Tire hell sorry

[2dogs]

Two issues with you comments:

1. I would like to know where your information comes from that says that there is a quality problem with these tires. You need to review what the actual definition of "quality" is. It has nothing to do with expectations of the general public or even of the public likes the product. Strange but true.

2. You are claiming that the carcass is substandard or less than exactly what it is supposed to be. I am guessing but I would expect that this tire is exactly what BRP specified and asked for. If not, Kenda would have to do a lot of explaining to BRP and the tire would have changed within a few inventory cycles.

It all comes down to taking the lowest bid price and that can change by adjusted specs. BRP is very well known for installing crappy parts on their lovely trikes. Compressors, tires, sensors, hoses and so on and so on. If you don't think so you haven't been paying much attention to this web site. Along with all the complaints and problems there are a lot of good folks here offering solutions and cost effective remedies to BRP's crappy parts issues. You ask where your information comes from regarding the quality problem here, the proof lies in the purchase; and it is the general public that passes judgment on an item whether it's a quality item or not. Who else would have the final say?

 

[ARtraveler]

I see that I have not replied to this particular thread from 2014.

Tires are a good subject. They come up from time to time. Everyone has a comment. Both experienced riders and new riders.

Well known that most users of the Kenda (also known as Krapenda) prefer something else. The controversy is over the use of "other" tires. BRP says use ONLY OEM--because they are designed specifically for the :f_spider:. Many dealers enforce this policy.

Riders of GW have experienced the same. Many, use "other" tires than recommended. Has there ever been a law suit claiming that "other" tires were the fault of accident X--with either BRP or Honda? Not that I am aware of. It's your money. It's your choice.

That said--I have five different :spyder2:'s over the years. Have racked up almost 140,000 assorted miles--and have installed several tires in the process. My dealer is one of "those." OEM or nothing.

My track record. On all :ani29:'s. Fronts last me around 20K miles. Rear tires last me 15K plus miles. One exception--2014 RT. They came with a "new" rubber compound. My OEM's rear tires lasted 8,900 miles. Others got as few as 4K miles or so. They brought back the "original" compound and I now have 19K on the current rear. Probably going to change it out in the spring.

That's my story--and I am sticking to it. :yes::yes:

 

[jaherbst]

Mostly because BRP does not install motorcycle tires on the Spyder. So we look for the best performing tires that are appropriate for the rims and vehicle use. The Spyder is not a motorcycle when it comes to tires and does not come equipped with tires having motorcycle profile beads. They come with automotive profile tires with SAE profile beads. Motorcycle tires will not fit the Spyder rims well at all and would be dangerous.

We be talking compound here nothing else. Softer rubber with a better grip than a car tire. Mainly due to the small amount of weight on Spyder and

motorcycle tires. Simple i.e. tire mileage or safety.

Not sure about you but my Spyders are registered as a motorcycle as required by state law. I believe it is the same in all states.

Jack

 

[Peteoz]

Quite happy with the "Kenda's". All four have been great and perform just like a "motorcycle" tire

Jack

So you have 4 Kenda tyres on your Spyder, Jack? That probably explains why you are so happy with them hyea:

Pete

 

[Roadster Renovations]

Kendras are junk. Plain and simple. A car tire will give much better protection from road debris, potholes, etc.. The stiffer sidewall will help the tire to wear evenly. The kendras on the rear wear out in the center because they are so soft they balloon at high speed so only the center wears. The front tires do not hold their balance and I could not believe how much smoother with Federals on the front. I will never go back to kendras. Now that my wife is ryding by herself, she will have the safest advantage I can give her.
We replaced the RT's rear tire (kendra) at 6,000 miles. We replaced it with a Michelin Hydroedge. We now have 48,000 on the RT and are still running the Hydroedge. That's right 42,000 miles and still going strong.
Since tires are a wearable item, BRP does not want a long lasting tire. They can say what they want, but the dealers make good money on selling kendras and mounting and balancing them.

