Octane requirements

[Dray]

I am in the process of buying a 2015 F3S and I am wondering what the actual
octane requirement is. Is there a benefit to hi octane? My manual for my GL1800
recommends hi octane but everyone seems to run regular with no ill effects.

While I am at this, is there any recommendations for pilot/co-pilot backrest. Also will
probably need armrest for the co-pilot. Need to keep everyone happy. Especially since
I do not have to sell the GL trike to get the F3S.

Thanks in advance!!

Dray

 

[jcthorne]

The bike requires the use of 91 or better.

Many ignore the requirement and use regular and we have not seen any bikes come apart as a result but there IS a significant performance loss.

If you intend to do significant time with a passenger, are you sure the F3S is the right bike?

Do not know of any arm rests for an F3S. Several back rest options.

Also if you intend to ride with a passenger on an F3S you will likely need to upgrade the weight capacity of the rear shock.

 

[Ochoa1801]

what is the weight capacity of the rear shock?

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

91 OCTANE - HOOEY

Unless your 1330 engine is a quite different from mine ( I don't think so ) 91 Octane is ONLY RECOMMENDED not REQUIRED ....there is big difference to those words......I have been using 87 ( with Startron ) for 17,000 miles and my Spyder runs great, avg 39 mpg, no power loss , I pass any time I want. So if you want to spend 20 % extra for premium that's your choice, but quite a few here don't and are very Happy about it.......... :thumbup:..Mike :bbq:.............................Let the Flaming begin :lecturef_smilie: :yes:

 

[ARtraveler]

Some of us do have different opinions. :roflblack::roflblack: No flaming about a gas octane subject. To much fire danger with that. :roflblack::roflblack:

I have used high octane in all my :spyder2::spyder2::spyder2::ani29::ani29:. Here, we do not have to contend with Ethanol and high octane means 91 octane.

IMO: when I have had to use lesser octane as in 87, the :spyder2: did not feel as "peppy." I keep going back to the 91 where and when available. :yes:

 

[spyderCodes]

Octane is a measure of a fuel to resist pre-ignition caused by the compression stroke in advance of the spark plug firing.
This is especially prevalent in high compression engines, as found in Spyders.

Pre-ignition or "knocking" is detrimental to the long life of an engine primarily because it causes the fuel air mixture to be ignited prior to the closing of the valves and therefore leads to burnt valves which causes less than adequate valve sealing and more burnt valves eventually leading to so much loss of compression the engine doesn't run.

One function of the ECM is to adjust the ignition timing and fuel injector timing to compensate for this knocking when a less than adequate octane rating is available from the fuel.

The ECM uses, wait for it, knock sensors to determine when ignition timing and injector duty cycle must be adjusted to compensate for the low octane.
In engines like the Spyder this knock compensation results in lower power and usually lower fuel economy.
In other engines, like on your lawn mower, because the compression isn't as high, it matters little what the octane rating of your fuel is.

The recommended octane rating is what is thought best by the people who made the engine for all around fuel economy and power.

 

[Bfromla]

Unless your 1330 engine is a quite different from mine ( I don't think so ) 91 Octane is ONLY RECOMMENDED not REQUIRED ....there is big difference to those words
[/SIZE]

The biggest mileage ive seen has been more from the ethanol free harder to find but worth the effort.
http://www.pure-gas.org my 998 goes from 22-28mpg to 34-40 all 91+octane & down in teens with 87. My riding style is very casual & no rush whatsoever fyi.

 

[Bob Denman]

Here's the short version: nojoke
Yes; BRP says to run 91 octane fuel.
Yes; the computer can adjust things to the point where it'll run on anything that it can get to burn...

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

KNOCK SENSORS

Octane is a measure of a fuel to resist pre-ignition caused by the compression stroke in advance of the spark plug firing.
This is especially prevalent in high compression engines, as found in Spyders.

Pre-ignition or "knocking" is detrimental to the long life of an engine primarily because it causes the fuel air mixture to be ignited prior to the closing of the valves and therefore leads to burnt valves which causes less than adequate valve sealing and more burnt valves eventually leading to so much loss of compression the engine doesn't run.

One function of the ECM is to adjust the ignition timing and fuel injector timing to compensate for this knocking when a less than adequate octane rating is available from the fuel.

The ECM uses, wait for it, knock sensors to determine when ignition timing and injector duty cycle must be adjusted to compensate for the low octane.
In engines like the Spyder this knock compensation results in lower power and usually lower fuel economy.
In other engines, like on your lawn mower, because the compression isn't as high, it matters little what the octane rating of your fuel is.

The recommended octane rating is what is thought best by the people who made the engine for all around fuel economy and power.

Thank you ....I also believe you can tell when the Knock sensors are activated....Yes or No.......:dontknow:

 

[spyderCodes]

Thank you ....I also believe you can tell when the Knock sensors are activated....Yes or No.......:dontknow:

No
If the ECM is working properly then as soon as the knock sensors pick up the knock the ECM reacts to suppress the knock.
You wouldn't notice a thing unless you are running fuel so low in octane rating that the ECM couldn't compensate.

