New leftover SE6 slipping - i only made it 34 miles

[cuznjohn]

first let me say welcome to spyder world, and take a breath and relax. also i have not read everything people have said to you, but i will tell you what i went through. after riding two wheels for many years i went to a 2013 RT limited. at first i loved the bike. then i started thinking i made a mistake. i didn't have the mechanical problems you had right out of the box, and i feel for you because of that. get that bike back to the dealer right away. but once i started riding with my friends again, i found myself lagging behind, because of the way the bike handled. i was so uncomfortable it was unreal. the great people on here helped me realize what i was doing wrong, and i started riding by myself for a little so i didn't have to keep up with anyone, and sure enough, i got used to the bike, and learned to handle turns and corners.

my main problem was with heat on my bike. it drove me nuts. it took some time for them to fix the problem, but they did. but the F3's on here get nothing but fantastic reviews. so i think once you iron the few problems you have, and i don't think you should of had them, i am sure you will be happy with the bike. please feel free to ask any question you have on this forum. the people on here are some of the best people you will ever want to talk to about the spyder. they are very helpful, and funny also. MANY HAPPY MILES AND SMILES TO YOU MY FRIEND

 

[Slowpoke387]

first let me say welcome to spyder world, and take a breath and relax. also i have not read everything people have said to you, but i will tell you what i went through. after riding two wheels for many years i went to a 2013 RT limited. at first i loved the bike. then i started thinking i made a mistake. i didn't have the mechanical problems you had right out of the box, and i feel for you because of that. get that bike back to the dealer right away. but once i started riding with my friends again, i found myself lagging behind, because of the way the bike handled. i was so uncomfortable it was unreal. the great people on here helped me realize what i was doing wrong, and i started riding by myself for a little so i didn't have to keep up with anyone, and sure enough, i got used to the bike, and learned to handle turns and corners.

my main problem was with heat on my bike. it drove me nuts. it took some time for them to fix the problem, but they did. but the F3's on here get nothing but fantastic reviews. so i think once you iron the few problems you have, and i don't think you should of had them, i am sure you will be happy with the bike. please feel free to ask any question you have on this forum. the people on here are some of the best people you will ever want to talk to about the spyder. they are very helpful, and funny also. MANY HAPPY MILES AND SMILES TO YOU MY FRIEND

Thanks for the welcome and its funny that you mentioned the lagging behind thing. Because of the alignment/nervous twitchy feeling in the front, my short ride had me feeling the same way. I found myself actually thinking "wow normally id be going 10mph faster here". Ive never ever hopped on a new machine and not felt confident before. Ive had snowmobiles, quads, jet skiis, road raced motorcycles on a semi pro level, had dirtbikes, not to mention 15-20 street bikes over the years, and yet this thing had me losing confidence lol. I found myself noticing cars catching me from behind which never happens lol. Oh well, an alignment and time hopefully will cure it.

 

[ARtraveler]

The good advice just keeps coming. Consider this as an extra welcome to the site. Hang in there. :bbq::bbq::bbq::bbq:

 

[Hokiev]

As others have said, be sure to check tire pressure. When I picked up my second Spyder (2015 RTS) and drove home from the dealer I felt like it was all over the road and was difficult to handle. After I got home I checked the tire pressure and the fronts were over 26 psi after setting over night. I imagine they were over that when warm. I now have FOBO's to monitor the pressure and keep at 18 psi when cold and it handles much better.

 

[Gator37]

Cold Turkey Buyers

We were cold turkey buyers all the way. Local dealers dont like to do test rides here. I think if it was aligned and tracked straight, the grip could be more relaxed and there would be less bar input which im sure is causing exagerated twitchiness. Thats my theory and im sticking to it lol.
Im quite sure both of these issues are due to poor quality control on the human level. Shame because first impressions are hard to shake. Im just really glad it happened to me and not the wife. if this happened with her id feel terrible.

