Initial test of Monster Fuel ECM upgrade

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

ECU FLASH

Hmmm, yeah, did that while I was putting the Tupperware back on. Brought it up to full temp then shut it off. Plus there was a fair amount of idling and several key on/key off's on the ride... Bummer! With the amount of shipping time (even with 2-3 day it took longer than it was supposed to) and cost of shipping, I'm not gonna send it back.... Sometimes things don't work out or are not what you expected. Such is life... :doorag:

.If I were you ... I'd contact them and find out what's going on ..... NO ONE else here has reported Poor performance .... Mike :thumbup:

 

[Hypurone]

.If I were you ... I'd contact them and find out what's going on ..... NO ONE else here has reported Poor performance .... Mike :thumbup:

I get where you're coming from but I'm 99 percent sure he is gonna say he would need to "see it" to know..

What's weird is, I hit ALL of the rpm range repeatedly over and over during the ride but maybe it takes longer than a tank and a quarter. .. I'm just gonna run with it the way it is.

Just a bit bummed as others have noticed it being night and day right out of the box. ...

 

[Peteoz]

I get where you're coming from but I'm 99 percent sure he is gonna say he would need to "see it" to know..

What's weird is, I hit ALL of the rpm range repeatedly over and over during the ride but maybe it takes longer than a tank and a quarter. .. I'm just gonna run with it the way it is.

Just a bit bummed as others have noticed it being night and day right out of the box. ...

Yeah, he MIGHT say that, hypurone, but on the other hand, he might know exactly what the issue is. A phone call is definitely the best first course of action.

It's a bit unfair to publicly dismiss the upgrade as being a failure without giving them a chance to indentify what the issue may be.

Pete

 

[Dennis in Lodi]

Exactly on course for performance

Relax, Let me help with understanding on how this process works. This is NOT a plug and play performance gain. I tell everyone three things.
1. The ECU flash gains are much more noticeable for the 1330 motors that have the 79 tooth sprockets as they are the most restricted. The RT owner will notice the performance gains starting around 4,000 rpm. For the 1330 motors with the 89 tooth sprocket the real gains start to stand out around 6,800 to red line. The reason for this is because the Stock F3 winds out the first three gears so quickly now that unless you race for a living you won't really notice a couple of bike lengths.
2. For the F3S platform, and somewhat for the RT platform you have to have a need for the flash. I had a Daytona owner pm me saying he just doesn't feel anything. I asked where he is shifting and he replied between 3K and 4K. If you don't have the need for two up passing power on an RT or shift your F3S routinely above 5,000 rpm, the benefits of the flash won't rock you world.
3. It takes at least a tank and 1/2 of gas for the finale mapping to START to be in place. If you live in the city and are following friends around you won't be spending as much time ABOVE 60% throttle as someone who rides solo and lives in the rural area. The ECU is collecting Air to Fuel readings and is only getting the readings it needs to make adjustments above 60% throttle because below it is still stock. Can-Am programmed the ECU to make ONLY small fuel adjustments based on hundreds of input readings and this is a good thing.

So here is what you WILL get with a flash when finale mapping is in place. It takes between 300 to 500 miles for the ECU to collect the data it needs to make the finale mapping.
For an RT owner you will have huge roll on power improvements as you won't need to down shift as much to get the bike moving for two up passing or for some spirited riding with fast friends.
For the 89 tooth F3 owners you will be hard pressed to notice the gains while winding out the first three gears. The bike is just a LITTLE quicker in that area mostly because the stock bike is already very quick at slower speeds. Where the finale flash results really start to shine is when the F3S is under FULL load. This is higher speeds and 4th, 5th and 6th gears. If you have the Cat IN Place with an open exhaust pipe you will start to notice the bike is more willing to smoke the tire off the line and will hear some NEW tire chirping in 2nd gear acceleration. Then when you take a sweeping corner in 4th gear around 6,800 rpm and hold the throttle open the bike just snaps out the RPMs to red line. If you selected the stock 8,100 flash and were riding next to a totally stock F3S you would pull about 4 to 6 bike lengths. The advantage is even bigger in 5th and 6th gear for side by side.

