Disappointment

[retired1]

Scudrunner;
If I recall correctly there was a poll done on ages of owners, I don't remember the post date.
Riding the RTS does take a little more concentration, but to me the amenities more than make up for any of the perceived shortcomings of the bike. Just my opinion.

 

[Dwight]

Scotty,

I think you are absolutely correct about the handling. I've adjusted my front shocks up to max settings, added air to the front tires, and adjusted rear suspension to max also. Two up, doesn't help much. I'm at the point of seeing if front alignment needs work. The handling on this thing reminds me of a dirt track car with toe in. It's all over the place! I don't know what the civilian term for it is but I suspect we may also be dealing with bump steer issues. I am also a long time rider, 46 years. I've owned 3 conventional trikes, Honda and two Harleys, with a total trike mileage of 70K miles. I also have many thousands of miles on sidecars. Total mileage during my lifetime is close to 300K. I've also spent a lot of time racing, mostly dirt, but I have won a few pavement races. My race vehicles were built by me. That doesn't make me an expert but it helps to put things in perspective. I don't think I've ever driven or ridden anything that requires more concentration than this RT. My other trikes could be ridden in a pretty relaxed condition. The RT requires 100% of your attention. It hunts and wanders even on good roads. I thought with the 2 in front setup that it would be more stable, such is not the case. I’m also disappointed in the RT. I will install the sway bar as soon as it’s available, I don’t think that’s going to be a cure all but it will surely help. The next step is to check the alignment, all three wheels, and maybe experiment with different settings. My race cars, even on pavement, liked just enough toe out to be measurable – maybe that’s what I need on the RT? I have my Harley/CSC for sale, I hate to admit it but I’m having second thoughts.

I’ve had no other serious problems, well I guess the “yaw sensor” was but that was corrected by the dealer. No real complaints overall other than the handling. We still love the concept but if I can’t get the handling any better the Harley may come off the for sale list.

Dwight

 

[WaltH]

Scotty:

I hope to see you in Cuba (Missouri), and if I do, I want you to ride my GS/RS so you can feel what it is like to have car tires on the front wheels. I love the way my Spyder goes around a corner. It is rock solid. An expensive sports car could not do better. It surely was not that way in the beginning. A big part of the improvement comes from the car tires. Of course, I have done other things as well, including RT shocks and the sway bar.

I understand you are having handling problems that go beyond just cornering, but I don't want you to overlook the potential of changing tires. This is an inexpensive modification. I also understand that the GS/RS has different aerodynamic characteristics.

If I don't see you in Cuba, I am sure I will see you at the "Homecoming".

 

[scudrunner]

Old enough to remember and driven a Ford Edsel- one time.:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:

So THAT'S why you are grumpy!!! roflmao

 

[boborgera]

Scotty,

I think you are absolutely correct about the handling. I've adjusted my front shocks up to max settings, added air to the front tires, and adjusted rear suspension to max also. Two up, doesn't help much. I'm at the point of seeing if front alignment needs work. The handling on this thing reminds me of a dirt track car with toe in. It's all over the place! I don't know what the civilian term for it is but I suspect we may also be dealing with bump steer issues. I am also a long time rider, 46 years. I've owned 3 conventional trikes, Honda and two Harleys, with a total trike mileage of 70K miles. I also have many thousands of miles on sidecars. Total mileage during my lifetime is close to 300K. I've also spent a lot of time racing, mostly dirt, but I have won a few pavement races. My race vehicles were built by me. That doesn't make me an expert but it helps to put things in perspective. I don't think I've ever driven or ridden anything that requires more concentration than this RT. My other trikes could be ridden in a pretty relaxed condition. The RT requires 100% of your attention. It hunts and wanders even on good roads. I thought with the 2 in front setup that it would be more stable, such is not the case. I’m also disappointed in the RT. I will install the sway bar as soon as it’s available, I don’t think that’s going to be a cure all but it will surely help. The next step is to check the alignment, all three wheels, and maybe experiment with different settings. My race cars, even on pavement, liked just enough toe out to be measurable – maybe that’s what I need on the RT? I have my Harley/CSC for sale, I hate to admit it but I’m having second thoughts.

I’ve had no other serious problems, well I guess the “yaw sensor” was but that was corrected by the dealer. No real complaints overall other than the handling. We still love the concept but if I can’t get the handling any better the Harley may come off the for sale list.

Dwight

Just wondering' Why didn't the few that have free rides mention how bad the handling is, and not just sugar coat it?
[i guess the free part answers that]
How many company's can sell 25thou.$ cars and you have to add your own suspension parts to make it handle right and stay in business?

 

[fredace]

FWIW, I've switched to Elka shocks and that has made a very large difference in the handling and cornering. As a matter of fact, this weekend I had a passenger for the first time and I actually thought the RT-S handled better two-up.
It's too bad that you'd need to spend like $700 for different shocks, but they did do the trick.

