G'day from Down Under - what to look for in a high milage Spyder?

[Uncle Ernest]

Ever since I lost a leg over 24 years ago, I've often thought of getting a trike or a Spyder but they're a bit beyond my means.
Recently I came across a 2013 Spyder ST SM5 998cc for $7,000AUD ($4,335USD) which sounds like a bargain.
The seller states a $3,000 major service has been recently done.
Although the pics show that it's in good condition, it's travelled 92,000klm - 57,166 miles.
My question are; how strong are the 998cc motors?
What is their life expectancy?
What should I look for in a high milage Spyder?

 

[Cobranut]

Ever since I lost a leg over 24 years ago, I've often thought of getting a trike or a Spyder but they're a bit beyond my means.
Recently I came across a 2013 Spyder ST SM5 998cc for $7,000aud [$4,335usd] which sounds like a bargain.
The seller states a $3,000 major service has been recently done.
Although the pics show that it's in good condition, it's travelled 92,000klm - 57,166 miles.
My question are; how strong are the 998cc motors?
What is their life expectancy?
What should I look for in a high mileage Spyder?

I'd be a bit leery of any motorcycle with that many miles on it.
I recently picked up my 2015 F3S SM6 with 9,600 miles for $8,000 USD.

If possible, I'd hold out to find a 2014-up unit with the 1330 ACE motor. They seem to have fewer problems.

Good luck, they are really fun machines to ride.

 

[Uncle Ernest]

I'd be a bit leery of any motorcycle with that many miles on it.
I recently picked up my 2015 F3S SM6 with 9,600 miles for $8,000 USD.

If possible, I'd hold out to find a 2014-up unit with the 1330 ACE motor. They seem to have fewer problems.

Good luck, they are really fun machines to ride.

Thanks. Of course I'd much prefer a 1330cc Spyder but then there's a big jump in price. $7k is about my limit.
Most of the Spyders I've seen advertised are mostly later models.

 

[2dogs]

You can easily spend more than $1K or more on a high milage pre-14 Spyder that needs work done + parts, unless you do your own work. I agree with shopping for a 2014 or later.

 

[TheMariner]

G'day Uncle,

It's not local to you, but I know of a black 2008 Sypder GS SM5 in Adelaide with 28,600km on it being sold on consignment by our local Spyder mechanical expert. Needs front tyres & rear brake pads, otherwise great cond. with extras like sat nav & rear SHAD box. $8,000 firm.

If interested, PM me & I'll send you his contact details.

 

[2dogs]

Just an afterthought (LOL) if you're a diehard rider and you keep a 1330 for a few years you could make up the difference in MPG's alone.

 

[Peter Aawen]

All good advice, but I have a couple of comments that you might consider...

1. Going by the longevity & milage many Oz Spyder Riders have achieved on their V-Twin Spyders, 96,000 km is ALMOST just run-in, especially if it's been well maintained. Altho if it's done a bunch of dirt road miles (like mine) you might want to look at the belt to see if the 'half-round' nubs that engage the teeth on the sprocket haven't started to wear a little flatter on the drive side - there again, there's quite a few Spyders here that are still on their original belt with close on 200,000 km up...

2. The V-Twin Spyders are becoming harder to get serviced by dealers and to source OEM parts for, not that they need them too often, and there are a growing number of really good non-dealer Spyder techs around too! It's certainly something to consider, especially if you can't do the basic stuff yourself. That said, the V-Twins are a much revvier and peppier Spyder to ride than the 1330's, especially if you get an ECU-Xtreme/Rotax Racing ECU Upgrade done - and if you do that & can resist using ALL of the (more) power that'll then be on tap ALL of the time, you'll also get very close to the same fuel economy as the 1330's, altho the smaller gas tank will still mean you won't get quite the same range before needing to top up again!!

