Thoughts on Pedal Commander vs Pedal Box - & where's yours mounted?

[TheMariner]

You are correct... they don't add any more power but sometimes just a snappier throttle response is all some people want and a Pedal Box/Pedal Commander is a plug-n-play solution. I have one and personally I don't even bother with the Bluetooth 'adjust it using your phone' functionality... I found a setting I liked and just leave it there. Truly set and forget.

Whilst I'm framiliar with the PV4/custom map/tuning software deal from previous bikes and it is surely the best approach but there are some riders for whom this is completely beyond their ability and/or understanding, and there's a risk of doing more harm than good. For these people, a throttle controller is a safe, easy option.

 

[Cobranut]

You are correct... they don't add any more power but sometimes just a snappier throttle response is all some people want and a Pedal Box/Pedal Commander is a plug-n-play solution. I have one and personally I don't even bother with the Bluetooth 'adjust it using your phone' functionality... I found a setting I liked and just leave it there. Truly set and forget.

Whilst I'm framiliar with the PV4/custom map/tuning software deal from previous bikes and it is surely the best approach but there are some riders for whom this is completely beyond their ability and/or understanding, and there's a risk of doing more harm than good. For these people, a throttle controller is a safe, easy option.

Good point. Thanks.

 

[DickB]

They don't actually add any power, they just make the throttle open a bit quicker as the grip is twisted.

There's a misconception that these devices open the throttle quicker. They don't. They do change the sensitivity of the twist grip, so that you twist less to get the same throttle opening as you do stock.

The throttle is a butterfly valve in the throttle body that is driven by a servo motor. The servo cannot open the butterfly instantly. The servo motor must overcome the inertia of the butterfly, gears, and the motor itself to come up to speed. Once it does, the speed at which the butterfly opens is limited by the maximum rpm of the servo motor. The maximum rate at which the servo opens the valve is called the slew rate. I have measured this on my Ryker; in stock form the butterfly opens fully in about 75mS - less than the blink of an eye. The speed at which the butterfly opens is determined by the speed at which you twist the grip, the ECU, and is limited by the throttle body slew rate. If you twist the stock grip fully and rapidly, the ECU does not limit butterfly opening speed, but the speed at which the butterfly opens is limited by the slew rate. The only way to make this faster is to change the throttle body. Since the stock throttle body slew rate is less than the blink of an eye, there's little point in doing so, if you could even find a faster throttle body.

 

[Cobranut]

There's a misconception that these devices open the throttle quicker. They don't. They do change the sensitivity of the twist grip, so that you twist less to get the same throttle opening as you do stock.

The throttle is a butterfly valve in the throttle body that is driven by a servo motor. The servo cannot open the butterfly instantly. The servo motor must overcome the inertia of the butterfly, gears, and the motor itself to come up to speed. Once it does, the speed at which the butterfly opens is limited by the maximum rpm of the servo motor. The maximum rate at which the servo opens the valve is called the slew rate. I have measured this on my Ryker; in stock form the butterfly opens fully in about 75mS - less than the blink of an eye. The speed at which the butterfly opens is determined by the speed at which you twist the grip, the ECU, and is limited by the throttle body slew rate. If you twist the stock grip fully and rapidly, the ECU does not limit butterfly opening speed, but the speed at which the butterfly opens is limited by the slew rate. The only way to make this faster is to change the throttle body. Since the stock throttle body slew rate is less than the blink of an eye, there's little point in doing so, if you could even find a faster throttle body.

Technically, you are correct, however, I doubt most people can twist the throttle fully in under 75ms.

I think most people on here understood what I meant, and if the grip is twisted at the same rate, the throttle will indeed open faster.
The issue for me is that I have trouble twisting the grip to it's limits, so adjusting the relative rate of throttle opening makes a major difference in my riding comfort.

 

[DickB]

Technically, you are correct, however, I doubt most people can twist the throttle fully in under 75ms.

It's easier than you might think.

I made measurements on my Ryker with an oscilloscope. The blue line is the TAS, Throttle Accelerator Signal from the twist grip. The yellow line is the TPS, Throttle Position Signal from the butterfly in the throttle body. You could see I twisted the grip fully in 76mS without really trying hard.