 

[NancysToy]

Grrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr!

But do you think just by changing shocks and adding a sway bar will resolve the handling issue?

Thanks..

Unsure of that, as yet, and unfortunately there is only one way to find out. One thing is for certain...sure can't hurt.

 

[grumpybob]

So THAT'S why you are grumpy!!! roflmao

Don't want to interrupt the importance of this thread, but that is just one of many reasons.

 

[Roaddog2]

Scotty, definitely get it to your dealer for the gauge and the plugs problem, hopefully they can make it right. Maybe call Carlo and see if you can get new panels that have a decent paint job as well, no way a new PE should have those kinds of problems in the paint. Don't know what to say about the handling, maybe, Ken's sway bar would be just the ticket to make it handle the way you want, just throwing ideas at you. Good luck my friend, looking forward to spyder rides with you this year.

:agree:just found a slight flaw on my gas tank in Decaling under clear coat new tank ordered no questions asked :thumbup:Stay right on there butts Scotty and get paint and all your concerns fixed.:gaah:

 

[NancysToy]

No buyer's remorse, just serious disappointment, Lamont. I want the RTS with all my heart...I just want it to be predictable and safe. Everything that the GS/RS is, handling-wise and relaxed riding-wise, my RTS is not! That is a blow to me. You know I love the Spyder. As was said, this thing requires 100% concentration. It has also been unpredictable. My experience mixed in with the semis on the highway was unnerving...even to an old racer like me. Not a lock-to-lock wobble, but several inches in each direction. You certainly could not one hand it. Shot me onto the opposite shoulder when I pulled out to pass, and I barely retained control. Worst I have ever ridden in thousands and thousands of miles. I am no rookie!

The bad brakes are the clincher. It is unsafe at highway speeds in this condition. I don't want to b***h, get sympathy, or throw rocks. I just want a safe, sane ride, like the one the RS has provided. We'll see what the dealer comes up with, but they have ignored the paint, plugs, and gauge thus far, so I really don't expect miracles. I will spend what is necessary (reluctantly), and either cure it or park it. It is nobody's worry but my own. I still think a punch list of nearly 25 items on a luxury tourer is a bit much, however. I don't think it is wrong to be disappointed...or to say so.

 

[Roaddog2]

Scotty, it's very sad to hear you say these things. I remember the excitement and anticipation you had for your new RT. With you having one of the most calm, level, and fair demeanors on this board, I'm sure it wasn't easy for you to post this.

But I also believe that this is a fair assessment. With the wealth of experience that you have, I believe every word. And fair is fair, so even the undesirable should be reported.

I agree completely with you. A nearly $30,000 machine should not need more money thrown at it to attempt to overcome ''poor workmanship, poor performance, and bad handling". Shame on BRP :lecturef_smilie:

I see that some responders here would have you accept the shortcomings, and chalk it up to it being a new product...... If that's the case, BRP should have sold it at an introductory price. But they didn't, and you are correct to not accept it as such. I guess it's much easier to look past the shortcomings of the product when it's not your $30,000 that you are offering advice about.:dontknow:

My advice is to talk publicly, frequently, and loudly about your displeasure. BRP will hear it and will have to do something. If there is no public awareness, how does it make things better for the next guy? Giving the manufacturer a 'free ride', or 'the benefit of the doubt' only empowers them to continue their mediocrity.

You can bet Carlo will be calling you now, trying to smooth the ripples, and for your sake I hope he can. But after spending the $$, and raising these points, I hope he doesn't talk you , or any other like-minded RT buyers for that matter, into settling for accepting these shortfalls.....:doorag:

:agree:could have not said it better :ani29:

 

[frank3]

Scotty, Thoughts & Support

WOW. After reading all of this, I'm very concerned. I have great respect for Scotty and his opnions. If ever I have any questions concerning my RT, I always look for Scotty's reply or his posts about those topics. I'm a novice ridder but really enjoy my Rt. I have also noticed the wind effects on the Rt and issues following a semi. I cross a lot of that off to the wider front track on the RT. Needless to say, with the really wide front track, alignment is vitally important. I haven't noticed much "wandering" with mine on better paved surfaces but it gets real itchy when on well worn highway surfaces. It's always looking for the track and never quite matches the one worn in the pavement. I am also disappointed with the paint, although, I don't have any sags or bubbles, I come from a auto facotry background and know paint quality is easier to acheive than demonstrated on my RT. I pray Carlo has read all of this and is just as alarmed as I am. I would really hate to lose Scotty's input and advise concerning the RT. Scotty, your problems will be on my mind for a long time. I hope BRP is listening and responds quickly. BTW, I think you need to find another dealer.

 

[M2Wild]

FWIW, I've switched to Elka shocks and that has made a very large difference in the handling and cornering. As a matter of fact, this weekend I had a passenger for the first time and I actually thought the RT-S handled better two-up.
It's too bad that you'd need to spend like $700 for different shocks, but they did do the trick.

