oil to spare!

[Dudley]

O.K. here's the deal from the dealer...they think that because of it's short life it is possible that it has been started and shut down numerous times without coming to full temp. (I would agree)
It is possible to have fouled a plug under those circumstances and the fuel pumps and injectors are still putting out the full fuel pressure. Consequently I could have fuel bypassing the rings and getting into the oil system. (I'm with them so far ..Scotty are you there?...Scotty?:bowdown This could account for the over filled situation in the oil tank according to them. Although they do admit that the overfill could be an oops on their part. As I understand it ...ANY liquid including fuel can cause foaming in the oil. (Scotty?..are there yet? Help!)
I came home and looked at the nasty sample in the jar and was hoping to see some separation of liquids but there is none. There is however a smell of fuel to it. Hmmm.
Their advice is to check the plugs for fouling and if so replace and drop the oil for fresh and go from there. Keep starts down to a minimum until I can ride and seat the rings or at least bring it up to operating temp.They have been very good in addressing this to the best of their abilities. I was getting concerned that I had no response so I phoned them. I got no response because there were 3 people trying to solve the problem. It takes time. Very impressed with their efforts. And no..I don't have to pay for the oil/o-rings/filter/plugs etc. And If I wanted to trailer it in they would be more than happy to do it for me. Yeah I know I have roadside assistance but it's no skin off my nose.
All I gotta do now is figure out how to get the plugs out of it or rather how to get to the plugs!
Regards,
Max

Max, I would have them start from the git-go. I would trailer it to them and ask them to start over. Then I would ask them again to go over the Spyder with you to be sure you have all your questions answered. I know when I buy something that I am really excited about I am listening to half of what they tell me and forget most of that. I am not sure if the gas in the oil is for real... but I am not a mechnic. I would also enlist Lamont's expertise on this, as well as Scotty's. Better to be safe now than sorry later.

 

[max continuous]

Thanks for the advice Dudley, I'm picking up what your putting down!
I just looked at where the plugs are.:yikes:
It's freaking cold here and a lot of sh@T on the roads. So I'm a bit reluctant to trailer 200 km.
Max

 

[NancysToy]

O.K. here's the deal from the dealer...they think that because of it's short life it is possible that it has been started and shut down numerous times without coming to full temp. (I would agree)
It is possible to have fouled a plug under those circumstances and the fuel pumps and injectors are still putting out the full fuel pressure. Consequently I could have fuel bypassing the rings and getting into the oil system. (I'm with them so far ..Scotty are you there?...Scotty?:bowdown This could account for the over filled situation in the oil tank according to them. Although they do admit that the overfill could be an oops on their part. As I understand it ...ANY liquid including fuel can cause foaming in the oil. (Scotty?..are there yet? Help!)
I came home and looked at the nasty sample in the jar and was hoping to see some separation of liquids but there is none. There is however a smell of fuel to it. Hmmm.
Their advice is to check the plugs for fouling and if so replace and drop the oil for fresh and go from there. Keep starts down to a minimum until I can ride and seat the rings or at least bring it up to operating temp.They have been very good in addressing this to the best of their abilities. I was getting concerned that I had no response so I phoned them. I got no response because there were 3 people trying to solve the problem. It takes time. Very impressed with their efforts. And no..I don't have to pay for the oil/o-rings/filter/plugs etc. And If I wanted to trailer it in they would be more than happy to do it for me. Yeah I know I have roadside assistance but it's no skin off my nose.
All I gotta do now is figure out how to get the plugs out of it or rather how to get to the plugs!
Regards,
Max

The fuel smell in the oil indicates they could be on the right track, but it would have to be very strong for this much volume increase. I agree with the advice to have them take it and start over again. Fouled plugs, no matter how you ran it, or how often, are a fault...not the norm. An engine that is running properly can idle for hours on end, and restart dozens of times repeatedly. This is not a racing machine. This explanation would also explain the ragged running you experienced.

I agree with those who said they should trailer it back to the shop and correct the problems. This should not be your responsibility! At this point it needs a minimum of new plugs, fresh oil, and a new filter and crush washers. They should run a full diagnostic, and check the entire ignition system and function. They also need to do a compression check to determine if the cylinders were damaged. Washing down the oil on the cylinder walls with fuel often scrapes the walls and damages the rings. In the long run, be wary of problems with bearings and lower end damage from the oil dilution. Camshaft problems are possible, too. This type of damage could take a while to show up. Not trying to scare you, the majority of engines survive a problem like this, I just want you to be aware of the possibilities and what needs to be checked and watched. Time to lean on your dealer to make this right.
-Scotty

 

[max continuous]

Thanks for your advice Scotty,
I think you and others are right. It's time to stop being a nice Canadian boy and ship it's beautiful butt back to the dealer.
I really appreciate all the info from you folks. I'm not without mechanical skills but sometimes a second opinion from people more in the know clears ones head.
Thanks again,
Max

 

[max continuous]

O.K. The bike goes back to the dealer on the 19th. (my choice)
Scotty ...would doing a compression test at 4 km. show any ring damage?
I'm not sure the rings would be seated at this point and you wouldn't get a true test. As for the rest of your suggestions..This bike is not coming home until they have performed all tests you suggested.
Thanks again for your/everyones help,
Max

 

[NancysToy]

O.K. The bike goes back to the dealer on the 19th. (my choice)
Scotty ...would doing a compression test at 4 km. show any ring damage?
I'm not sure the rings would be seated at this point and you wouldn't get a true test. As for the rest of your suggestions..This bike is not coming home until they have performed all tests you suggested.
Thanks again for your/everyones help,
Max

If the Spyder had only fouled one cylinder, and had damage there, that cylinder should differ significantly from the other. The rings are not fully seated, but compression should still be within limits, although it may at or just below the low side. If both plugs fouled, you won't learn anything from the compression test unless both cylinders test real bad. Once you start riding it, you can look for signs of performance loss or smoking, too. Glad your dealer is willing (even if pushed a bit). Let us know how things work out. At least you aren't missing any riding right now.
-Scotty