Warning bike goes into auto pilet, and accellerates itself.

[vt228]

pushing SE5

I'm assuming this is an SE5?pps:

What was the message on the display?:helpsmilie:


If you don't have the BEST warranty that covers towing to the nearest dealeror home - your Insurance should cover it. I've never had car insurance that didn't cover towing fees. Some pay up front - some reimburse you later.
You Don't you have AAA it covers anything you drive for towing I have the gold card good for 200 miles on flatbed :shocked: you didn't get it towed to dealers or home or friends house but two to three miles triple A' would be my first call then friend to stay with you .even a friend would have AAA :lecturef_smilie:
Please do post what your dealer finds out and why it did this....

 

[Firefly]

Good points Widow - but maybe the SE5 has *some* throttle control via computer? Does it blip the throttle down when shifting - in particular the auto-downshift? Probably just cuts ignition for a brief second when auto-downshifting.

And as far as skipping from 1st straight into 3rd - pretty much impossible with this tranny - if it's the same tranny as us SM5 owners have.

Very strange indeed.

 

[FANG]

There is a bit of fine print. The BEST contract spells out a maximum coverage of $200 per occurance, the customer is responsible for any costs above $200. Doubt you'll get 500 miles out of them for that money.
-Scotty

That is why I said a maximum of 50 miles - because mine had to e towed to the nearest dealer -- 60 miles away and it cost me an additional $25 for the tow. Wrecker company would not tow until they got the guaranty that the additional would be paid. I called the dealer and they paid it and added it to my bill for the visit - repair was covered under warranty but 6000 mi service was also done.

 

[wyliec]

I also believe the proper term would be kill-switch. It's always how I turn my bike on and off - ALWAYS.

I'm curious as to why you turn your bike on and off with the kill switch.

 

[Donk45]

I'm curious as to why you turn your bike on and off with the kill switch.

So you are prepared in case of an emergency.

 

[retread]

I'm curious as to why you turn your bike on and off with the kill switch.

One of the first things covered in a MSF beginner's class. If it doesn't cooperate, kill it.

john

 

[wyliec]

One of the first things covered in a MSF beginner's class. If it doesn't cooperate, kill it.

john

So, when you park your bike, you shut it off by the kill switch and then turn the ignition switch off? Then, when you want to turn the bike back on, you turn the kill switch off? Firefly wasn't just talking in case of an emergency. It sounds as though that is his normal procedure for starting/stopping the bike.

 

[beka]

So, when you park your bike, you shut it off by the kill switch and then turn the ignition switch off? Then, when you want to turn the bike back on, you turn the kill switch off? Firefly wasn't just talking in case of an emergency. It sounds as though that is his normal procedure for starting/stopping the bike.

Yup. If you always use it, it becomes reflexive. It works. When I dropped my 2 wheeler, I hit the kill switch without even thinking about it. It's a very good habit to have.

 

[dltang]

So, when you park your bike, you shut it off by the kill switch and then turn the ignition switch off? Then, when you want to turn the bike back on, you turn the kill switch off? Firefly wasn't just talking in case of an emergency. It sounds as though that is his normal procedure for starting/stopping the bike.

I always turn my spyder off with the Kill switch. It is a good habit to form. When I am ready to restart the spyder, as you mentioned, I turn off the Kill switch, and start it back up.

 

[Firefly]

So, when you park your bike, you shut it off by the kill switch and then turn the ignition switch off? Then, when you want to turn the bike back on, you turn the kill switch off? Firefly wasn't just talking in case of an emergency. It sounds as though that is his normal procedure for starting/stopping the bike.

Yup - I always turn off using the kill switch and then the key - and always turn back on in the reverse order. This programs your brain to know how to shut the bike off in case of needing to do so in a hurry. If your brain is programmed to use the key to turn the bike off - then that will be your first reaction during an emergency - which would be dangerous because you would be removing your hand from the handlebar to reach for the key.

Everyone should also read their manual and practice an emergency shutdown - so you know what to expect. They detail this somewhere in the manual.

 

[SSPSpyder]

Just completed my MSF course this weekend - the order of shut-off is emergency switch on handlebar then ignition key.

1. if you are at speed and need to kill the engine, you don't have to take your hand off the handlebar, ensuring you maintain stability,

2. by using the emergency switch on the handlebar every time you start or stop the bike you ingrain the action into your brain and muscle memory so if/when an emergency occurs it is a reflexive/automatic action to kill your engine ASAP.