Unsure of that, as yet, and unfortunately there is only one way to find out. One thing is for certain...sure can't hurt.

Too bad BRP won't pickup the tab for the fix.

 

[bcspyder]

Scotty, sorry to hear about your problems so far. The first time I saw the RT I wondered about the suspensions capability to handle the added weight and height. Without a way better suspension I thought it might be too top heavy. My main concern is the lack of service from your dealer. That they glossed over things or ignored your concerns is totally unacceptable. You do not seem to be the yelling and screaming type so the dealer should be doing his best to make you happy. Unfortunately, I think this is the reason for alot of unhappiness with Spyder ownership and the difficulty nailing down the steering issues. The dealer network is not very good. I am not sure if this has been discussed but I wonder the percentage of dealers that also carry motorcycle lines. If you are at a Can Am specific dealer those techs have only experienced off road machines that when things go wrong it is inconvenient but not critical. Things going wrong at 60 mph can be VERY critical! Hopefully we can continue to have techs contribute here.

 

[csmead]

oh Scotty...

So sad to hear your troubles. Please join me in a private "pity party" moment; for your RT and the loss of my RS. Fortunately or unfortunately my RT is on the way. Let us hope that my RT has less personal issues than my RS, because I would like to make up for a year's lost riding time!
Keep us informed with any updates or patches they provide you with!

 

[boborgera]

Old enough to remember and driven a Ford Edsel- one time.:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:

And the push button auto trans, in the middle of the steering wheel :yikes:

 

[G-Man]

HELLO SPYDER LOVERS I AM A TECHNICIAN TRAINED BY THE FACTORY TO SERVICE THESE VEHICLES AND A LOT OF THE COMPLAINTS THAT U ARE HAVING ARE ACTUALLY PRETTY COMMON ISSUES. SPARK PLUGS FOULING ARE VERY COMMON AND I CAN TELL YOU THAT YOU ARE NOT GOING TO CHANGE THE SPARK PLUGS YOURSELF SO I DONT SEE WHY YOU WOULD CARRY NEW PLUGS. I CAN PRETTY MUCH GUARANTEE ALSO THAT WHEN U HAD YOUR PLUGS CHANGED THAT THEY ONLY DID 1 SIDE THAT IS PROBABLY WHY YOU CONTINUED TO EXPIERIENCE THE PROBLEM. EVERY SPYDER I HAVE EVER CHANGED THE SPARK PLUGS ON IMMEDIATELY RIDE BETTER AND DO NOT CONTINUE TO HAVE STARTING ISSUES. AS FAR AS YOUR STEERING IS CONCERNED THAT IS ALSO A COMMON PROBLEM IF YOU ARE EXPIERIENCING THE UNIT PULLING OR WANDERING BY ITSELF THEN U ARE PROBABLY NEEDING A NEW DPS UNIT. I HAVE REALLY GOTTEN A LOT OF MIXED REVIEWS ON THE SPYDERS AND WOULD REALLY LIKE TO GET A GOOD REVIEW OF THESE THINGS OUT THERE SO THAT EVERYONE CAN BE HAPPY AND WE CAN CONTINUE TO GROW.

Think about it befor giving this poster (poser?) any credibility. (?)

 

[tatt2r]

Take a deep breath and then let it go. Scotty probably has more mechanical experience than you will ever dream of and if you read his post correctly, the plug fouled on the FIRST ride. That is unacceptable. And, he can probably change both plugs faster than you can change ONE. If a unit that sells for $26,000 needs ANYTHING done to it before 25,000 miles, then the factory people better get a grip on it and get off their stuffed chairs and get to work. And, btw, any reason for your CAPS? Are you trying to impress us with your knowledge by using the CAPS? I am blasting you because you have posted without cause or knowledge and demeaned one of my good friends.

give um hell Dudley

 

[tatt2r]

(quote from lamonster) The Spyder ate a spark plug the very first day. It continues to do so. Hard starting, plug fouling, misfiring at highway speeds...and a response from the tech to "never start it unless you are going to ride it"
I have no idea why you and others seem to be fouling plugs on the RT but it does have something to do with starting it and not riding it. This needs to be reported to BRP so they can look into this.


not to tell scotty anything about tech knowing he is a lot more informed than me... but i was told the same thing by my dealer when i bought my PE not to start it unless i was driving it or it could foul plugs...

 

[Neez]

Before I would spend all that coin to "upgrade" to that fancy-pants wallowing elephant, I would far rather spend the money customising my GS with every concievable worthwhile aftermarket goody, plus a knock-out paint job. You would end up with a worthwhile ryde. I mean, inadequate brakes ? Orange peel? Wonky handling? Fouling plugs? Scotty, deal that sorry beast and build a real Spyder!