Update: PE 1026 Fire

[WaltH]

As I reported earlier, my Spyder burned to the ground on May 4, 2009, without any warning of any kind. There were no sounds, no smells, no fault codes, no abnormal engine temperature, or anything else that would indicate a disaster was about to occur. It happened when I drove into my garage at the end of a ride. Before I stopped, smoke arose from the engine area on the right side of the motorcycle. I stopped, turned off the ignition, dismounted from the left side, grabbed the clutch lever, and pushed the Spyder back out of the garage. When I crossed the threshold of the garage, flames were already two feet high. I pushed the Spyder down the driveway, but not far enough as it turned out. I didn’t want to stick around because I was afraid the gas tank would explode (it never did). I called 911 and than grabbed the fire extinguisher from the wall of the garage. I couldn’t make the fire extinguisher work (later the firemen told me I just didn’t push hard enough) and since the 911 operator kept me on the line for a couple of minuets, it was too late for me to do any good. There was a water hose nearby, but I didn’t think to use it. It may not have been the smart thing to do anyway due to the nature of the fire. It took no more than three minuets for the flames to be raging thirty feet in the air. The heat was so intense that the house, and my pickup truck parked in the garage, were both damaged. The damage was mostly in the nature of paint and plastic melting from the heat. I should have pushed the Spyder further down the driveway. There was no fire in the garage. My truck was hot to the touch well after the fire was out. The fire trucks arrived in six minuets from the time of my 911 call (according to the fire department incident report). It seemed like six hours. The fire department made short work of the fire, which by this time was receding from its peak, but was still raging.

My Corbin saddlebags were filled with personal belongings of the kind motorcyclists carry when they travel. I was getting ready to take an overnight trip later in the week. All of this was lost along with a wallet, my cell phone, and my glasses (and a backup pair). The first thing I did later in the evening was to order new glasses (still waiting). I haven’t had time to get a new cell phone. There are so many things I will have to replace, if I am to continue riding.

I have long felt that I had a special Spyder, one with few mechanical problems of the kind reported by other owners. I was well beyond being concerned about whether it was a lemon, or not. I was sure it would easily go to 100,000 miles, and then I would sell it on eBay and I would get a new one. I had 36,500 miles on it when it died. Now we know that my Spyder was unique in a different way. It is the only Spyder to burn to the ground under its own volition??? It turned out to be the most dangerous Spyder of them all. I would gladly exchange this for some of those mechanical problems others have reported.

If the fire had started three minuets later, I could have lost my house. I would have been in the house sitting at my computer, totally unaware of the fire raging in the attached garage. If the fire had started when I was going down the road, I may have lost my life. If the fire had started on the left side, I would have dismounted on the right and may not have been able to reach the clutch lever, depending upon the location of the flames. When I turned off the ignition, the Spyder was in gear.

I feel that I came very close to possibly losing my life. It was only a matter of small differences in timing that saved me. Needless to say, I am a little apprehensive about getting another Spyder. This is mostly because I do not know what actually caused the fire. If I knew the cause, I could protect myself.

The insurance company is being very fair (Foremost). When I conclude my business with the insurance company and decide whether to get another Spyder, I will report to you in detail of the outcome of these things.

 

[Remmos]

Thanks for the update, and please continue. I know there are many interested parties watching...opcorn:

 

[Big Arm]

Spyder 1026, Thanks for keeping all of us updated. Please post again when and if they can pin-point the cause. Hope you and your family get thru this ordeal okay. This will be a time consuming process I'm sure. Thanks again and wishing you all the best !!!

 

[northramp]

Good Luck.. Keep us in the loop . And thanks to the big guy up there for watching over you ...:agree:

 

[Some Guy]

YIKES!!! :yikes:

I'm glad (as we all are) that you are OK and you didn't suffer more damage than you did. I'm sure you'll keep us all informed.

Mike

 

[dltang]

Spyder1026,
First of all, let me repeat as I said in the first thread, I am so glad you are safe and that you had little damage to your home and truck compared to what might have happened. Now remember, things don't always come out as intended when you type them in so please don't take these next few statements wrong. I have no idea what possibly could have started your spyder fire but I am sure, like many others on this forum, we can't wait to find out the results of any investigation. The next statement is the weird one. I have to say, I am glad this happened to a spyder with no mods. (you know what I mean here guys) If it turns out there was a problem with the actual spyder itself, it can not be blamed on any aftermarket devices or tinkering. Not that I would want this to happen to anyone for any reason mind you. So, once again, I will wait for your most current update, to see if they come up with a cause. One other question, have you been in contact with either BRP or your dealer and what have they had to say? I would think BRP would be very interested and want to send an investigator of their own out for this one.

 

[DynamoBT]

Grateful for the update. No additional comments from me only to reiterate what presence of mind you had to push the Spyder out of your garage. Yes, if the timing had been only slightly different the outcome could have been disasterous. A bit disconcerting that. But thank goodness it all happened as it did.