 

[jcthorne]

Thank you ....I also believe you can tell when the Knock sensors are activated....Yes or No.......:dontknow:

Yes. It feels like the bike is sluggish compared to what you know it should be when you twist the right handle.

And Mike you are very wrong on this one. Its NOT a recommendation. Its a REQUIREMENT. Read the engine and emissions label under your seat. (for the OP its in the frunk on the F3). Its states:

FUEL MINIMUM OCTANE 91 (R+M/2 Method)

This is the MINIMUM Requirement for the bike. Does not matter how your owners manual is worded, the decal ON THE BIKE takes precedence and the requirement started with the 2013 model year when they increased the compression ratio.

If the engine fails, O2 sensors burn out etc, BRP would be well withing their right to deny warranty coverage for the bike if there is less than the minimum requirement fuel in the tank or the owner admits to running less then the required octane fuel. Just because BRP has not enforced this does not make it any less a requirement.

So, as I stated in my first response to the OP:

The bike requires the use of 91 or better.

Many ignore the requirement and use regular and we have not seen any bikes come apart as a result but there IS a significant performance loss.

 

[Chupaca]

Here's the thing....

I have come to the conclusion that they (brp) do not want to differenciate with the different fuel in the many countries these machines are running around in. The US fuels are better than most and you will not have an issue using the 87 (our lowest I think). Your better off with high octane fuels no doubt and the price difference is usually a buck per tank. If that is killing you your on the wrong ryde...:roflblack: back home we had 76..87...and 95 no ethonol we ate all the corn...but the quality was not good and they had little additives if any...stick with the best you can get..mho

 

[jcthorne]

what is the weight capacity of the rear shock?

About 160 lbs give or take, the actual number was published somewhere but I cannot find it. I am sure someone else will post it.

 

[Dray]

Octane requirements+

One of the responses to my question about needing backrest stated that if I plan on carrying
double much I should consider a different scoot or upgrading the rear shock. This surprised me
as I have seen several new F3S with bags and co-pilot bag rest. There was also mentioned a weight
capacity of 160 lbs. for the rear shock. Am I really missing something here? Please bear with me
as I am new to the spyder scoots.

Thanks for all the input.

Dray

 

[PaladinLV]

The Spyder - RECOMMENDS 91 Octane
I run two tanks of Regular to 1 Tank of Premium

No Problems with Regular

The following is QUOTE - directly from the manual of a 2014 RT-S

" Recommended FuelUse premium unleaded gasoline with
an AKI (RON+MON)/2 octane rating of
91, or an RON octane rating of 95.
"


AJ

I am in the process of buying a 2015 F3S and I am wondering what the actual
octane requirement is. Is there a benefit to hi octane? My manual for my GL1800
recommends hi octane but everyone seems to run regular with no ill effects.

While I am at this, is there any recommendations for pilot/co-pilot backrest. Also will
probably need armrest for the co-pilot. Need to keep everyone happy. Especially since
I do not have to sell the GL trike to get the F3S.

Thanks in advance!!

Dray

 

[PaladinLV]

From 2014 RT-S Manual

" Recommended FuelUse premium unleaded gasoline with
an AKI (RON+MON)/2 octane rating of
91, or an RON octane rating of 95."

Yes. It feels like the bike is sluggish compared to what you know it should be when you twist the right handle.

And Mike you are very wrong on this one. Its NOT a recommendation. Its a REQUIREMENT. Read the engine and emissions label under your seat. (for the OP its in the frunk on the F3). Its states:

FUEL MINIMUM OCTANE 91 (R+M/2 Method)

This is the MINIMUM Requirement for the bike. Does not matter how your owners manual is worded, the decal ON THE BIKE takes precedence and the requirement started with the 2013 model year when they increased the compression ratio.

If the engine fails, O2 sensors burn out etc, BRP would be well withing their right to deny warranty coverage for the bike if there is less than the minimum requirement fuel in the tank or the owner admits to running less then the required octane fuel. Just because BRP has not enforced this does not make it any less a requirement.

So, as I stated in my first response to the OP:

The bike requires the use of 91 or better.

Many ignore the requirement and use regular and we have not seen any bikes come apart as a result but there IS a significant performance loss.

AJ

 

[jcthorne]

From 2014 RT-S Manual

" Recommended FuelUse premium unleaded gasoline with
an AKI (RON+MON)/2 octane rating of
91, or an RON octane rating of 95."






AJ

As I stated and confirmed by BRP, the manual has been superseded by the information shown ON THE BIKE certification label. The 91 is a MINIMUM REQUIREMENT, not a recommendation as stated in the outdated printed manual.


Please folks, use what ever you want, but the REQUIREMENT is shown ON YOUR BIKE.

If an owners manual information is updated it only requires a statement issued by the company. If the information on the certification label is ever to be updated it requires a RECALL to have the label replaced.

This has come up before and I just do not understand why folks just cannot READ what BRP sold you.

 

[cajunshredder]

I am in SC and we have ethanol. So my choice is 89 ethanol free or 93 with ethanol. Thoughts?

 

[Marker]

in all my spyders I have used 91 or higher octane. Spyders are a lot of money so I never cheap out on fuel.
Try to avoid ethanol in fuels at all cost. Never any engine problems.