Me personally, I haven't yet found a 1330 Spyder model or even modded version of a Spyder with one of those lazy but admittedly very torquey 1330 motors that is anywhere near as exciting and nice to ride as my 2013 RT (which has a few suspension & ECU Mods) so I'm still riding my 2013 RT Limited at every opportunity! You can do a lot worse than choosing a V-Twin powered Spyder, altho a good 1330 powered version might be an 'adequate' alternative!

Just Sayin'

 

[Uncle Ernest]

All good advice, but I have a couple of comments that you might consider...

1. Going by the longevity & milage many Oz Spyder Riders have achieved on their V-Twin Spyders, 96,000 km is ALMOST just run-in, especially if it's been well maintained. Altho if it's done a bunch of dirt road miles (like mine) you might want to look at the belt to see if the 'half-round' nubs that engage the teeth on the sprocket haven't started to wear a little flatter on the drive side - there again, there's quite a few Spyders here that are still on their original belt with close on 200,000 km up...

2. The V-Twin Spyders are becoming harder to get serviced by dealers and to source OEM parts for, not that they need them too often, and there are a growing number of really good non-dealer Spyder techs around too! It's certainly something to consider, especially if you can't do the basic stuff yourself. That said, the V-Twins are a much revvier and peppier Spyder to ride than the 1330's, especially if you get an ECU-Xtreme/Rotax Racing ECU Upgrade done - and if you do that & can resist using ALL of the (more) power that'll then be on tap ALL of the time, you'll also get very close to the same fuel economy as the 1330's, altho the smaller gas tank will still mean you won't get quite the same range before needing to top up again!!

Me personally, I haven't yet found a 1330 Spyder model or even modded version of a Spyder with of those lazy but admittedly very torquey motors that is anywhere near as exciting and nice to ride as my 2013 RT (which has a few suspension & ECU Mods) so I'm still riding my 2013 RT Limited at every opportunity! You can do a lot worse than choosing a V-Twin powered Spyder, altho a good 1330 powered version might be an 'adequate' alternative!

Just Sayin'

Thanks for sharing, that's good to know.
I rode Ducatis for close to two decades so I'm used to (and like) motors that like to rev
My thinking is that since it's had a "$3,000 major service less than 500km ago" and "rides like a dream" (according to the seller) then it should be trouble free for a while.

Thanks for the comments and advice everyone. Since it's garaged 20 minutes away I'll go check it out on the weekend.

 

[Mikey]

I say, get your boots on and grab your wallet, and take that thing for a test ride! You're looking at an older bike in your price range, that you may have to wrench on a little, and may have to think out of the box at times but if you're willing to do that, I think it would make you a great ride, and it gets your hair back in the wind! You would cheat yourself if you didn't go look at it!!! Go for it.

 

[RangerRick]

Peter A, Thanks for confirming that us 998 owners are not riding inferior machines I love the way this motor rev's

 

[Freddy]

I have a 2009 GS SM5 since new, done 105,000km and goes as well as Peter says. I had a couple of issues with it in the early days when in warranty but nothing since. Plug leads were a weak point on the early ones. Just curious how an SM5 would suit an amputee?

 

[Uncle Ernest]

I have a 2009 GS SM5 since new, done 105,000km and goes as well as Peter says. I had a couple of issues with it in the early days when in warranty but nothing since. Plug leads were a weak point on the early ones. Just curious how an SM5 would suit an amputee?

One question I forgot to ask is which side is the foot brake?
Being a below knee left leg amputee it would be better if it was on the right for better feel but I'd adjust were the brake pedal on the left.
I'm able to drive 18-speed crash boxes so I would not expect it to be an issue.
I'm still able to ride motorbikes but I don't have the same confidence cornering as hard as I'd like which is why I gave up riding. I'm a boy racer at heart

 

[Dasmoetorhead]

One question I forgot to ask is which side is the foot brake?
Being a below knee left leg amputee it would be better if it was on the right for better feel but I'd adjust were the brake pedal on the left.
I'm able to drive 18-speed crash boxes so I would not expect it to be an issue.
I'm still able to ride motorbikes but I don't have the same confidence cornering as hard as I'd like which is why I gave up riding. I'm a boy racer at heart

Brake pedal is on the right side. Cheers!

