Is changing the Exhaust and Intake necessary with a Juicebox?

[challman]

I am wondering about a few things on the Spyder.

I have noticed a few things that don't seem to add up

1. Everyone is talking about Juicebox when you change the exhaust and or the intake. I don't understand why this is necessary as the system in the spyder should automatically adjust mixture to compensate... This is after all one of the reasons for fuel injection.

I can see a Juice box or such to get through any odd dips in the power band If you were going to do this you would need to have the Juice Box Pro so you could adjust each rpm range seperately...

Am I nuts? I have the Hindle and My Spyder runs great. I have yet to read the plugs, so I can't swear it is not lean but I just don't understand this..

I am definitely not a fuel injection expert but isn't this what all the sensors are on there for?



2 Can-am talks about how critical it is to have proper belt tension and you must use their $1000 gizmo that checks tension by sound and that if you don't you will have problems. Then suddenly they decide to cut the recommended tension by 2/3.. How critical could it be? I have never had issues with a belt just make it good and snug make sure it isn't jumping on the cogs....

Now I am reading that they lowered the belt tension because they were destroying the bearings... Hmmmmm... So we cut the tension by 2/3.... this seems to be a knee jerk reaction. Now I am seeing idler pulleys to help get rid of the vibration.... Hmmmmm again.... How about enough tension to eliminate the vibration and loose enough not to destroy bearings.......

Anyone out there doing their own tensioning on the belt?


3 It seems like there are a lot of custom accessories available. I consider this a great indicator of a Cycle/Vehicle which is really popular.... Yet it seems they aren't as popular as they seem since I never see others on the road.

For some reason people who make custom parts for the Spyder don't seem to know how to take good pictures of their product which help you know how it will look installed nor necessarily write a description which actually identifies what the part does.... Why is this?

 

[docdoru]

Now I am reading that they lowered the belt tension because they were destroying the bearings... Hmmmmm... So we cut the tension by 2/3.... this seems to be a knee jerk reaction.

Answer: search this forum for counter shaft or front sprocket. :sour:

 

[Roger]

I am wondering about a few things on the Spyder.

I have noticed a few things that don't seem to add up

1. Everyone is talking about Juicebox when you change the exhaust and or the intake. I don't understand why this is necessary as the system in the spyder should automatically adjust mixture to compensate... This is after all one of the reasons for fuel injection.

I can see a Juice box or such to get through any odd dips in the power band If you were going to do this you would need to have the Juice Box Pro so you could adjust each rpm range seperately...

Am I nuts? I have the Hindle and My Spyder runs great. I have yet to read the plugs, so I can't swear it is not lean but I just don't understand this..

I am definitely not a fuel injection expert but isn't this what all the sensors are on there for?



2 Can-am talks about how critical it is to have proper belt tension and you must use their $1000 gizmo that checks tension by sound and that if you don't you will have problems. Then suddenly they decide to cut the recommended tension by 2/3.. How critical could it be? I have never had issues with a belt just make it good and snug make sure it isn't jumping on the cogs....

Now I am reading that they lowered the belt tension because they were destroying the bearings... Hmmmmm... So we cut the tension by 2/3.... this seems to be a knee jerk reaction. Now I am seeing idler pulleys to help get rid of the vibration.... Hmmmmm again.... How about enough tension to eliminate the vibration and loose enough not to destroy bearings.......

Anyone out there doing their own tensioning on the belt?


3 It seems like there are a lot of custom accessories available. I consider this a great indicator of a Cycle/Vehicle which is really popular.... Yet it seems they aren't as popular as they seem since I never see others on the road.

For some reason people who make custom parts for the Spyder don't seem to know how to take good pictures of their product which help you know how it will look installed nor necessarily write a description which actually identifies what the part does.... Why is this?

1. I have changed the intake and my exhaust and i use the juicebox pro for me the box provides much smoother accelaration through out the whole powerband and i could adjust as needed to any point on take off in mid range or on the high end it's just a personnel addition that some of us would like to have that the system can not compensate for.

2. As far as belt tension nobody ever said you have to buy their tool do a search other people have bought their own tool that seem to work and it's a recall so the dealer will adjust for free.

3. This bike is not for everyone it really has not been on the market to long so you maybe starting a trend in your area. What i noticed in my area is a lot of young riders really like the spider but when you can buy a rocket at half the price that is what they will buy. They have sub forums on here check that out for your state and you may meet a new friend to ride with.

4. the vendors pictures should only be part of your decision to buy their product ask people who have used their product do a google search for pictures and ask for opinions. Better yet call the vendor and ask if they have a better picture to email you.

i hope this helps. goodluck to you.

 

[Littlebadwolf]

I run the Hindle with the K&N performance filter with the 0-2 modifier and have no problems at all...no backfiring, rapid acceleration, and very little impact on gas mileage, if any. Didn't find any need to go beyond the 0-2 modifier.

 

[WackyDan]

I went with the Kewl Metal intake as I was absolutely tired of dealing with the stock air box when it came time for plug changes, either scheduled or on the road. That made the Spyder run a bit leaner and feel fuel starved in some RPM ranges, so I added a Juice Box Pro.

...And yes I've had to deal with plug issues on the road. Have your O2 sensor go bad mid trip and you will be needing to check /change your plugs.

I now have a ton of room on the top end of the engine to get at the plugs, hoses and wiring that is nested in that area.

I would actually like to get the belt thingy dingy to reduce some vibration. *Which I had at the higher belt tension too... just in a different RPM range.