At the end of the day, a flashed Spyder is only modestly faster than it was stock. There is still SPEED RESTRICTIONS keeping the 1330 motor from reaching full potential. I am just a tester for the ECU flashes and I have tested over 8 ECUs which are trying to remove the speed restrictions with no success. My understanding of this complex lingering task is that Can-Am intentionally disguised where this programming is in the ECU code. The Monster fuel team literally has spent huge time and resources on the speed restriction goal
When the upgrade ECU flash that finally gets the speed restrictions removed becomes available ANYONE who has paid for a flash gets the upgrade for free for the cost of shipping.
When the speed restrictions get removed and F3S will pull 5th and 6th gear cleanly to red line. Right now all F3S stall at 7,500 rpm / 105 MPH as the butterflies are starting to close down you fun.

Hope this helps
Dennis

 

[Wildrice]

Wildrice, what were your entries on the form? Not too sure about them but do think it wothwhile to have my ECM tuned.

I use 93 Octane on my 2015 F3's SE6, new redline is 8600. Going by the "Seat of my pants" which is not accurate--I feel different results on different days--"maybe I need new pants" :yes: I'm replacing the Cat for off the line performance, then I'll get a better feeling of the entire RPM spectrum. The Flash does add power in the upper RPM's.
Frankly I don''t see how the ECM could adjust itself while letting the Spyder idle, for the ECM to adjust for a better tune it needs to evaluate the setting at different RPM's.
Darrell

 

[Hypurone]

Yeah, he MIGHT say that, hypurone, but on the other hand, he might know exactly what the issue is. A phone call is definitely the best first course of action.

It's a bit unfair to publicly dismiss the upgrade as being a failure without giving them a chance to indentify what the issue may be.

Pete

Nowhere did I "dismiss" the upgrade in the sense that you are referring to. I simply stated it does not perform for me in the night and day fashion like what everyone else has been describing. The flash has to have "parameters" that must work right from the start or the engine will never achieve what the flash is designed to do. This "tank and a half" business etc is for short and long term fuel trims to build and be stored in the ECM tables thereby becoming "optimized" for said flash parameters. It isn't going to be like a light switch at that point. Simply more refined.

All I'm stating is that I was not impressed in the way that others have been so far and that I am OK with just moving on. I simply wanted to know which F3 Wildrice had as I haven't seen anyone else with an F3-S post up yet.

I have tried to call but his VM says he cannot accept calls at this time etc. I will PM him just out of curiosity to see if he has had any other issues like this. But as I stated I am OK at this point to just move on. It is a personal choice and by no means says anything dismissive about the flash.

 

[Peteoz]

Yeah, I understand, hypurone:thumbup: My comment was not so much about the interpretation of the word "dismiss", but more about giving the vendor a chance to perhaps explain what and why you are experiencing before you say that it's not meeting your expectations

 

[Hypurone]

Yeah, I understand, hypurone:thumbup: My comment was not so much about the interpretation of the word "dismiss", but more about giving the vendor a chance to perhaps explain what and why you are experiencing before you say that it's not meeting your expectations

:thumbup: Steve and I have been in touch and as I expected he cannot tell anything without having the ECM in his hands....

 

[Peteoz]

:thumbup: Steve and I have been in touch and as I expected he cannot tell anything without having the ECM in his hands....

Did you see Dennis' post number 24 on the previous page, Chuck?

Pete

 

[Hypurone]

Did you see Dennis' post number 24 on the previous page, Chuck?

Pete

Yup. Steve has not indicated any requirement for ECM learning. The available gains should be evident from the get go. There will be some fine tuning done over time but that is not what "makes" the flash what it is.
He said as well that the gains should be the same for all 1330 engines....

 

[Peteoz]

:thumbup: Steve and I have been in touch and as I expected he cannot tell anything without having the ECM in his hands....

Bugger !

 

[Hypurone]

Bugger !