I think, in fact I know, I would have found me a different dealer if yours wouldn't let you do a test ride, especially as you say you are an experienced bike rider. Mine, Lifestyle Honda in Mt. Vernon, WA. allowed a test ride as far as I wanted to go. You have received excellent advice and if no death grip and tranny problems I think it's again a dealer problem. Good Luck.

 

[Slowpoke387]

All loaded up in the trailer. Found a dealer about half an hour away who im hoping i can call in the morning and drop it off to. Website says they do the laser alignments although i know its not going to be the ROLO. Nearest ROLO is about 3 hours out so im going to roll the dice while the dealer has it anyway. If it still pulls to the right i will swap the front tires around just for a test. The trans is the bigger issue now anyway.

 

[jcthorne]

Be careful with statements like this. I have had two RTs and neither has been out of alignment. I have four friends with RTs and with one exception (self inflicted) none have had alignment issues. I know there was a time when many were screwed up but, probably not "all".

I
can tell you having personally measured many. Less than 1% are correctly aligned from the factory. I have not yet had the pleasure of one coming through my shop. Some of the other laser alignment teams have seen one or two. VERY few.

 

[PMK]

All loaded up in the trailer. Found a dealer about half an hour away who im hoping i can call in the morning and drop it off to. Website says they do the laser alignments although i know its not going to be the ROLO. Nearest ROLO is about 3 hours out so im going to roll the dice while the dealer has it anyway. If it still pulls to the right i will swap the front tires around just for a test. The trans is the bigger issue now anyway.

Transmission will not be a big deal in my opinion. You mentioned it was a left over you bought, guessing 2015 and they are known to have, and there is published bulletins about the gear position sensor being botched from new. They can either clean out the debris that was left from manufacturing or replace the gear position sensor. Probably best to get it replaced.

While they have the computer hooked up to it, have them verify the centering position for the steering sensor. Not common but sometimes they are off. As mentioned, verify tire pressures are accurate with a good gauge.

As far as laser aligning, was not aware any others except ROLO existed. Regardless, while a nice tool, it still requires a skilled person to understand it and properly align the machine. Not difficult, but takes some understanding.

All the best with it.

 

[Slowpoke387]

Transmission will not be a big deal in my opinion. You mentioned it was a left over you bought, guessing 2015 and they are known to have, and there is published bulletins about the gear position sensor being botched from new. They can either clean out the debris that was left from manufacturing or replace the gear position sensor. Probably best to get it replaced.

While they have the computer hooked up to it, have them verify the centering position for the steering sensor. Not common but sometimes they are off. As mentioned, verify tire pressures are accurate with a good gauge.

As far as laser aligning, was not aware any others except ROLO existed. Regardless, while a nice tool, it still requires a skilled person to understand it and properly align the machine. Not difficult, but takes some understanding.

All the best with it.

Its a 2016. My main concern is that is was slipping to the point of not being able to move. Also it was slipping before all the lights came on. In my experience (with cars) the lights usually come on if the ecu sees a mechanical condition outside of certain parameters (mechanical issue) or if a sensor is bad. So i guess im wondering if a bad sensor on these can actually cause slipping (in which case wouldnt the light be on first?) or is it seeing the slipping and then tripping the codes.

 

[Highwayman2013]

Good luck with getting your problems solved. We love our 2016 F3 Limited. A belated welcome as well!

 

[PMK]

Its a 2016. My main concern is that is was slipping to the point of not being able to move. Also it was slipping before all the lights came on. In my experience (with cars) the lights usually come on if the ecu sees a mechanical condition outside of certain parameters (mechanical issue) or if a sensor is bad. So i guess im wondering if a bad sensor on these can actually cause slipping (in which case wouldnt the light be on first?) or is it seeing the slipping and then tripping the codes.

Suspecting, the computer was seeing two gears at once selected based on the gear position sensor, confused it did not know and threw the light, also, confused the clutch actuator.

No doubt I may be wrong.

If you do a quick search about the problem 2015 units with bad Gearbox sensors, they had all sorts of confused problems.