 

[Bfromla]

Thanks for sharing, that's good to know.
I rode Ducatis for close to two decades so I'm used to [and like] motors that like to rev
My thinking is that since it's had a "$3,000 major service less than 500km ago" and "rides like a dream" [according to the seller] that it should be trouble free for a while.

Thanks for the comments and advice everyone. Since it's garaged 20 minutes away I'll go check it out on the weekend.

Hopefully, it's good & has good tires/new brake pads & full tank of gas. (tyres/petrol). Get a signed copy of said service work completed by certified BRP technician. Unfortunately, as pricy as BRP parts are, with an average $120+ an hour plus labor rates, it doesn’t take long to hit $3k services. Also, understand the significantly higher prices in areas. An ST is a great bike, if well maintained, they can be long lasting. I have 81,266 on mine; have had the oil & water pumps replaced (separate occasions) & a cylinder head that warped replaced Being the the more expensive services, & possibly in reaction to each other, (maybe the water pump issues subsequently caused head warping?) I was told the oil pump went out from clutch plate issues & old oil in my SE5. Some servicing can be DIY, some cannot. A Certified technician should know what extras to inspect & help to prevent other failures. The difficulty will be the discontinued parts & dealers not working on anything over 10 years old. Good luck in your pursuits. The 1330 six speeds are nice...

 

[Cobranut]

Brake pedal is on the right side. Cheers!

I'd test ride first, and make sure you can shift comfortably. I assume you have a prosthetic leg?

 

[Uncle Ernest]

I'd test ride first, and make sure you can shift comfortably. I assume you have a prosthetic leg?

Hang on a minute, I thought I'd read somewhere that Spyders were semi-auto with gear shifting paddles?! Did I get that wrong?
Ok, just to be clear, would you mind explaining the gear shifting set up?

Yes I wear a prosthetic. A condition on my license is that I MUST wear my prosthetic leg when driving a manual vehicle. How else would I operate a clutch? Up until recently I was driving a 10-speed Mack and the boss's 18-speed Mack occasionally.

Due to the prosthetic leg, I have to get a motorcycle gear changer modified so that I can use heel and toe to go up and down through the gears - I'm able to shift gears without any mods, but it's just too awkward,and unsafe to do for too long.

 

[Peter Aawen]

Hang on a minute, I thought I'd read somewhere that Spyders were semi-auto with gear shifting paddles. Did I get that wrong?
Ok, just to be clear, would you mind explaining the gear shifting set up?

Yes I wear a prosthetic. A condition on my license is that I MUST wear my prosthetic leg when driving a manual vehicle. How else would I operate a clutch?
Up until recently I was driving a 10-speed Mack and the boss's 18-speed Mack occasionally.

Due to the prosthetic leg I have to get a motorcycle gear changer modified so that I can use heel and toe to go up and down through the gears - I'm able to shift gears without any mods, but it's just too awkward and unsafe to do for too long.

The SE Gearboxes have a centrifugal clutch (SE5 on the V-Twins) or an oil pressure/hydraulic clutch (SE6 for the 1330's) with a semi-automatic 'flappy paddle quick shift' arrangement that's operated by the rider's Left Thumb and Forefinger, both with selectable Reverse, but the SM5's (V-Twins) & SM6's (1330s) are 'normal' manual clutch gearboxes with a hand operated clutch lever on the Left handlebar and a Left foot gear lever activated shift operation.

