'error' on my 2013 RT on stock tires at the tire placard pressures & an indicated 100 kmh was 13 kmh, or pretty close to 8mph (it's since been calibrated to be accurate with the tires I'm currently running & recently checked/confirmed!
) but the error on the 2010 RT I test rode a year or so earlier than that was only 7 kmh at 100 kmh or about 4.3 mph; and the error on an F3 (IIRC, a 2015 or so?!?) I looked at a 6-8 weeks or so ago was only 3 kmh or just under 2 mph.... and I've recently been talking to the owner of a brand new RT who's worked out that his speedo error is 14 kmh at 100kmh or about 8.7 mph, altho I'm not sure how he arrived at that or what tire pressure he was running, etc.... 
The point is, the error that YOUR Spyder's speedo (or odo/trip meter - and btw, that error isn't necessarily the same as the speedo error, it can be a different error!
) shows on stock tires etc MAY NOT be the same error evident on anyone else's Spyder - you really need to check each gauge & the speed & distance travelled readings individually! Short of spending a fair whack of money to get your speed/odo individually calibrated to a given, better accuracy by a calibration authority or company, the easiest way that most people will readily have access to in order to work out their machine's individual error is by comparing the indicated speed on their speedo with the actual speed displayed by a good quality GPS that polls at least 8 satellites or so using a reading taken on a straight & level road with no or few overhead/surrounding obstructions like hills, trees, buildings etc. Any of those GPS based 'street navigators' or smartphones that don't use/poll at least that many satelites to arrive at their 'speed' reading or distance travelled may not be accurate enough or responsive enough to reveal a truely useful error reading; and those radar speed display things or road mile markers that you see on the side of the road or hanging off bridges etc rarely are useful because of the inherent difficulties in reading both at the same time, altho they MIGHT be accurate enough to give you some idea if you can read both that quickly; but just as equally, they MIGHT NOT even be in the ballpark of reality &/or timing! :banghead:But whatever error YOU get on your machine is rarely ever truely useful as anything except a vague indicator or a WAG for anyone else/their machine! :gaah:
Just Sayin' :thumbup:
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IdahoMtnSpyder
Active member
On the other hand, Peter, the 3 mph number has pretty much been the only number I recall seeing quoted here on the forum. I was going to say 3 mph but K80 beat me to it! But your comment is true. One person's error is no guarantee the next person's error will be the same.
BLUEKNIGHT911
Sadly Passed Oct 2024 - RIP
Both Peter and I suggest 15 to 17 psi for both front and rear will give the best ride .... Add a lb. or two if you ride aggressive or the weight of the driver / passenger & gear is over 350 lbs. .... this is for AUTO tires only..... Mike :thumbup:
BLUEKNIGHT911
Sadly Passed Oct 2024 - RIP
Well according to other members here who use that size it will fit, but Yes it is closer to the swing arm ..... I doubt that the slightly larger circumference is an issue with ride height .... it just isn't enough to matter ..... Mike :thumbup:
lvmyspyder
New member
Evening and thank you for everyone for weighing in on this. Bought the 225 60 15 from Tire Rack initially. As long as I have an order in for the 215 60 15, which I put in today, they will cover the shipping back and issue a full refund - which I thought was pretty awesome of them. I really appreciated the input on this thread and the information shared. I learned new things and our conversations made me think long and hard about which way I was going to go with this. Regardless of that, you all made me think of things I had not considered. Of course what we do to our bikes is personal, however, I have learned that one can learn a lot by listening and being open to what others are teaching. Appreciate the forum, the opportunity to bat things around and get enough information to make an informed decision. Thank you.
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lvmyspyder
New member
PMK
Active member
Agree that typically, to have a longer lasting or higher mileage life, the tire is a firmer rubber compound that has reduced grip when compared to a performance tire that often utilizes a softer rubber compound.
In an effort to minimize another Bancation, I will simply politely disagree with your opinions about summer tires, the 70*f temp you mentioned as critical is new to me and not a temp I have seen published by a tire manufacturer or anyone for that matter, but will say that your referencing 40*f mimics the temperature Yokohama stated as the minimum for Summer High Performance tires.
After the previous topic regarding touring tires vs high performance tires, I enjoyed a lunchtime conversation with my friend, discussing Spyders and in particular Spyder tires, he shared his opinion with me. Understand that his experience as both an IMSA and Indycar driver and team owner allows him to offer a different perspective regarding tire performance and grip than most other drivers. Our conversation took place after my recent posts regarding comparing more equally touring tires vs performance tires. He did comment, as did BajaRon, typically a quality tire offering more grip, will run a softer compound and obtain less wear mileage before worn out.