BTW, I would recommend the MSF course with :2thumbs:

Firefly - looks like we had the same thought at the same time, but you must be a faster typist!

 

[widowmaker2011]

Good points Widow - but maybe the SE5 has *some* throttle control via computer? Does it blip the throttle down when shifting - in particular the auto-downshift? Probably just cuts ignition for a brief second when auto-downshifting.

And as far as skipping from 1st straight into 3rd - pretty much impossible with this tranny - if it's the same tranny as us SM5 owners have.

Very strange indeed.

Thats a good point , I only remember learning about momentary ignition kill at the shift points , but maybe. I just looked and dont see anywhere that there are servos or anything attached to the cables so I don't think so. heck I've been wrong before though. hmm maybe I am wrong , I found this-
Electronics tied into the engine management system blip the throttle on downshifts. These occur automatically (based on several effective algorithms) or manually (triggered by the bar-mounted shift toggle).

 

[Firefly]

Maybe it was an auto-downshift from 4th that went awry and made him think it was increasing the throttle? Not sure if he's a new rider with low miles still getting used to the Spyder - but I agree with you that there shouldn't be any way the computer could increase the RPMs by itself, or skip over a gear. Maybe he needs some Royal Purple---- ;-). BTW - my RP runs great - but the smell is still bothering me!

 

[nater1]

Issues leading up to this were 3 times in shop for shifting issues

My spyder has been in the shop three times so far for the same problems of not shifting into reverse, not shifting into 1st, not shifting out of first, not down shifting out of 4 th in these first 2,900 miles. When the N to R or first gear happens the rmps tend to be around 1900, unlike when there is no problem it idles at 1400 rpms. Also when I let it warm up before riding off it will not shift to 1st or reverse which has lead to this scary ride. They only way to resolve that issue is to shut the bike off, and wait two minutes then restart then it would work fine. But if you did not wait a estimated two minutes the bike would not go through normal start up procedure of the gauge resting, and scrolling the acknowledge message mode.

1. They installed grounds a 500 mile service.
2. They up loaded new software second time in shop.
3. They installed a new angle rotating sensor the third time in shop.

You can second guess me, or discredit me but BRP, and the dealer appeared to have a idea of what was going on so we will all learn what they come up with. I understand this my take a few days or so.

Also I have read as I am personally learning about my bike that some other people have had issues with their spyders a stop signs.

rleathen

Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Ontario
Posts: 6

SE5 transmission problems ????
I have a 2008 SE5 Spyder. Normally when I come to a stop at a red light the transmission automatically downshifts to 1st and I can take my foot off the brake and the bike either stays stationary or very very slowly crawls forward. I have noticed that after a hard stop the the transmission still downshift to 1st but I must maintain constant brake pressure otherwise the bike wants to go forward almost as if I am throttling it up. I have noticed that the harder the stop, the more prominent the problems is.

Has anybody else had any similar issues or is this "normal" for this type of transmission and centrifugal clutch ?

Thanks in advance for any assistance offered.


kdsd731

Spyder Tech.
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: so cal
Posts: 24

hi, i work at berts mega mall, a large spyder dealer and am the highest trained spyder tech there. the E message is nothing to worry about, on the manual transmission, it occurs if the driver does a slow shift and on the semi auto, sometimes it pops up going in or out of neutral because the shift drum didn't completely rotate and make contact with the sensor, if you roll it forward or back it will pop into the gear. but there is no concerns to be having if that message comes up. and for the accelerating from a stop with no throttle applied. we had our 1st one come in for that the other day. i called our can am dealer tech line and spoke with them. they told me, they are aware of this issue, but at this moment they have no diagnostic steps to be made nor do they have a fix for it. they told me they have someone looking into it right now since they know this is a huge safety issue. he advised me to let the customer take the spyder as is and just ride with caution until there is a fix for it. im sure it will be a safety recall as soon as they figure it out. if you have any other questions message me, i am very knowledgable on the spyder.

10-22-2008, 06:42 PM
kdsd731

Spyder Tech.
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: so cal
Posts: 24

i had my service advisor talk with can am today and asked about any conclusions to the lurching forward issues. he said so far, to check the throttle position sensor setting and that the "blippers" are sticking sometimes. not sure yet what the blippers are, i am assuming the rollers in the clutch assembly. i will keep keep you posted to any more answers i can find.