The gearboxes are actually the same 'manual gearboxes', only the SE's have the semi-automatic quick-shift arrangement with computer managed over-sight, throttle blipping, and a fail-safe that'll change down for you if you forget/don't match revs & road speed etc. So ideally, if you have a Left Foot Prosthetic, you'd go for an SE, altho if you can manage a heel/toe shifter, you can get them/get one made for an SM. But the SE semi-automatics are pretty sexy pieces of kit that make you do all the up-shifting yourself using the computer supervised quick-shift paddles, and you can (& probably should) control the downward gearchanges just like you would on a full manual, except that you use the flappy paddles and there's the fail-safe & computer managed downshift for when you forget/stuff it up!

 

[Uncle Ernest]

The SE Gearboxes have a centrifugal clutch (SE5 on the V-Twins) or an oil pressure/hydraulic clutch (SE6 for the 1330's) with a semi-automatic 'flappy paddle quick shift' arrangement that's operated by the rider's Left Thumb and Forefinger, both with selectable Reverse, but the SM5's (V-Twins) & SM6's (1330s) are 'normal' manual clutch gearboxes with a hand operated clutch lever on the Left handlebar and a Left foot gear lever activated shift operation.

The gearboxes are actually the same 'manual gearboxes', only the SE's have the semi-automatic quick-shift arrangement with computer managed over-sight, throttle blipping, and a fail-safe that'll change down for you if you forget/don't match revs & road speed etc. So ideally, if you have a Left Foot Prosthetic, you'd go for an SE, altho if you can manage a heel/toe shifter, you can get them/get one made for an SM. But the SE semi-automatics are pretty sexy pieces of kit that make you do all the up-shifting yourself using the computer supervised quick-shift paddles, and you can (& probably should) control the downward gearchanges just like you would on a full manual, except that you use the flappy paddles and there's the fail-safe & computer managed downshift for when you forget/stuff it up!

Thank you Peter.
Well that puts a damper on my growing excitement. Bugger.
I'd be fine riding short trips with a heel/toe shifter but fatigue would set in on longer trips.
That knocks this 2013 SM5 off the list.
Is the SE and SE5 just a later model? What year did they become semi-auto?

 

[Peter Aawen]

Thank you Peter.
Well that puts a damper on my growing excitement. Bugger.
I'd be fine riding short trips with a heel/toe shifter but fatigue would set in on longer trips.
That knocks this 2013 SM5 off the list.
Is the SE and SE5 just a later model? What year did they become semi-auto?

The 5 speed SE5's came out with the original V-Twins in 2007/8, altho I think the very first batch released were only manuals (SM5's), but certainly by the time they released the ST's & RT's in 2010, the semi-automatic SE 5 speeds were pretty much the pick of the bunch and taking an increasing share of the sales. That said, quite a few riders (North American riders especially, who were used to big twins with lotsa low revving torque instead of power at higher revs) failed to adequately keep the engine revs up enough to avoid damaging the centrifugal clutch, which needed about 3500 rpm to fully engage and there were quite a few failures due to riders running around at revs that left the clutch slipping somewhat, pretty much all the time. It wasn't a shortfall or issue with the gearbox per se, it was basically just an operator error due to the differences in what the riders were used to - there were far fewer SE5 clutch failures in those countries where riders were more used to revvier machines.

So when BRP (eventually) brought out the bigger 1330 motor in the 2014 RT's (the last 5 Speed V-Twins sold were the 2016 RS/RSS/ST's, models that were dropped shortly after the release of the F3's in 2015) they upped the ante for the SE's with the 6 speed box and also brought in an oil pressure activated clutch for the SE's that could handle the greater torque and the lower revs that North American riders were more used to. By then, the sales of the SM manual versions were beginning to noticeably drop off, and I think it was about 2017/18 or so that the SM's were dropped completely.

 

[Uncle Ernest]

Thanks again Peter.

Must have been bitten by the Spyder bug Starting to contemplate getting a small bank loan and getting a better model.
Here's one I rather like the look of; a 2013 RT Ltd SE5. A 998cc with 30,730km - 19,095 miles for $11,500AUD.