And if anyone is interrested, I have a pair of kendra take offs from my Daytona with about 5,000 miles on them. Make me an offer.....:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:

 

[jaherbst]

So you have 4 Kenda tyres on your Spyder, Jack? That probably explains why you are so happy with them hyea:

Pete

I carry a couple in the Frunk and tie extras to my pillion. Can't have to many Kendas! TWASFQ

Jack

 

[jaherbst]

Kendras are junk. Plain and simple. A car tire will give much better protection from road debris, potholes, etc.. The stiffer sidewall will help the tire to wear evenly. The kendras on the rear wear out in the center because they are so soft they balloon at high speed so only the center wears. The front tires do not hold their balance and I could not believe how much smoother with Federals on the front. I will never go back to kendras. Now that my wife is ryding by herself, she will have the safest advantage I can give her.
We replaced the RT's rear tire (kendra) at 6,000 miles. We replaced it with a Michelin Hydroedge. We now have 48,000 on the RT and are still running the Hydroedge. That's right 42,000 miles and still going strong.
Since tires are a wearable item, BRP does not want a long lasting tire. They can say what they want, but the dealers make good money on selling kendras and mounting and balancing them.

And if anyone is interrested, I have a pair of kendra take offs from my Daytona with about 5,000 miles on them. Make me an offer.....:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:

Good Luck with those Michelin Hydroplanes!

Jack

 

[Roadster Renovations]

Good Luck with those Michelin Hydroplanes!

Jack

Jack, we have 42K on them. Never have had a problem. Not one.

 

[jaherbst]

So you have 4 Kenda tyres on your Spyder, Jack? That probably explains why you are so happy with them hyea:

Pete[/QUOT
?

What would you Aussie's know about tires anyway? Being underneath the Planet you have to run your tires upside down. Right? :joke:

​Jack

 

[Peteoz]

What would you Aussie's know about tires anyway? Being underneath the Planet you have to run your tires upside down. Right? :joke:
​Jack

It gives a new meaning to having a death grip on the bars, Jack.....no one wants to fall off:yikes:

Pete

 

[rcturner]

You ask where your information comes from regarding the quality problem here, the proof lies in the purchase; and it is the general public that passes judgment on an item whether it's a quality item or not. Who else would have the final say?

You are talking about perceived quality. The quality of a product is a very simple measure that has nothing to do with what the public thinks. Quality is not the ability of a product to meet it's performance requirements, it is a measure of if it does meet company defined performance requirements. These requirements are set by management,not the public. Unfortunatly, it is the general opinion (mine included) that BRP has set the bar way to low on Spyders. I have been quite critical of BRP for issues that to me seem as if they should never have been sent out for public consumption. Changing oil or battery replacement is a good example of physical issues with the 998 RTs. Their manuals historically are horrible. While I don't agree that BRP should have sent units into the hands of customers with these issues, none of them has anything to do with quality. The 2013 RT is another question about BRPs commitment. In the automotive world, a Pinto met it's quality standards far more easily than a Cadillac. This is mainly because the company defined requirements for what the product was expected to do was significantly different. Also, the pinto would have been defined at a level that was based on it's very basic function. It still would have a quality level that matched or exceeded the Cadillac.

 

[jaherbst]

It gives a new meaning to having a death grip on the bars, Jack.....no one wants to fall off:yikes:

Pete

For you Pete and all my friends in OZ, HANG IN there. Help is on it's way! :joke:

G-day, Jack

 

[Roadster Renovations]

You are talking about perceived quality. The quality of a product is a very simple measure that has nothing to do with what the public thinks. Quality is not the ability of a product to meet it's performance requirements, it is a measure of if it does meet company defined performance requirements. These requirements are set by management,not the public. Unfortunatly, it is the general opinion (mine included) that BRP has set the bar way to low on Spyders. I have been quite critical of BRP for issues that to me seem as if they should never have been sent out for public consumption. Changing oil or battery replacement is a good example of physical issues with the 998 RTs. Their manuals historically are horrible. While I don't agree that BRP should have sent units into the hands of customers with these issues, none of them has anything to do with quality. The 2013 RT is another question about BRPs commitment. In the automotive world, a Pinto met it's quality standards far more easily than a Cadillac. This is mainly because the company defined requirements for what the product was expected to do was significantly different. Also, the pinto would have been defined at a level that was based on it's very basic function. It still would have a quality level that matched or exceeded the Cadillac.

