Heim Joint

[Bob Denman]

:agree: Think, "shear-pin"... :thumbup:

 

[BajaRon]

I don't think it's a good idea to 'Expect' the Heim link joints to fail. If they do they aren't going to protect anything. You're not going to hurt the sway bar components.

I'm not sure what the results would be to have a joint fail. It would depend on when and what you were doing at the time.

I will make a few sets and see what happens. Like everything else, some will want them, some won't. If I do this they will certainly be bullet proof.

 

[ThreeWheels]

I don't think it's a good idea to 'Expect' the Heim link joints to fail. If they do they aren't going to protect anything. You're not going to hurt the sway bar components.

I'm not sure what the results would be to have a joint fail. It would depend on when and what you were doing at the time.

I will make a few sets and see what happens. Like everything else, some will want them, some won't. If I do this they will certainly be bullet proof.

I'll volunteer to test out the installation of the new parts.
Afterwards, I'll be sure to give you a detailed account of the Hiem Link Maneuver.

 

[Bob Denman]

Afterwards, I'll be sure to give you a detailed account of the Heim Link Maneuver.

:clap:Very well-played; Sir! :clap: :thumbup:

 

[BajaRon]

I'll volunteer to test out the installation of the new parts.
Afterwards, I'll be sure to give you a detailed account of the Hiem Link Maneuver.

I am so privileged to have such a fan club... hyea:

 

[Yfactor]

Bob, I can't believe you let ThreeWheels beat you to that one

 

[Bob Denman]

He earned it!

 

[GeoffCee]

I was concerned about the Heim Joints also after reading about a few failures and just bit the bullet and ordered 2 costing $28. I thought it would be worth it, if just for piece of mind, when I was installing Ron's sway bar.

You are $28 lighter without any gain. Your new plastic links are no stronger than your old plastic links and you'll be just as worried about em failing as you was before. Or have I missed something here? :dontknow:

 

[Frank G]

You are $28 lighter without any gain. Your new plastic links are no stronger than your old plastic links and you'll be just as worried about em failing as you was before. Or have I missed something here? :dontknow:

Since we do not have any engineering data, material specifications, or LIFE CYCLE TESTING DATA, everything we talk about on this thread is pure speculation. It would be a good assumption thet BRP and the supplier of this component did there homework in the design stage, and the manufacturer continues to perform the necessary testing to maintain the quality standerds. This said, it is a good assumption that this component will perform as intended with all stock components in the suspension system of the spyder.

However, when we modify the suspension system in any way, all the origional engineering data is out the window. At this time we assume responsibility for the modifications. Most of us will accept this, as the performance advantages are appricated.

Specifically when we replace the anti sway bar with an aftermarket bar it may subject the HEIM links to greater loads than they were engineered for and may decrease there usable life cycles. (we do not know this to be true without engineering data) This holds true for other components in the suspension system as well.

After everything I said above I will keep my Bajha Ron bar. IT IS GREAT. I will watch the Heilm links and other components for issues.

My thoughts

 

[Bob Denman]

As near as I can tell; those links only pop up on the radar if they've been compromised by interference with the Anti-SwayBar ends. :shocked:
After all; hit something hard enough in front to simply snap them, and you've got far too many other problems to worry about only those! :yikes:
If the RonBar installation is done correctly; those links will probably outlast the bike! :thumbup:

 

[GeoffCee]

...everything we talk about on this thread is pure speculation.

Good answer!

I have one of Ron's sway bars waiting in the wings and if Spring on this side of the Pond ever arrives I'll get around to fitting it. Will I find a broken heim link under there? Who knows? And if there is a broken one will I be able to remember dropping a wheel into a particularly deep pot-hole while we were holidaying in the Spanish Picos mountains last year? Unlikely, it's impossible to remember one pothole among so many.

I think the introduction of Ron's stronger bar has thrown a question mark over the existing plastic link and I agree that they will have to be watched, to be on the safe side. :shocked:

 

[BajaRon]

Since we do not have any engineering data, material specifications, or LIFE CYCLE TESTING DATA, everything we talk about on this thread is pure speculation. It would be a good assumption thet BRP and the supplier of this component did there homework in the design stage, and the manufacturer continues to perform the necessary testing to maintain the quality standerds. This said, it is a good assumption that this component will perform as intended with all stock components in the suspension system of the spyder.

However, when we modify the suspension system in any way, all the origional engineering data is out the window. At this time we assume responsibility for the modifications. Most of us will accept this, as the performance advantages are appricated.

Specifically when we replace the anti sway bar with an aftermarket bar it may subject the HEIM links to greater loads than they were engineered for and may decrease there usable life cycles. (we do not know this to be true without engineering data) This holds true for other components in the suspension system as well.

After everything I said above I will keep my Bajha Ron bar. IT IS GREAT. I will watch the Heilm links and other components for issues.

My thoughts

There is no doubt that my Custom Performance sway bars create additional loading on the Heim link joints. BRP uses the same parts on all of their Spyders so putting a heavier bar on the RS series Spyders is not a concern since that bar is still lighter than the OEM RT bar. The only concern would be for the RT series bar installs.

These OEM composite plastic links are very strong and as any modern component I can only assume that these links have been over engineered to handle stresses well beyond expectation.

Beyond this you are correct, everything is speculative. How much stress can these OEM parts handle? Other than sophisticated destructive testing it is hard to say.

As far as I know there have been no failures under what I will call 'Design Stress' conditions. In other words, these links were designed to perform will with progressive stress and vertical loading (push/pull forces created by the sway bar).

Again, as far as I know, all of the link failures were due to shock or impact conditions for which these links are poorly equipped to handle. Impact with rocks, for example, or hard contact with other suspension components (such as the A-Arm) will quickly exceed design parameters and lead to the destruction of a Heim link joint.

As far as I know all failures have occurred at the lower attachment point of the Heim link. Since the design strength and stress loading at both ends of these links are identical it would stand to reason that at least some failures would occur at the top connection if the failure were simply overload (and not impact) caused.

The lower connection of these links are exposed to impact or hard contact conditions whereas the upper link connection is protected.

 

[gypsy_100]

There is no doubt that my Custom Performance sway bars create additional loading on the Heim link joints. BRP uses the same parts on all of their Spyders so putting a heavier bar on the RS series Spyders is not a concern since that bar is still lighter than the OEM RT bar. The only concern would be for the RT series bar installs.

These OEM composite plastic links are very strong and as any modern component I can only assume that these links have been over engineered to handle stresses well beyond expectation.

Beyond this you are correct, everything is speculative. How much stress can these OEM parts handle? Other than sophisticated destructive testing it is hard to say.

As far as I know there have been no failures under what I will call 'Design Stress' conditions. In other words, these links were designed to perform will with progressive stress and vertical loading (push/pull forces created by the sway bar).

Again, as far as I know, all of the link failures were due to shock or impact conditions for which these links are poorly equipped to handle. Impact with rocks, for example, or hard contact with other suspension components (such as the A-Arm) will quickly exceed design parameters and lead to the destruction of a Heim link joint.

As far as I know all failures have occurred at the lower attachment point of the Heim link. Since the design strength and stress loading at both ends of these links are identical it would stand to reason that at least some failures would occur at the top connection if the failure were simply overload (and not impact) caused.

The lower connection of these links are exposed to impact or hard contact conditions whereas the upper link connection is protected.

Well thought out and well stated.