 

[irvin48]

went through the gps sensor disaster as soon as we picked ours up last year.
1st time the sensor was installed. the second time they found out it hadnt gotten programmed
correctly. almost 7000 miles of smiles since.--irv

if it hadnt been for reading about the problem here we wouldnt
have known. even the dealer hadnt had one pop up.

 

[Slowpoke387]

went through the gps sensor disaster as soon as we picked ours up last year.
1st time the sensor was installed. the second time they found out it hadnt gotten programmed
correctly. almost 7000 miles of smiles since.--irv

if it hadnt been for reading about the problem here we wouldnt
have known. even the dealer hadnt had one pop up.

Good to know. No doubt this will be fixed im sure. Was yours actually slipping?

 

[Slowpoke387]

Suspecting, the computer was seeing two gears at once selected based on the gear position sensor, confused it did not know and threw the light, also, confused the clutch actuator.

No doubt I may be wrong.

If you do a quick search about the problem 2015 units with bad Gearbox sensors, they had all sorts of confused problems.

Yeah ive been thinking maybe its confused about what gear its in but im not sure if that would result in a slipping trans. Maybe so if the clutch actuator was working incorrectly. Im kind of worried about the severe heat that undoubtably resulted from all the slipping. Slipping so badly that after less than a mile it wouldnt move. After a few hours of letting it cool down it moved fwd and rev and i was able to load it into my trailer and drop it off this am. But its clearly confused right now. R and n are flashing, theres a big E reading out on the dash which flashes along with a flashing engine light. As well as another constant engine light lol. These things are loaded with sensors.

 

[billybovine]

Alternating flashing N & R lights with an E in the gear display means the gear position sensor is bad, disconnected or incorrectly calibrated.
Slipping clutch would cause a "Transmission Failure" message to scroll across the screen.

 

[PMK]

Others will know for certain, but I believe the clutch clamp and lock up is hydraulically actuated but computer dictated based on engine parameters.

Not sure so much it was slipping as opposed to not knowing to clamp or lock up.

Granted, a wet clutch can be trashed, but it does take a good bit of effort and HP run through it.

If they are replacing clutch plates, demand they soak the new plates in oil before installing. It does make a difference in performance and longevity.

 

[SteveE]

Welcome to the Spyder world. When I got my Spyder I was coming from a Kawasaki 2000. I had the same issues that you are having. Twitchy, drifts back and forth on the road etc. etc.. Corners that I would take at 50 on the Vulcan, were lilies to no more than 15 mph. 200 miles later, those corners are once again back up to 50 and I have learned the "feel" of the Spyder so unless the cross winds are up, there is no longer any twitch. Stay with it...it gets wonderful.

 

[Slowpoke387]

Update #1

So i just talked to the dealer. They said there were obviously numerous codes that tripped one another once the slipping started. What they they cant tell me is why it happened. They cleared the codes and rode it, rode fine. So they called BRP who told them to change the oil and test it after. So they want to change two oil filters to be safe and do the oil change and ride it. I told them i was concerned about any possible internal clutch damage and to ride it 100 miles if they have to once they change the oil. I want it to get nice and hot under a load.
So im wondering if BRP has encountered this before and had a bad batch of oil, or if this is step one of a diagnosis process or ...

 

[dpetrick]

Clutch

Good to hear they are making progress. Hope the problem is solved for good and you can enjoy the Spyder.

 

[SpyderNeil]

So i just talked to the dealer. They said there were obviously numerous codes that tripped one another once the slipping started. What they they cant tell me is why it happened. They cleared the codes and rode it, rode fine. So they called BRP who told them to change the oil and test it after. So they want to change two oil filters to be safe and do the oil change and ride it. I told them i was concerned about any possible internal clutch damage and to ride it 100 miles if they have to once they change the oil. I want it to get nice and hot under a load.
So im wondering if BRP has encountered this before and had a bad batch of oil, or if this is step one of a diagnosis process or ...

I would be worried about clutch disc wear, since you said the clutch was slipping badly. See if you can get some kind of assurance (In Writing) that if you have clutch issues in the future, they won't try to say that it's normal wear and therefore Not covered under warranty.

Neil