Front shock relocators?

[Freezedryman]

Anyone know is the Pitbull shock relocators are helpful and why?

 

[pegasus1300]

I would like an answer to this question as well. I have thought about getting a set of these along with a Bajaron bar. I have a 2012 RT.

 

[Highwayman2013]

They move the top of the shocks outward to give the shocks better geometry. I do not have them but maybe someone who has them can say if they make a difference.

 

[rcantrell52]

Front Shock Relocators

Yes, the shock relocators will improve the handling of your Spyder. My RT-S and RS-S were used for developing the prototype for the shock relocators. After riding the RT-S for 180 miles on different road surfaces I wrote a review about the shock relocates. I have gone from standard Can Am shocks on the RT-S to Elka Stage 5 plus shock relocators and have recently added the Baja Ron sway bar. All of these items have improved the handling of our Spyder.

Reese

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

RE-LOCATORS

They were designed to bring the 08 to 12 shock angles to match that of the 2013 and later frames and front suspension.....BRP did this to firm up the OEM shocks and keep the length of the spring the similar. This helps with the spring compliance rate. Firm but not Harsh ........Mike :thumbup:

 

[spacetiger]

The angle of the shocks on the front at a relatively shallow angle. If you look at a right triangle (below), the front [spring] shock is like side "c". The shock [spring] can be broken into 2 components, a vertical ("b") and horizontal ("a") component. It is the vertical component (b) that holds up the bike.



The problem with the oem design is that the oem spring is too weak. There are several ways to address the weak springs depending on your riding weight, mechanical abilities and size of your wallet. Your options:

Fix "c"
> New shocks (Elka or possibly Fox): Most expensive
> New Springs (Eibach or Hypercoil): You have to disassemble the shock to swap the springs. Not everyone will want to do this.
> "spring spacers": These isolate some of the coil turns on the spring (they do not allow the spring to compress on the shorter end). They effectively make the spring stiffer (but the oem spring will loose its effectiveness over time, so the adjustable spacer is a bit better because it allows you to make some adjustments as the spring weakens)
> Preload adjuster: Very nice product, but you have to disassemble the spring from the shock. This isn't too hard but not everyone will want to do this. This device increases the preload capacity only and does not change the spring rate. If your "c" is too weak/you are too heavy than this device may not solve your problem.

Increases "b"
> Relocators: by changing the angle of the shock, "c" gets shorter but "b" gets longer. You use the same spring, its just more effort of the spring is helping you in the vertical axis. But, depending on you weight (+ passenger and cargo weights) these might not help you enough.

All options are about 1/10th of the cost to put on a set of elka shocks. When I look at the other options I further separate them into 2 buckets:
> Fix the problem: replace the weak springs
> Mask the problem/make the weak springs work: spacers, preload adjuster, or relocators

Depending on your riding weights, I'd say you may need 425-450 lbs/in springs. Here is the link on how I changed springs: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?60792-2012-RT-S-SE5-Front-Suspension

Here is a link on how to dial in your suspension: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?76070-Dialing-in-your-front-shocks-lots-of-pics

Others will give you their opinion on which device to use. I am a believer you fix the problem (spring change) but if you cannot do this, I would vote for the adjustable spring spacer that installs with a wrench (you do not have to remove the shock, nor do you not have to take off the spring from the shock).

Dont forget to fix the rear [spring] suspension. My solution: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?61674-2012-RT-S-SE5-Rear-Suspension-(shock)

Don't forget to post back what you did so others learn from your experience.