 

[nater1]

Do you think BRP told them to let a customer ride it

Do you think BRP told them to let a customer ride it even though they know, and acknowledge it is a safety issue? So tell the rider to be careful till we figure a fix out for it. I am kind of ****ting about this one if it is true that they may tell me to be careful.



kdsd731
Spyder Tech.
Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: so cal
Posts: 24



hi, i work at berts mega mall, a large spyder dealer and am the highest trained spyder tech there. the E message is nothing to worry about, on the manual transmission, it occurs if the driver does a slow shift and on the semi auto, sometimes it pops up going in or out of neutral because the shift drum didn't completely rotate and make contact with the sensor, if you roll it forward or back it will pop into the gear. but there is no concerns to be having if that message comes up. and for the accelerating from a stop with no throttle applied. we had our 1st one come in for that the other day. i called our can am dealer tech line and spoke with them. they told me, they are aware of this issue, but at this moment they have no diagnostic steps to be made nor do they have a fix for it. they told me they have someone looking into it right now since they know this is a huge safety issue. he advised me to let the customer take the spyder as is and just ride with caution until there is a fix for it. im sure it will be a safety recall as soon as they figure it out. if you have any other questions message me, i am very knowledgable on the spyder.

 

[Firefly]

Want the permanent fix--- get an SM5.

I really think BRP dropped the ball by not allowing the SE5 to also operate in FULL manual mode. My dealer fully expected shifting problems with these - told me that back in 2007.

Riding with caution should always be the case on any MC - and knowing your machine well and the proper technique for an emergency shutdown and how to get her back on the road.

It's my understanding there is a fairly simple procedure in the SE5 manual that shows how to get the bike out of a gear should it become stuck - so they obviously knew this may occur.

Many have reported creeping forward at stop signs while in gear (and you should stay in gear btw). Basic 'fix' was to apply foot brake just like you would with a car.

I really do feel for you SE5 guys - I would be none to happy with the various problems that have popped up.

 

[RoadHammer]

there should be zero tranny issues with se5's.
honda has been using autoshifting atv's, with selectable full auto shifting or manual auto clutchless shifting with next to zero issues.

BRP needs to get this done right cause its just stupid to have a streetbike that stalls, creeps and does all kinds of other crap that other autos dont do.

Imagine being in six lane traffic, bumper to bumper and your spyder decides to choke.. Your dead plain and simple...

HOnda or yamaha needs to come out with one of these asap. They'll get it done right..

 

[nater1]

How do recommend that Firefly?

1. Do I call them up, and say we have a problem I would like to discuss a resolution that is fair to BRP, and Myself. I have a 09 SE5 that retails for $18100 that as you know is having issues, and one huge scare. Should I tell them I really like the spyder, and its design but my safety concerns for the SE5 make it undesirable. So would they like to work out some deal where we can come to a mutual consensus that I trade them a $18100 SE5 for a $15100 SM5 give or take some maybe I agree to spend $900 more and purchase their best plan.

2. Or the other option send it of to a ball washing lawyer to get the state lemon law board to decide. Which will pretty much do the same thing.

Do they seem like reasonable people at BRP Firefly to do your recommended approach.

 

[rleathen]

Nater1 the problems I was encountering were corrected when my dealer replaced the clutch rollers at the direction of BRP. Not sure if this is the solution to your problems however.

 

[Firefly]

1. Do I call them up, and say we have a problem I would like to discuss a resolution that is fair to BRP, and Myself. I have a 09 SE5 that retails for $18100 that as you know is having issues, and one huge scare. Should I tell them I really like the spyder, and its design but my safety concerns for the SE5 make it undesirable. So would they like to work out some deal where we can come to a mutual consensus that I trade them a $18100 SE5 for a $15100 SM5 give or take some maybe I agree to spend $900 more and purchase their best plan.

2. Or the other option send it of to a ball washing lawyer to get the state lemon law board to decide. Which will pretty much do the same thing.

Do they seem like reasonable people at BRP Firefly to do your recommended approach.

The trade for SM5 was in jest - doubt they would do it----

You can buy the BEST plan at any time - well worth the $$$ in my opinion.

Most SE5 owners have not had these problems - many have well over 10,000 trouble-free miles on them. If they can't fix it in a resonable amount of time - then you may need to turn the heat up. Lemon laws vary from state to state and in many states bikes do not fall under the lemon laws.

Good luck--- hopefully they won't keep your Spyder too long and can give you a concrete answer as to what happened and what the proper fix is.