 

[NancysToy]

I am wondering about a few things on the Spyder.

I have noticed a few things that don't seem to add up

1. Everyone is talking about Juicebox when you change the exhaust and or the intake. I don't understand why this is necessary as the system in the spyder should automatically adjust mixture to compensate... This is after all one of the reasons for fuel injection.

I can see a Juice box or such to get through any odd dips in the power band If you were going to do this you would need to have the Juice Box Pro so you could adjust each rpm range seperately...

Am I nuts? I have the Hindle and My Spyder runs great. I have yet to read the plugs, so I can't swear it is not lean but I just don't understand this..

I am definitely not a fuel injection expert but isn't this what all the sensors are on there for?.....

You are correct that the ECM will adjust for intake and exhaust changes...but only to a certain extent. Flow a lot more air due to a much freer flowing exhaust and/or intake, and you can exceed the limits of the programming. A modification like the Juice Box can compensate for the limited adjustment available via the ECM. It can also be used to overcome the very lean mapping in the ECM, necessary for EPA emissions compliance. These settings are not optimal for performance. It is a personal choice. If you are happy with the way your Spyder runs, and it does not hesitate or backfire, stick with the stock mapping.

 

[challman]

Wow.. Thanks for all the info. That does make a lot of sense on the juicebox. I look inside the engine compartment and I see all that airbox then I look at the kuelmetal intake and tell myself... I gotta get me one of those.. So I suspect I will....... After a little cooling off period so my wife isn't so freaked about the amount of money being spent. I am think juicebox pro at that point so I can get that extra and fatten up the mixture a little. I have always had a tendancy to run my bikes a little fat.

As far as the belt goes. I am going to adjust it myself without a suped up tension measuring device. I will have to prove to myself that it is needed, and I suspect that just normal common sense will probably just work. If I am wrong I guess it will cost me.

Anyway thanks for all the advice.

AND
You have to take the airbox off to get at the plugs?... Say it isn't so....For Petes sake

all the more reason to ditch that thing. But good to know.... I am going to check out the forums and see if I can find anything about the plugs..

Thanks all

 

[boborgera]

.

AND
You have to take the airbox off to get at the plugs?... Say it isn't so....For Petes sake

all the more reason to ditch that thing. But good to know.... I am going to check out the forums and see if I can find anything about the plugs..


:sour:
I think someone said that you can change plugs without removing the box':dontknow:
But I've changed more plugs in the last 48 years than Carter had little pills' But when pull my plugs I find I have to remove the box.:gaah:

 

[Some Guy]

I had to remove the airbox to change the front plug. You may be able to change the plug without removing the box, but I'd be worried about damaging the spark plug wire and/or boot.

 

[Firefly]

Wow.. Thanks for all the info. That does make a lot of sense on the juicebox. I look inside the engine compartment and I see all that airbox then I look at the kuelmetal intake and tell myself... I gotta get me one of those.. So I suspect I will....... After a little cooling off period so my wife isn't so freaked about the amount of money being spent. I am think juicebox pro at that point so I can get that extra and fatten up the mixture a little. I have always had a tendancy to run my bikes a little fat.

As far as the belt goes. I am going to adjust it myself without a suped up tension measuring device. I will have to prove to myself that it is needed, and I suspect that just normal common sense will probably just work. If I am wrong I guess it will cost me.

Anyway thanks for all the advice.

AND
You have to take the airbox off to get at the plugs?... Say it isn't so....For Petes sake

all the more reason to ditch that thing. But good to know.... I am going to check out the forums and see if I can find anything about the plugs..

Thanks all

Buy a Kirckett belt guage at your local NAPA dealer for $20 - use it at about the rear footpeg area on the top belt and set it to 180 lbs and you're good to go. :2thumbs:

 

[challman]

Buy a Kirckett belt guage at your local NAPA dealer for $20 - use it at about the rear footpeg area on the top belt and set it to 180 lbs and you're good to go. :2thumbs:

Wow thanks. I could always see what it reads now and use that for referance

 

[WackyDan]

That front plug is a pain.. and I could not get at it blind in a way that wouldn't risk damaging the wire.

I know of only one spyder tech (legend has it) that is able to do a front plug change without removing the airbox...

To get at it otherwise you need to remove the ENTIRE airbox, top and bottom shell.

 

[SpyderWolf]

As others have stated, the JB or JB Pro is a preference thing based on how your Spyder is running. Most of them had to have it when they went to the Kewlmetal or Evoluzione intakes. I am running a K&N filter in the stock air box, along with the Hindle, and got the O2 modifier installed. That did the trick for my backfiring issues. I did have to rip the airbox apart to change my front plug, and if I have to do it again will likely look at those other intakes.

As for accessories, if there is something you have a question about you can always post it on here. Chances are at least a few of us may have it already and will be more than happy to tell you about it and post better pictures as well. :thumbup:

The Spyder is growing in popularity, but there still aren't nearly as many of them produced as the other brands out there, and the dealer network is much sparser. Hopefully the network will continue to grow and production will increase so there will be many more Spyder friends on the road.

 

[ataDude]

Wow thanks. I could always see what it reads now and use that for referance

Make it a Kricket II. K-I has a scale that is unusable for this belt.

 

[Bob Denman]

Will you please swat that little bug?? :ani29:
Krickitt II and 180 lbs by the peg... :thumbup:

 

[Firefly]

Wow thanks. I could always see what it reads now and use that for referance

Yup-- that is what some of us did and how we came up with the 180 number---- when the bike is jacked up !