I appreciate that you are keeping us updated how the aftermath is progressing. There is a lot to process not just in hopefully determining what happened to cause the fire, but to work through your thoughts and emotions in reaction to the event as well.

It is completely understandable that you have reservations about replacing your Spyder with another. In the end, you can only do what you feel comfortable doing. Thanks again for keeping us updated.

 

[BRPjunkie]

While the dealer and BRP may be slow to respond, the insurance company will probably have someone looking at cause before they settle.

 

[NancysToy]

Thank you so much for the update. Sounds like you are having a difficult time with the whole thing, upon reflection, and rightly so. Every possibility you mentioned is very real. On the other hand, you and your family survived intact, with minimal damage to the house and truck (compared to what could have been). I personally would take that as an omen that I was in very good hands...and move on. I hope you are able to do so soon, and hopefully your plans will include another Spyder.

Yours is the only incident of this type that has been reported, as far as we know. There could be a dozen causes, but I wouldn't think any of them are common...or likely to happen to you again. I can't say for certain what I would do in your shoes. I know after a recent rear-end collision, I was reluctant to drive on that same road for several months, but eventually I was able to do so again. I hope you can get this out of your mind and ride a Spyder with a clear mind again, too. These things happen to cars, and even in houses. There are no guarantees!

I do think that this is an incident that should be reported to the NHTSA, if you have not already done so. That way, if it happens again somewhere else, a safety recall may be instituted. At any rate, it will encourage BRP to look at possible causes. Due to the damage, of course, the actual reason for your accident will likely never be known. My guess would be a split fuel tank, or a similar issue, but that's just conjecture. Raw fuel on a hot engine ignites quickly after you stop. I burned up a motorcycle that way once. It was fine until I parked.

Please know that you have all of us here thinking about you, and wishing you a good recovery and outcome. If that outcome includes another Spyder, so much the better. If not, we'll certainly understand.
-Scotty

 

[Tom in NM]

A difficult time, a great post!

1026, what an experience! And thanks for reminding us that none of us live in a world where everything is predictable and manageable.

Also, thanks for the complete and lucid description of your experiences. I have always believed that one of the best things that a person can do is to share experiences so others can learn and adjust their behavior without having to experience an event personally. Given your first posting, I had already thought through just what I would do in a similar occurrence. While all the preparation and practice in the world still won't always work the way we anticipate - it is still better than blind, dumbfounded panic.

I have already purchased a heavy duty fire-extinguisher for my motorcycle corral and am actively looking for a 'fire blanket'. It has also made me rethink some of the options on what and where I am storing my cycles, supplies, and gear.

Again, thanks so much for the info and being such a helpful and true member of the Spyder Community. You have my best wishes, thanks, and admiration.

Tom

 

[Roaddog2]

opcorn:opcorn:opcorn:

 

[SpyderByter]

Thanks for the update. I hope they find the cause and things are made right for you. Good luck.

 

[Firefly]

Nice to have an update-- a lot for you to finally take in and reflect.

I personally would get another Spyder---right away. Kind of like when a plane crashes and many are leery of getting on one very soon - I'm a bit different in that I would get right back on one - because the chances of such a thing happening TWICE are very slim.

You now have less of a chance of another Spyder fire than any of us other Spyder owners. Hope you'll be back on 3 wheels soon!

I've started parking mine outside and letting it cool down before pulling into my garage - just in case!

 

[Don in E Texas]

Thanks for the update on the tragic loss of your :spyder:...thankfully no other fire damage or personal injury occured.

I have more RV experence than motorcyle --- there are more than 20,000 RV fires reported each year and 5,000 (1/4) are caused by 12 volt wiring. Will melt the RV down to the axles.. My friend lost his Eagle bus conversion due to an electrical fire. I'm not suggesting this is the cause, just one of many possible reasons for the fire..

http://rvtravel.com/rvarticles/rv_fires-polk.shtml

don

 

[WaltH]

Spyder1026,
First of all, let me repeat as I said in the first thread, I am so glad you are safe and that you had little damage to your home and truck compared to what might have happened. Now remember, things don't always come out as intended when you type them in so please don't take these next few statements wrong. I have no idea what possibly could have started your spyder fire but I am sure, like many others on this forum, we can't wait to find out the results of any investigation. The next statement is the weird one. I have to say, I am glad this happened to a spyder with no mods. (you know what I mean here guys) If it turns out there was a problem with the actual spyder itself, it can not be blamed on any aftermarket devices or tinkering. Not that I would want this to happen to anyone for any reason mind you. So, once again, I will wait for your most current update, to see if they come up with a cause. One other question, have you been in contact with either BRP or your dealer and what have they had to say? I would think BRP would be very interested and want to send an investigator of their own out for this one.

Deb: I know what you are saying, however, I may not be a good example of a mod free Spyder. I had all of the popular modifications ($5,500 materials only), but only three of them had anything to do with electricity and they were all plug and play – BRP fog lights, NMN H.I.D headlights, and Ken’s power bus (installed, but not doing any work at the time). These were installed by a certified Harley Technician with many years of experience. His work was so meticulous and skillful you would think it was done at the factory. I watched everything he did. It could not have been done any better.

