Odd sound after head gasket replacement

[CLady]

I'm going to use this as my "hello" post and take the opportunity to ask for some assistance while I'm at it. I purchased a used 2013 ST-L SE5 with 5100 miles on it from a non-can-am dealer about a month and a half ago. It road great (aside from a transmission thing that I'll have a different dealer look at next year) and I took it to my local dealer for the 4600 mile service because I had no service history on it. During that service they found it had a leaking head gasket. They got it approved for warranty repair and I dropped it off on 10/6 and was told service was scheduled to start on 10/7 and I should be able to pick it up on that Saturday. Well, that didn't happen and they finally called me yesterday and told me it was done and that they had replaced the spark plugs because upon inspection they "looked warn" and I could pick it up.

Today I went to get it and luckily my boyfriend was following me when we left instead of the other way around because one of the rear turn signals/tail lights wasn't working at all. Took it back and they got that fixed. Ok, great time to head home! Well, on the way home I noticed that whenever I'm going between 40-45 mph it sounds like a jet engine. It's a loud whistling/howling noise that I can't explain other than sounding like a jet engine and is louder than the normal engine noise. I also noticed it intermittently when decelerating around 20mph. I don't think it's rpm dependent as I do know it did it in both 2nd and 3rd gear around 40mph. I will take it out again for a short ride over the weekend if it doesn't rain and verify again that it isn't tied to what rpm I'm at. So first question, does anyone have an idea what could cause that to happen. I don't remember it happening before I took it in for the warranty service and I am pretty sure I would have noticed it.

Second issue is that there is some kind of flaking material all over on the side where the belt is and only around the areas the belt is. It is the same color as the inside of the belt, light gray. I thought it was some kind of ash at first but it doesn't turn into a powder when pressed between two fingers. I looked at the belt and it doesn't appear to be damaged in any way. Is there something else that could cause it? I've cleaned it all off and I'll see if it is there again after I take it out this weekend.

I'm relatively certain they have never done a head gasket replacement before because they called me the Sat. they originally told me I could pick it up and said they "tried everything possible not to have to remove it but they were going to have to remove the engine from the frame. Maaaaaybe it would be ready middle of the week for pickup." When I called them mid week to see what the status was one of their techs told me how BRP has vastly underestimated the labor time and it was just going to take longer and maybe by that weekend.

Which brings me to my last question. If I can't figure out what this jet engine noise is and need to take it back in to be looked at I don't want to take it back to where the warranty repair was done. I don't trust them at all. From their appointments being appointments for drop-off and not for service (my 4600mile service appointment was dropped off first thing friday morning, the lady at service had no idea why I was there and it wasn't done until the end of the day after they were closed on saturday), to a repair I was told would be done in 4 days taking over 2 weeks, to a turn signal/tail light not working when I picked it up and finally to a weird engine noise i don't want to go back there. Is there any way I can take it to another dealer to check out the noise and possibly the flaking material if it is there again without footing the bill myself? Would I be able to call BRP and get authorization to have someone else look at it under the original case number?

Other dealers aren't real close to me but I'll make arrangements to take it elsewhere over going back to my local one.

I've been lurking on this forum for months now, ever since I decided I was going to buy one. Thanks to everyone I've seen here help others that post their problems. This is a fantastic resource. Sorry this turned out so long.

 

[Peter Aawen]

Check every visible joint you can find/see on the exhaust, it sounds like they haven't put that back together properly!! Generally, if it's an exhaust leak on one of the single pipes from the cylinder to the cat converter, it'll be a huffing noise that's related to rev speed (cos it's just one cylinder/pipe leaking) but from the cat converter (where the 2 pipes join into 1) back a leaky exhaust will often be a hissing noise like you describe it, especially if it's in front of a restrictive muffler.... :shocked:

The 'only at certain speeds' thing is a bit odd, exhaust leaks usually happen all the time, but hey, I'm just guessing, could well be something else. Still, check out the exhaust system carefully for leaks, might help to get down on the ground & close to listen for them at idle. :thumbup: Good Luck!

oh, & welcome to the wonderful world of Spyders & this Forum too.

 

[ARtraveler]

:welcome: and keep us posted on what happens.

I am not considered as a mechanical expert here--so will watch what others are going to say.

 

[Lastchance]

Check your belt alignment see if it's rubbing the inside flange on the rear pulley, a misaligned belt will cause a squealing sound if rubbing the inner lip on the pulley, if they had the engine out and didn't check alignment after that could be your sound.

 

[Peter Aawen]

And that ^^ could explain the grey dust stuff you found near the belt too!! Could be worth following up!

And since you need to get down there anyway if you're gonna listen for exhaust leaks, you might as well check that out while you're down that end of the bike & on the ground anyway.

One or the other may well be your problem!! :thumbup:

 

[CLady]

Thank you for the suggestions on what to check. My boyfriend took it out with a shorty helmet on and no earplugs to see if he could hear it better and where it's coming from. He said that to him it sounds like something rubbing and that it sounds like it's coming from the belt side of the engine and around the engine area. from a stop when accelerating it sounds like a belt squeel at first. I heard this a bit as well.

I took it out in a full face helmet with no earplugs and it still sounds like a jet engine to me but I notice it almost all the time now. If i'm just creeping along slowly I don't hear it but I think he may be right that it's a rubbing sound. I recorded my ride with my phone, cropped the audio down to one ~2min. section of it and put it up on soundcloud so check that and tell me what you all think from that noise. Just remember there is wind noise and it was in the pocket of my riding pants facing away from the engine.
https://soundcloud.com/celticlady-646269981/spyder

Here is a picture of the belt and one of the gray flakes I'm finding on the side panels and stuff. It's still just one the side where the belt is. I will take a ruler out and check the space between the belt and the flange. The manual says no less than .5mm. it may very well be touching it. Is there any room for adjustment on the pulley at the engine or does it just fit in one place with no side to side movement?