That is where the problem is; our expectation of what we are getting and their expectation of what they are selling. Any company is going to make something just "good enough" to last a projected time; preferably as short as possible. That is why BRP changed the tire compound prior to 2014. There excuse was to make the tire grip better. i got one of those wonderful tires that wore out in less than 6,000 miles. Then, they again changed it to a harder compound after 2014 because of so many complaints.
Any company can lower their standards on any components, but that is a two edged sword. If they screw us enough then we will go elsewhere to purchase better quality. BRP has missed this point again and again. They develop an awesome byke with a practically bullet proof engine and transmission, then they nickle and dime us with crappy tires, shocks, air compressors, weak side case joints, to name a few. Notice that these items are all "consumable" or wearable items? They want us to replace them over and over for the life of the byke. That is a cash cow for them.
The point they are missing is that we are buying the Cadillac model in our perception and they are slipping in Pinto parts on us.

In my opinion all of the negative information about the "pinto" parts failure cheapens this awesome machine in the public's eyes. That directly effects sales and company growth. Consumers are more intelligent than they give us credit for and they would do better on sales to improve the image. After all, the Cadillac is still being produced, but the Pinto is in the wind.....

 

[jcthorne]

We be talking compound here nothing else. Softer rubber with a better grip than a car tire. Mainly due to the small amount of weight on Spyder and

motorcycle tires. Simple i.e. tire mileage or safety.

Not sure about you but my Spyders are registered as a motorcycle as required by state law. I believe it is the same in all states.

Jack

Tire compounds come in a wide range. Both on motorcycle tires and on passenger car tires. There are soft performance tires in each and hard long wear tires in each. Saying 'motorcycle tire' calls out a bead and tread profile as defined by the standards. Standards Kenda tires used on the Spyder do not meet. It does not call out a specific tread compound durometer.

I happen to agree with the point you are trying to make. The spyder needs a softer compound tire. Like what is available on the more performance oriented car tires. This is why we stock and install the Yokohama S-Drive for the rear and not some of the harder longer wearing options.

If the Kenda was not so poorly constructed such that it cannot support its tread surface at speed, it would actually last approx 15 to 18k miles with the compound they use. The wear out prematurely in the center because that is the only part of the tire actually in contact with the road at speed.

 

[finless]

To answer the question about my Yoko's before the ranting started. LOL....

This video is now a year old. I had about 9K on it then. Now I have 13K (just checked). Yea I have not been doing as much riding as I was the year before. I wound up working a lot more from home so far less commuting to work than before. I can probably get another 2K out of it.

Bottom line, I will replace it with another Yoko period!

Bob

 

[Fat Baxter]

2. You are claiming that the carcass is substandard or less than exactly what it is supposed to be. I am guessing but I would expect that this tire is exactly what BRP specified and asked for. If not, Kenda would have to do a lot of explaining to BRP and the tire would have changed within a few inventory cycles.

The story I heard years ago (maybe I read it here on Spyderlovers) was that, when BRP initially solicited tire makers to supply tires for Spyders, Kenda was the only manufacturer to respond. Slightly odd sizes; not enough of a market to warrant the effort. So BRP was kinda stuck with whatever quality of tire Kenda supplied.

BTW: wanna guess what tires come on Slingshots? I'll give you three guesses, and the first two don't count.

 

[jaherbst]

The story I heard years ago (maybe I read it here on Spyderlovers) was that, when BRP initially solicited tire makers to supply tires for Spyders, Kenda was the only manufacturer to respond. Slightly odd sizes; not enough of a market to warrant the effort. So BRP was kinda stuck with whatever quality of tire Kenda supplied.