Everyone would like to know what caused the fire, but the cause is unknowable. To my knowledge, there is no investigation underway that will reveal the answer. There wasn’t much left of the Spyder because the fire consumed an incredible amount of physical material. The insurance company had the Spyder removed on the morning after the fire (for my benefit). A tow truck came to take the remains to a local salvage yard. The driver (young kid) hooked a cable to the Spyder and dragged it up the flat bed without regard for the preservation of any evidence. I was left with a large pile of debris and whatever evidence it might contain. I had a worker shovel the debris into bags which were taken away by Waste Management with the regular trash pickup. Whatever evidence remained is now in the landfill. If any of the interested parties wanted to do an investigation, it should have been done before the Spyder was moved. I would certainly have been agreeable to that.

It is not helpful for me to engage in the contemplation of hypothetical causes of the fire. There are many possibilities and no evidence to support any of them. No one wants to know the answer more than I do, but this will not happen. It is my sincere wish that no Spyder owner has this experience in the future.

 

[Big Arm]

Spyder1026, Thanks again for the update. Again, I do wish you all the best!

 

[Firefly]

Deb: I know what you are saying, however, I may not be a good example of a mod free Spyder. I had all of the popular modifications ($5,500 materials only), but only three of them had anything to do with electricity and they were all plug and play – BRP fog lights, NMN H.I.D headlights, and Ken’s power bus (installed, but not doing any work at the time). These were installed by a certified Harley Technician with many years of experience. His work was so meticulous and skillful you would think it was done at the factory. I watched everything he did. It could not have been done any better.

Everyone would like to know what caused the fire, but the cause is unknowable. To my knowledge, there is no investigation underway that will reveal the answer. There wasn’t much left of the Spyder because the fire consumed an incredible amount of physical material. The insurance company had the Spyder removed on the morning after the fire (for my benefit). A tow truck came to take the remains to a local salvage yard. The driver (young kid) hooked a cable to the Spyder and dragged it up the flat bed without regard for the preservation of any evidence. I was left with a large pile of debris and whatever evidence it might contain. I had a worker shovel the debris into bags which were taken away by Waste Management with the regular trash pickup. Whatever evidence remained is now in the landfill. If any of the interested parties wanted to do an investigation, it should have been done before the Spyder was moved. I would certainly have been agreeable to that.

It is not helpful for me to engage in the contemplation of hypothetical causes of the fire. There are many possibilities and no evidence to support any of them. No one wants to know the answer more than I do, but this will not happen. It is my sincere wish that no Spyder owner has this experience in the future.

I fully understand that you want to put this behind you and move on.......


But I'd be mad as hell if they didn't investigate the Spyder remains (wouldn't have let them move it an inch if it were me). Does BRP even know about this? Someone would have been able to determine the cause (BRP, NTSB, Fire Dept). Too late now unfortunately

Did you file a report online with the NTSB?

 

[BRPjunkie]

With all of the electrical and mechanical experts on this forum including those who have seen similar spontaneous combustion of bikes, there must be some reasonable explanation that can allow others to check for possible causes. Easy to assume a spark from an electrical source, but gas on hot surfaces could also be ignition source. With the rapid burst into flames, there must have been gas involved as it would seem without fuel any electrical type fire would smolder longer before flaming as this one did. No post mortem is possible on 1026, but those who do post accident assessment can look at routing of wires, hot surface locations, combustible material proximity, gas tank connections/welds and at least develop theories. BRP engineers are probably doing this right now, but will not go public with anything unless they can actually or theoretically recreate a plausible cause. Unfortunately, they blew up several 1968/69 Sea Doos before they recalled them.

 

[Firefly]

With all of the electrical and mechanical experts on this forum including those who have seen similar spontaneous combustion of bikes, there must be some reasonable explanation that can allow others to check for possible causes. Easy to assume a spark from an electrical source, but gas on hot surfaces could also be ignition source. With the rapid burst into flames, there must have been gas involved as it would seem without fuel any electrical type fire would smolder longer before flaming as this one did. No post mortem is possible on 1026, but those who do post accident assessment can look at routing of wires, hot surface locations, combustible material proximity, gas tank connections/welds and at least develop theories. BRP engineers are probably doing this right now, but will not go public with anything unless they can actually or theoretically recreate a plausible cause. Unfortunately, they blew up several 1968/69 Sea Doos before they recalled them.

Good points. BRP also had fire problems with some Ski-doo models a few years ago (2005 I think). They'll most likely have an 'upgrade' to something totally unrelated to fix it--- (think gear position sensor fixing steering - ).

You're right - had to have plenty of gas fueling the fire. Regardless of the ignition source (electrical spark, crossed wires that got red hot after a short, or hot engine/exhaust) - it's obvious that the FUEL got somewhere it shouldn't have been. I would center around that goofy gas evap canister that many have smelled strong fumes from. There have been quite a few people complaning about that gas smell - perhaps that should be a warning sign?


Did Spyder 1026 ever have that gas smell ?