Help!

[spydersprad]

My dad and I each bought a spyder at the end of last year. Neither of us had any real experience with motorcycles before but we thought it would be fun to do this together. Well he has put about 600+ miles on his when it stopped shifting. So he took it in to be looked at and was told by the dealership/mechanic that the clutch was burnt out. The mechanic then told my dad that it was user error because he had been riding with it in too high a gear at too low of a speed. He said when going 50 mph that you should only be in 3rd gear. Maybe its my natural distrust of anybody I don't know but that doesn't seem right to me. Me and my dad both have always driven standard cars and trucks, and even 4 wheelers and have never gone 50 mph in only 3rd gear. I was hoping some of the more experienced riders could tell me if this is true and just a quirk of the spyder or is it the dealer trying to get out of fixing the motorcycle for free because its under warranty. How does everyone else drive their spyders? Thanks for any input!!

 

[retired1]

What model and transmission? There have been a couple of threads on clutch troubles.

 

[spyryder]

Sounds like you have the SE. Here's a thread from a few weeks ago where your rpm's should be above 3000. I don't think you'd need to be in 3rd at 50 though.
http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?40288-Auto-Clutch-Damage

 

[spydersprad]

Its an 2011 RTS with automatic transmission.

 

[Sny]

First question: Is it an SE? (semi-automatic transmission?)

Officially, the clutches will burn under 3200rpms on an RT with a semi-auto trans. This isn't an atv and it's certainly not a car.

Additionally, the engine is designed to be most efficient between 4500 and 7000 rpms.

BRP certified technicians have found that riders operating at low rpms (defined as under 3200 rpms) are damaging their clutches frequently and/or causing premature wear on the transmission components.

There has been no official statement from BRP directly on this that I know of... yet.

The general consensus is, shift above 4500 rpms so that you don't drop below 3500 rpms.

If you find yourself near or below 3500 rpms, downshift.

Do not cruise at or below 3500rpms for extended periods. You should be cruising over 4000 in most cases for best efficiency and mechanical longevity.

If you are in first there will be times you have to cruise under 3500 rpms, nothing you can do about that. But if you're in second, downshift for the sake of your transmission.

You'll find the motor more smooth and responsive at and over 4500rpms as well.

This is less of a problem on the RS's because it's hard to run them below 3500 rpms for very long. For an RS you want to move everything up by about 500-1000 rpms. (Shift at 5000-5500, cruise at 4500-5000)

You can burn up your clutches in 10 miles or in 10,000 miles or in 100,000 miles. It's all up to how much you abuse them.

 

[schnauzermom]

RPM'S

By all means I am not an expert, however, our dealer and other forum members have said you should be running between 4500 /5500 RPM's in any gear. I usually shift at 5300-5400 to next highest gear. It feels like it is lugging otherwise. And usually try to keep it above 4500. Again, I am a novice but this seems to work really well for me.

 

[schnauzermom]

P.S.

I also have a 2011 RT SE

 

[vrodrjs]

Sounds about right actually

If you have the semi-automatic transmission, I think what the dealer is telling you could be accurate. Some of the threads I have seen on here, one was started by a tech, talk about burning up the clutch from riding around below 4k RPM for extended periods. On my '12 RT that means anything below about 57 MPH and I am down in 3rd or 4th depending on where I am riding. The engine is a high RPM engine and relly doesn't get going until you get to about 3500 RPM. I can't believe the dealer won't cover it though.

 

[spydersprad]

Sounds like you have the SE. Here's a thread from a few weeks ago where your rpm's should be above 3000. I don't think you'd need to be in 3rd at 50 though.
http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?40288-Auto-Clutch-Damage

Thank you for that link. Very informative. We do have the RTS though, does that change anything? I'm sorry I'm not very good with cars or engines of any kind, so all this is greek to me, lol!

 

[spyryder]

Thank you for that link. Very informative. We do have the RTS though, does that change anything? I'm sorry I'm not very good with cars or engines of any kind, so all this is greek to me, lol!

Yes that thread would pertain to any Spyder with the automatic trans.

 

[can-am sam]

You came to the right place to get good advice. You will find if you shift at a higher rpm(above 4500rpm) the shifts will be faster and smoother. The engine really comes to life at higher rpms.

 

[spydersprad]

Wow I had no idea about the rpm's needing to be so high. So glad I came on here to ask my question. I know dealers and mechanics know about this but I tend to trust other riders more. I think the dealer told my dad they would fix it this time for no cost but if it happened again it wouldn't be covered. Like I said I'm more than a novice when it comes to motorcycles and knowing this information really helps. Thank you everybody for your replies!!