BTW: wanna guess what tires come on Slingshots? I'll give you three guesses, and the first two don't count.

Thats a lot of money for the Polaris rear Slingshot tire. $169? I get mine for $180 installed at my most unfavorite dealer. They are the only game in town and have over 40+ Spyder dealerships. If the compound is softer on the Yokohama S Drives as JC Thorne pointed out it might be a consideration. The weight on each Spyder tire is + or - only 375# and anyone using a high mileage harder compound tire is looking for trouble on both wet or dry surfaces. On a 4-5000# car you have 1000-1250 pounds per tire to increase "grip". In my career and 66 years of riding and racing motorcycles I will choose safety over a high mileage, hard compound tire any day. I am certainly no tire expert but always think safety first. It's just a matter of physics after all.

Jack

 

[Peteoz]

For you Pete and all my friends in OZ, HANG IN there. Help is on it's way! :joke:

G-day, Jack

Oh Nooooooooo. Please tell me you aren’t sending The Donald down under, Jack :yikes:

Pere

 

[Roadster Renovations]

Thats a lot of money for the Polaris rear Slingshot tire. $169? I get mine for $180 installed at my most unfavorite dealer. They are the only game in town and have over 40+ Spyder dealerships. If the compound is softer on the Yokohama S Drives as JC Thorne pointed out it might be a consideration. The weight on each Spyder tire is + or - only 375# and anyone using a high mileage harder compound tire is looking for trouble on both wet or dry surfaces. On a 4-5000# car you have 1000-1250 pounds per tire to increase "grip". In my career and 66 years of riding and racing motorcycles I will choose safety over a high mileage, hard compound tire any day. I am certainly no tire expert but always think safety first. It's just a matter of physics after all.

Jack

Jack, I understand that you need to feel safe. And we do too. My wife first started ryding solo this past season on our '14RT. She logged about 8,000 miles. This is ryding some of the most dangerous roads in North Carolina and Tennessee (Rattler, Tail of the Dragon, etc.). In that entire 8,000 miles she never had either a front or rear wheel break loose and cause her any grief. PRIOR TO THIS SHE HAD NEVER RIDDEN SOLO BEFORE! What kind of tires do we have on the RT? Federal EVO's on the front with about 5,000 miles on them And the Michelin Hydroedge with 36,000 miles.
Prior to letting her start ryding the RT I knew the performance of these tires; either single or solo. I have road solo around corners so fast that the front tires will growl from the friction, but not loose traction. I have gotten a wheel up a foot off the ground with no slipping issues whatsoever.
I was making a quick run to a parts manufacturer in Cincinnati earlier this year in the rain and I came to a underpass in the city that had about 12" of standing water at about 45 mph. The byke hit the water and immediately started to hydroplane. I kept my cool, didn't hit the brake or try to steer out of it and the nanny kicked in, stabilized the byke, slowed it down, and I continued on my way. Regardless of what tire, it would have still done that. That is the only time that those tires have broke traction.

I am running the exact same setup on my Daytona and I noticed when i first put the Hydroedge on the rear, it would break traction pretty easily, but after 5,000 miles it has worn down enough that it bites very well on dry road. When it is wet it is a completely different story. But the Kendra that came with it was the same way. I just take care when I ryde in wet weather, knowing full well that the rear end can get a little loose. Never have I had a problem with the fronts loosing traction, wet or dry.

I guess it comes down to what makes you feel safe. My wife does not ryde in wet weather. And if she happens to get caught she takes extra care. We have another Hydroedge waiting for when she finally wears hers out. No telling when that will be.

I respect your opinion, but we'll keep doing what works for us.

 

[WA5VHU]

...I get mine for $180 installed at my most unfavorite dealer. They are the only game in town and have over 40+ Spyder dealerships...

Jack

You folks are wasting your time trying to convince Jack. He already said the Spyder dealer he chooses will only install OEM tires and as he is not about to take his Spyder anywhere else or pull the wheels himself to get new tires installed he is going to stick with his opinion no matter what information he is presented with.