Meh, I knew that was gonna be the answer.... :cus:!!

 

[Wildrice]

.If I were you ... I'd contact them and find out what's going on ..... NO ONE else here has reported Poor performance .... Mike :thumbup:

I am noticing a regular increase in performance with mileage. Initially the spyder showed power increases in the mid to upper rpm range--I didn't feel magic off the line. Now on tank of gas later I can burn some serious rubber. I took it out on the freeway & ran it up to 8600 in 4th gear--99-100 mph. Hit 110 mph in 5th until traffic jammed up. It was spinning the rear wheel after 10-15 mph. But I forgot to mention---I removed the Cat Bypass pipe & re-installed the Cat with the Big City Thunder Baffle in between the exhaust pipe & Cat entrance. Lost the loud noise--still have a touch of rap-off decelerating. I'll keep trying to test the top end when traffic allows but the 1st & especially 2nd gear performance is amazing plus for some reason the thumb shifting is much quicker--no delay--I like it:bowdown:. Best $400 I've spent on the Spyder by far.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

FLASH RESULTS

:clap: :yes: :yes: :yes::yes: :yes: :yes: :yes: ....................tHANKS FOR THE UPDATE ..............Mike

 

[Hypurone]

I am noticing a regular increase in performance with mileage. Initially the spyder showed power increases in the mid to upper rpm range--I didn't feel magic off the line. Now on tank of gas later I can burn some serious rubber. I took it out on the freeway & ran it up to 8600 in 4th gear--99-100 mph. Hit 110 mph in 5th until traffic jammed up. It was spinning the rear wheel after 10-15 mph. But I forgot to mention---I removed the Cat Bypass pipe & re-installed the Cat with the Big City Thunder Baffle in between the exhaust pipe & Cat entrance. Lost the loud noise--still have a touch of rap-off decelerating. I'll keep trying to test the top end when traffic allows but the 1st & especially 2nd gear performance is amazing plus for some reason the thumb shifting is much quicker--no delay--I like it:bowdown:. Best $400 I've spent on the Spyder by far.

Your first and second gear improvements are more from restoring the back pressure that the primary cat and muffler give. Still, glad you are pleased and I hope mine turns around but I don't hold much hope as it should all have been there from the get go according to Steve.... Except for the "fine tuning" that does happen as you amass more miles.....

 

[Wildrice]

Your first and second gear improvements are more from restoring the back pressure that the primary cat and muffler give. Still, glad you are pleased and I hope mine turns around but I don't hold much hope as it should all have been there from the get go according to Steve.... Except for the "fine tuning" that does happen as you amass more miles.....

Interesting problem:sour: I wish my local traffic would permit a better documented evaluation. But besides re-installing the Cat-- 1st, 2nd, 3rd & 4th gear have more jump from lower RPM to the redline & wearing down my rear tire brings a smile on my face.. I've always been disappointed with the shifting delay but now it's a very quick shift between gears. (supposedly not part of the ECM upgrade) Quite often after a slow shift into 2nd it would bog down & then take off. I mentioned it in the past & the guy responding thought I had a mental issue--he may have been right but the prior shifting sucked going into 2nd gear. Shifts like it should now.. I think returning the ECM to Peter for a re-flash is best--every modification line has an occasional error. Smart of you to bring the problem up & pursue a happy ending.
Wishing you the good luck you deserve,
Darrell

 

[Dennis in Lodi]

ECU and YOU learn together

Something dawned on me that with more miles on the ECU it's not just the ECU learning but the driver learning the flashed ECU shift points as well. I led a group of about a dozen mixed cycles today and at EVERY STOP they talked about how some things I was doing was giving them fits to match. I have learned where my cornering and acceleration advantages and limitations are. I lined up with a FAST rider on an FZ09 and told him to let me start first. I laid down about 25' of perfect starting rubber and nutted the 2nd and 3rd gear shifts at 8,600 rpm and had a big lead up to about 90 mph. He caught me but the road I selected didn't allow him enough room to pass before the next corner. He thinks I'm just about as fast as him but little did he know he was about to toast me if the road was straighter a little longer as I was quickly running out of steam.
What exhaust pipe are you using? Ackrpovic right? You shouldn't need the Thunder Baffle with an Akra.

