Learned Something About Ceramic Coatings

[OldCowboy]

I was talking to a fellow in Springfield who does ceramic coatings. I was asking about how much it would cost to have my headpipes and cat bypass ceramic coated and how much it would help. He made a statement that stopped me in my tracks. He said, "You can't use ceramic coated exhaust systems with carbon fiber mufflers because the increased exhaust gas temps as a result of the ceramic coating will melt the carbon fiber shell."

So I guess people like me with carbon fiber mufflers need to stay away from ceramic coating our headpipes and cat bypasses.

 

[Purple Guy]

Good to know, thanks for passing that along! :thumbup:

 

[3 Wheel Addict]

I think that would depend on if the carbon fiber shell is an actual part of the muffler or is it an outer shell to make the muffler look nice. If the outer shell gets really hot during use then yes he's right but most motorcycle mufflers get warm but not excessively hot during use. I have the Akropovic on mine and it has a carbon end cap but that cap does not get really hot just warm.

 

[Bob Denman]

:shocked: Thanks for passing this along... :2thumbs:

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

He made a statement that stopped me in my tracks. He said, "You can't use ceramic coated exhaust systems with carbon fiber mufflers because the increased exhaust gas temps as a result of the ceramic coating will melt the carbon fiber shell."

So I guess people like me with carbon fiber mufflers need to stay away from ceramic coating our headpipes and cat bypasses.

? ? ? ? ? :hun: :hun: :hun: :hun:

You need to do some serious checking. Carbon does not melt. Thomas Edison used it for his first light bulb! It depends on what all the carbon fiber shell consists of. The resin, if such is used with the fiber, would be the stuff that may melt, but if it's epoxy it'll take a high heat. Much higher than what I would think exhaust would be. I view his comments with some real serious doubts. I'm not familiar with carbon fiber shells on exhaust systems so there might be some validity to what he is saying, but I sure wouldn't take it at face value without independent corroboration.

 

[SPYD3R]

HEADER PIPES are STEEL.... so is the CAT.... SS to be exact... most likely 410 SS...
I'm all too familiar with CERAMIC COATINGS from designing and building gas turbines (jet engines) for 40 yrs....
the CERAMIC COAT will keep the 'heat' inside the headers, and keep the outer surface cooler... this may be a 'FIX' for the 2013's that are having all the problems....

exactly, what is it that you are trying to do via the coating....?
Dan P
Easley, SC
SPYD3R

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

HEADER PIPES are STEEL.... so is the CAT.... SS to be exact... most likely 410 SS...
I'm all too familiar with CERAMIC COATINGS from designing and building gas turbines (jet engines) for 40 yrs....
the CERAMIC COAT will keep the 'heat' inside the headers, and keep the outer surface cooler... this may be a 'FIX' for the 2013's that are having all the problems....

exactly, what is it that you are trying to do via the coating....?
Dan P
Easley, SC
SPYD3R

From what I have read in other posts that exactly is the intent - reduce the heat radiation from the exhaust header and cat bypass (actually cat replacement). Apparently what the tech talking to the OP is saying is that the exhaust traveling down to the muffler will be hotter, enough hotter to melt the carbon fiber shell of the CF muffler.

From what I find by Googling the most likely end result would be faster deterioration of the muffler packing. It looks like a main use for CF mufflers is in racing, bikes and cars, in which case I would think exhaust temps will be greater than from a stock street engine.

 

[SNOOPY]

HEADER PIPES are STEEL.... so is the CAT.... SS to be exact... most likely 410 SS...
I'm all too familiar with CERAMIC COATINGS from designing and building gas turbines (jet engines) for 40 yrs....
the CERAMIC COAT will keep the 'heat' inside the headers, and keep the outer surface cooler... this may be a 'FIX' for the 2013's that are having all the problems....

exactly, what is it that you are trying to do via the coating....?
Dan P
Easley, SC
SPYD3R

True, but I think what the Op of the thread is saying is that that extra heat is then put on the muffler (or can increase it at the muffler) , hence the possiblity of effecting the carbon fiber. I don't see it affecting the carbon fiber as much as seeing it affect the clearcoat that is used to cover the fiber.

 

[OldCowboy]

All I can say is the fellow I was talking to is an engineer who's been in the ceramic coating business for over 15 years. When I told him I was looking to do this on my Spyder, that's when he volunteered the information. I hadn't told him I had a CF muffler, but he said they'd seen that result on motorcycles with CF mufflers. Since his company doesn't sell mufflers, I don't see any reason for him to be misinforming me.

All I know is I'm not going to be the guinea pig with my Two Brothers CF muffler.

 

[BMWpilot]

I'll let everyone know...

I picked up my headers from Jet-Hot OKC today. They should be installed back on the ST sometime this week, and I guess we'll find out how the Akropovic pipe holds up to the heat over the next few months. :shocked:

 

[billrob71]

The coating keeps the heat in the pipe and away from everything else, all the hot gas goes out the muffler. Can see a carbon fiber can getting hot enough to get damaged. Titanium or stainless would be the only way to go with aftermarket

 

[stewartj239]

I picked up my headers from Jet-Hot OKC today. They should be installed back on the ST sometime this week, and I guess we'll find out how the Akropovic pipe holds up to the heat over the next few months. :shocked:

View attachment 85649

I've got mine ceramic coated as well and I am running the Akrapovic. So far so good. I would be surprised if it got that hot at the end of the exhaust to damage anything.

 

[Flanker]

Hadn't heard that one before. Thanks for passing it on!

 

[SPYD1]

It would be nice if someone would perform a baseline temp on the exhaust prior and then one after putting on ceramic coated pipes to see what the change is. The heat has to go somewhere. I had my RS stock pipe ceramic coated and it runs cool to the touch. I didn't think of checking it prior.

 

[OldCowboy]

The engineer I spoke to had some graphs of before and after temps. The ceramic coated pipes had exhaust gas temps about 400*F higher than the non-coated pipes. He didn't say what the vehicle was and I didn't ask. But it was clear that there is a significant increase in exhaust gas temps at the end of the exhaust system with ceramic coated pipes.