 

[DiverChix]

Wow I had no idea about the rpm's needing to be so high. So glad I came on here to ask my question. I know dealers and mechanics know about this but I tend to trust other riders more. I think the dealer told my dad they would fix it this time for no cost but if it happened again it wouldn't be covered. Like I said I'm more than a novice when it comes to motorcycles and knowing this information really helps. Thank you everybody for your replies!!

The dealer I bought my Spyder from told me what to do regarding shifting, and what works best for these machines. I would not have known about the RPM's needing to be so high either...It is too bad that you didn't get any advice up front :sour:

 

[Dudley]

The SE5 is not an "automatic" transmission. It is an electrically operated paddle shifter. You must use the shifter to get to higher gears and many times to give your engine the proper power range to operate efficiently, you must downshift using the paddle. If you are running in 5th gear, doing 30 mph and twist the throttle to to get to 60 mph in a hurry, your transmission is doomed...it's just a matter of time. The dealer should have gone over the Spyder and it's operation before you ever left the parking lot of the dealer. Also, reading the Owner's Manual reveals a lot of information on the Spyder than covers safety to minor things to do and/or look for before you ride it. My suggestion, if the dealer slacked up on that responsibility, is go back to him with your Spyder and with your dad and have them give you both a thorough schooling on the Spyder. Before you do this, both of you should go over the whole Owner's Manual to be able to ask some good questions of things that still baffle you.

 

[Bob Denman]

Welcome aboard! :2thumbs:
Sorry to hear that your Dad's machine is having such an issue. :shocked:
I was one of those "low and slow" shifters for about the first 800 miles of ownership. Then we had the thread started here that mentioned that the clutches don't lock up until 3200 rpm or so... I had been shifting AT 3200 rpm, so I figured that I was in a heap of trouble!
But... I moved my shifting rpm levels to 4000 rpm. That drops it right in at about 3300 rpm for the next gear in line.
It takes a bit of getting used to; but these Rotax engines are revving fools... The more you spin them, the more they seem to like it!
So I'm a convert...
Good Luck with the repairs and please let us know what happens next! :thumbup:

 

[harrypottar]

I think the dealer told my dad they would fix it this time for no cost but if it happened again it wouldn't be covered.

Sounds like your dealer is taking care of your dad, this good news and sounds like a fair dealer.

I have no idea how much it would cost out of pocket otherwise, but just explain to your dad to keep it above 3.500 rpm as best he can while staying safe.

:welcome: its a great community here and you will find a lot out just surfing the forum one night when you have nothing better to do.

harry

 

[cjackg]

My dad and I each bought a spyder at the end of last year. Neither of us had any real experience with motorcycles before but we thought it would be fun to do this together. Well he has put about 600+ miles on his when it stopped shifting. So he took it in to be looked at and was told by the dealership/mechanic that the clutch was burnt out. The mechanic then told my dad that it was user error because he had been riding with it in too high a gear at too low of a speed. He said when going 50 mph that you should only be in 3rd gear. Maybe its my natural distrust of anybody I don't know but that doesn't seem right to me. Me and my dad both have always driven standard cars and trucks, and even 4 wheelers and have never gone 50 mph in only 3rd gear. I was hoping some of the more experienced riders could tell me if this is true and just a quirk of the spyder or is it the dealer trying to get out of fixing the motorcycle for free because its under warranty. How does everyone else drive their spyders? Thanks for any input!!

Did they cover the repairs under warranty, or make you pay for them as "user error" ? They really dont give much warning or advice to new SE5 owners on avoiding this scenario, so I hope they didnt make you pay. That would be a very bad precedent and warning to prospective new spyder owners....

 

[spydersprad]

They are going to cover it this time. But they warned us it wouldn't happen again. I'm so glad I came here to get information. And my dad says thanks to everyone too. The spyder community is a great bunch of people, so glad I'm one of ya!!

 

[Grandpa Spyder]

You know if the owners manual says you must be above 3000 rpms to shift..So why don't they tell you that you should be shifting at 4000 or higher? I don't think that this is covered correctly to put the blame on operator error. I have learned how to drive mine by reading this forum. I now shift at 4000 rpms or higher. But I didn't start that way. I was using the above 3000 figure I read in the manual. My dealer never told me anything about shifting, I even mentioned to them at 600 mile service that it would hesitate sometimes when I shift. and he just said that he didn't know why they did that. I don't think the owners manual and the dealers give you enough information on how to drive these machines.

We should put a sticky note to all se5 owners letting them know up front on the correct way to operate the SE5 transmission.

 

[Bob Denman]

:agree: Some "words to the wise" about rpm levels could be very useful!