His other statement regarding why touring tires are adequate on Spyders vs aiming for increased performance from high performance tires, the Spyder simply does not need high performance tires. In short, and I do agree with him, the Spyder, especially the chassis lacks the ability to require anything more than touring tires. High performance tires can be run, but the chassis itself can not fully appreciate the added grip. He also commented that regardless of how much improved grip, whether substantial or a fraction of a difference, the high performance tires will provide increased grip, but again, the Spyder chassis is more likely the limiting factor.
His comments to me were interesting. Interesting in that yes our Spyder rolls on high performance front tires and summer high performance rear tire. Having adequate grip has never been an issue. I do run 20 psi in all three tires, finding that less in the fronts offers up the feeling of the outside front tire tire trying to tuck under the rim. The rear tends to wag about at less than 20 psi. What his comment had me considering is that for years, if ridden through corners, at cornering forces within the tires ability, the Spyder RT swingarm, long in length, and made from mild steel can be felt flexing. The front A arms can be witnessed flexing under braking, so very likely flex while cornering, and the frame, not being multi dimensional or braced, no doubt is winding up on the longitudinal axis. I support my opinion regarding the 2019 and prior RT series chassis lacking rigidity, on account that when Can Am introduced the F3 series in 2015, it arrived with a rear swingarm that is trussed, and a frame with bolt on braces / stiffeners. In summary, the F3, being a much lighter vehicle, with a lower CG apparently required these chassis improvements.
With all that said, it might suggest, that most decent touring tires, provided they retain grip until well worn, are fully adequate based on the performance level the Spyder chassis can provide. Yes, higher performance tires can be installed and run, will provide more grip, but very unlikely be fully utilized to the tires limit.
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BLUEKNIGHT911
Sadly Passed Oct 2024 - RIP
In regards to your post #37, ( above ) having input from someone knowledgeable about actual racing is very valuable. ...... The next time you are discussing this with them ask how many of these race cars have traction systems that are controlled ( and limited ) by Computers - like our Spyders are. I suspect they will say NONE. The Spyders are more limited by those systems than any structural limitations. The traction supplied by " all season " tires easily exceeds the limit the computers are designed with...... Mike :thumbup:
PMK
Active member
Mike, I agree fully, all Spyders, unless modified are detuned from the factory both in engine output and chassis electronics for reasons deemed by BRP. As I conveyed in my post, structurally, the Spyder RT chassis is very soft. On our machine, having performance suspension items on it, these added items lessen involvement from the onboard computers. Even the most evasive actions never trigger a nanny light. Now if I ride a tight apex and bump the inside tire over an edge, then yes, the nanny gets confused expecting a rollover.
The increased grip from tires prevents wheel spin, skidding a tire, understeer or oversteer. (All assuming dry traction) Regarding the the vehicle attitude sensors, our modified Spyder, compared to a stock Spyder retains a very, very flat attitude during direction changes or cornering. All things considered, I still believe the soft chassis becomes the limiting factor in several ways. Tires, whether high end touring tires, middle range touring tires, or performance tires are not the Spyders limiting factor. On our Spyder, the computers are not a limiting factor either.
Lunch yesterday, I explained my intentions for altering the Spyders front roll center. We discussed this, plus bump steer and more. He laughed when I explained how poorly designed the Spyders steering system is, and how the front suspension does the worst thing when compressed, it toes out. So at the times when stability is desired, cornering and under hard braking, the outside wheel, or bo th wheels toe out, which is bad. A flexy chassis, with steering that bump steer toes out, is not a good thing performance handling wise. I have the tooling and skills to measure bump steer toe out, but decided it best that I should not know.
lvmyspyder
New member
The blinders come off the more we discuss this topic, which I for one greatly appreciate. The older I get the, more value I get from listening to others perspective and experience. As well, the more I understand about variables, cause and effect and so how things are very intertwined relating specifically to function and capability. For example, never thought of the the chassis being a limitation when evaluating tire choices. I only know one thing for certain, although somewhat limited, thank goodness we have other choices and are not stuck with OEM Kenda tires, which if you will forgive me are quite literally the worst tire that can be run on these fine bikes, which is again, only this man's option and two cents and likely worth about half of that...
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