I laid down on the ground and looked at the coupling between the cat converter and muffler and it looks okay. I ran my fingernail around the flange and couldn't feel a gap at all.

The sound is more noticeable at certain speeds, especially the 40-50 range.

I'm wondering if it might be worth taking it to a different dealer and pay them to check the belt tension/alignment and take it for a ride so they can hear it. I really don't want to take it back to where I had it.

Thanks again for the help.

 

[Highwayman2013]

There should be some space between the inside flange and the belt. Your belt is not tracking correctly.
Welcome!

 

[Peter Aawen]

Yeah, after listening to it, I don't think that noise is an exhaust noise.....

 

[Lastchance]

I believe there is a lip or flange on the engine pulley on the outer edge, the adjustment can be done at the rear wheel, if the sound is coming from engine pulley it will stop when the rear is adjusted, as the belt on the rear moves out from the inner lip it does the opposite on the front and moves in. GOOD LUCK and the dealer that fixed it should do that no charge.

 

[happyspyder2039]

I'm going to use this as my "hello" post and take the opportunity to ask for some assistance while I'm at it. I purchased a used 2013 ST-L SE5 with 5100 miles on it from a non-can-am dealer about a month and a half ago. It road great (aside from a transmission thing that I'll have a different dealer look at next year) and I took it to my local dealer for the 4600 mile service because I had no service history on it. During that service they found it had a leaking head gasket. They got it approved for warranty repair and I dropped it off on 10/6 and was told service was scheduled to start on 10/7 and I should be able to pick it up on that Saturday. Well, that didn't happen and they finally called me yesterday and told me it was done and that they had replaced the spark plugs because upon inspection they "looked warn" and I could pick it up.

Today I went to get it and luckily my boyfriend was following me when we left instead of the other way around because one of the rear turn signals/tail lights wasn't working at all. Took it back and they got that fixed. Ok, great time to head home! Well, on the way home I noticed that whenever I'm going between 40-45 mph it sounds like a jet engine. It's a loud whistling/howling noise that I can't explain other than sounding like a jet engine and is louder than the normal engine noise. I also noticed it intermittently when decelerating around 20mph. I don't think it's rpm dependent as I do know it did it in both 2nd and 3rd gear around 40mph. I will take it out again for a short ride over the weekend if it doesn't rain and verify again that it isn't tied to what rpm I'm at. So first question, does anyone have an idea what could cause that to happen. I don't remember it happening before I took it in for the warranty service and I am pretty sure I would have noticed it.

Second issue is that there is some kind of flaking material all over on the side where the belt is and only around the areas the belt is. It is the same color as the inside of the belt, light gray. I thought it was some kind of ash at first but it doesn't turn into a powder when pressed between two fingers. I looked at the belt and it doesn't appear to be damaged in any way. Is there something else that could cause it? I've cleaned it all off and I'll see if it is there again after I take it out this weekend.

I'm relatively certain they have never done a head gasket replacement before because they called me the Sat. they originally told me I could pick it up and said they "tried everything possible not to have to remove it but they were going to have to remove the engine from the frame. Maaaaaybe it would be ready middle of the week for pickup." When I called them mid week to see what the status was one of their techs told me how BRP has vastly underestimated the labor time and it was just going to take longer and maybe by that weekend.

Which brings me to my last question. If I can't figure out what this jet engine noise is and need to take it back in to be looked at I don't want to take it back to where the warranty repair was done. I don't trust them at all. From their appointments being appointments for drop-off and not for service (my 4600mile service appointment was dropped off first thing friday morning, the lady at service had no idea why I was there and it wasn't done until the end of the day after they were closed on saturday), to a repair I was told would be done in 4 days taking over 2 weeks, to a turn signal/tail light not working when I picked it up and finally to a weird engine noise i don't want to go back there. Is there any way I can take it to another dealer to check out the noise and possibly the flaking material if it is there again without footing the bill myself? Would I be able to call BRP and get authorization to have someone else look at it under the original case number?

Other dealers aren't real close to me but I'll make arrangements to take it elsewhere over going back to my local one.

I've been lurking on this forum for months now, ever since I decided I was going to buy one. Thanks to everyone I've seen here help others that post their problems. This is a fantastic resource. Sorry this turned out so long.

sounds like belt wine.

 

[CLady]

Thanks for the replies. I don't have a feeler gauge or similar so I used paper and can't fit more than 2 sheets between the belt and flange. So yeah, I'll see about having that fixed. However, there appears to be an oil leak. There are some oil drips on the ground that I am certain were not there before. There was one right after I brought it home and I dried it out and wiped off the bottom of what looks like a skid plate below the engine figuring they just missed a little when cleaning it up. But now after my boyfriend taking it out and me there are two more spots from each time it was parked....sigh.

 

[chuck gross]

take it to Lifestyles they have the best mechanic in the state of Washington worth the drive to mount vernon.
The Spyder does take time to repair as the dealership has to have direction/approval from BRP to make a move and these are pretty high tech machines to work on.

 

[CLady]

Since it's leaking oil along with the other problems I mentioned I'll be calling the dealership that worked on it and have them fix it. If I take it anywhere else I'll have to pay for it and that isn't acceptable to me. I probably won't be able to drop it off until Saturday because of work. I'll post again when I see what they say about it.