I am noticing a regular increase in performance with mileage.

 

[Wildrice]

Something dawned on me that with more miles on the ECU it's not just the ECU learning but the driver learning the flashed ECU shift points as well. I led a group of about a dozen mixed cycles today and at EVERY STOP they talked about how some things I was doing was giving them fits to match. I have learned where my cornering and acceleration advantages and limitations are. I lined up with a FAST rider on an FZ09 and told him to let me start first. I laid down about 25' of perfect starting rubber and nutted the 2nd and 3rd gear shifts at 8,600 rpm and had a big lead up to about 90 mph. He caught me but the road I selected didn't allow him enough room to pass before the next corner. He thinks I'm just about as fast as him but little did he know he was about to toast me if the road was straighter a little longer as I was quickly running out of steam.
What exhaust pipe are you using? Ackrpovic right? You shouldn't need the Thunder Baffle with an Akra.

I am noticing a regular increase in performance with mileage.

Dennis--out accelerating a Yamaha FZ09 to 90 mph is awesome--I would have thought he'd be even with you at 50mph. I've had mixed thoughts on using the Big City Thunder Baffle with the Cat & Akrapovic straight shot silencer. It just may reduce my top end performance. Looking at the BCT baffle in the exhaust pipe it looked like minimal air could escape via the exhaust. I really hate taking those 3 springs off/on even with Doc's wire connector. I may need to fabricate a spring hook with a heavy bar for leverage--otherwise I'm stuck pulling the spring when no one else is around to guide the spring hook to the Cat. Anyone have a photo of the device their using to hook up the 3 springs??
Darrell

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

THIS WORKED FOR THE *ITCH TOP SPRING

Something dawned on me that with more miles on the ECU it's not just the ECU learning but the driver learning the flashed ECU shift points as well. I led a group of about a dozen mixed cycles today and at EVERY STOP they talked about how some things I was doing was giving them fits to match. I have learned where my cornering and acceleration advantages and limitations are. I lined up with a FAST rider on an FZ09 and told him to let me start first. I laid down about 25' of perfect starting rubber and nutted the 2nd and 3rd gear shifts at 8,600 rpm and had a big lead up to about 90 mph. He caught me but the road I selected didn't allow him enough room to pass before the next corner. He thinks I'm just about as fast as him but little did he know he was about to toast me if the road was straighter a little longer as I was quickly running out of steam.
What exhaust pipe are you using? Ackrpovic right? You shouldn't need the Thunder Baffle with an Akra.



Dennis--out accelerating a Yamaha FZ09 to 90 mph is awesome--I would have thought he'd be even with you at 50mph. I've had mixed thoughts on using the Big City Thunder Baffle with the Cat & Akrapovic straight shot silencer. It just may reduce my top end performance. Looking at the BCT baffle in the exhaust pipe it looked like minimal air could escape via the exhaust. I really hate taking those 3 springs off/on even with Doc's wire connector. I may need to fabricate a spring hook with a heavy bar for leverage--otherwise I'm stuck pulling the spring when no one else is around to guide the spring hook to the Cat. Anyone have a photo of the device their using to hook up the 3 springs??
Darrell

The others were pretty easy ..... I has a 1/8 by 1" wide piece of flat stock... I notched the end ( so it would bite ) and then drilled a small hole for a 1/8 th nail " back from the notch ... I bent the nail into a HOOK , since the nail had a top it won't pull thru ...... I just put the hook onto the spring and levered it off ...... I could put it on the same way ..... Mike :thumbup:

 

[Wildrice]

What exhaust pipe are you using? Ackrpovic right? You shouldn't need the Thunder Baffle with an Akra.

Dennis--I removed the BCT Baffle--now it's been raining the last 2 days:banghead:

Darrell