Jerry

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

SHOCK RE-LOCATORS

Jerry, one thing the re-locators do not do is shorten the working length of the SPRING......When you start adding spring spacers/wedges you are effectively removing the distance the spring will compress before it hits the stop....If you add enough of them you will have a " HARDTAIL " which isn't very comfort able......And with the re-locators you say " c " gets shorter....I believe PitBull's upper mount was done on an " arc " ( in & up ) and "c" which is the OEM shock remains the same length ( eye to eye ) it does not get shorter.....I know mine did/does. I'm not saying that ideally proper springs isn't the better way to go, just that the above is a better representation of the re-locator........Mike :thumbup:

 

[spacetiger]

Jerry, one thing the re-locators do not do is shorten the working length of the SPRING......When you start adding spring spacers/wedges you are effectively removing the distance the spring will compress before it hits the stop....If you add enough of them you will have a " HARDTAIL " which isn't very comfort able......And with the re-locators you say " c " gets shorter....I believe PitBull's upper mount was done on an " arc " ( in & up ) and "c" which is the OEM shock remains the same length ( eye to eye ) it does not get shorter.....I know mine did/does. I'm not saying that ideally proper springs isn't the better way to go, just that the above is a better representation of the re-locator........Mike :thumbup:

Mike,

You are absolutely correct, I was trying to explain the effective spring force changes through the geometry change. I was trying to avoid trying to make the explanation without going into engineering speak. It is clear I did a poor job of it. Suffice to say, the more vertically aligned you can orient the spring (shock), more of the spring effort is going into holding up the bike.

On the spacers, you are effectively making the single spring to function like 2 separate springs. The longer side will compress first and will have a higher rate than the single full length spring. The same affect would be gained if you simply cut off a coil or 2. The spring would be shorter but stiffer. You could use the spring but you have to reshapped the spring on the cut end to lay flat and use a coil over sleeve to take up the slack on the shorter coil spring.

 

[Chupaca]

Don't know. ..!!

About all the techy stuff..but I added the relocations after riding a time with BajaRon sway bar and they were as impressive a change to handling as the bar was...if you add the RT shocks your good as gold. I finally was able to get some Fox shocks and live the setup...:thumbup:

 

[jthornton]

I have a 2012 RT and my upgrade path was:

Baja Ron Sway Bar
Pittbull Shock Relocator
Elka Shocks

Each one improved the handling and ride.

The biggest bang for the buck was the swaybar which reduced the roll in corners and made the ride much more comfortable for the passenger. The passenger sits up higher so the roll moves them more than the driver. My wife only rode the Spyder once before the swaybar change and didn't want to ride it again. Now she is a very happy camper to ride the Spyder.

The relocator improved the highway handling like behind trucks and things like that.

The Elka's I don't know how to describe the difference except a big smile on my face the first time I rode with them.

JT

 

[JerryB]

Hi Jerry,

Re: Relocators: by changing the angle of the shock, "c" gets shorter but "b" gets longer

If 'b' gets longer ( and 'a' 'b' is still 90 * ) then 'c' also has to get longer. If 'a' 'b' angle changes to an acute angle, then you could be correct.

From the little that I know about the relocators is that they move the top of the shock outward; maybe a little higher but I am not sure on this.

Jerry Baumchen

 

[Bob Denman]

Hi Jerry,

Re: Relocators: by changing the angle of the shock, "c" gets shorter but "b" gets longer

If 'b' gets longer ( and 'a' 'b' is still 90 * ) then 'c' also has to get longer. If 'a' 'b' angle changes to an acute angle, then you could be correct.

From the little that I know about the relocators is that they move the top of the shock outward; maybe a little higher but I am not sure on this.

Jerry Baumchen

PitBull's Top shock mount re-locators move the top of the shock upward, and inward. :thumbup:
So the angle in question does not stay at 90 degrees...

 

[JerryB]

Hi Bob,

Re: So the angle in question does not stay at 90 degrees...

And I agree; that was the purpose of my post.

Now, a little something for the non-technical folks: https://www.mathsisfun.com/obtuse.html

Jerry Baumchen

 

[spacetiger]

Okay, tomorrow night I will lay out the spring loading/angle relationship.

:cheers:

Jerry

 

[Mike Ard]

I added the shock relocator brackets on my 2010 RS. Previous to that I had put a sway bar and Elka shocks on it. Each addition helped the handling. Defenitly recomend them for spyders older than 2013.

The one thing I found was that after adding the brackets I couldn't use the A arm covers.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT

I added the shock relocator brackets on my 2010 RS. Previous to that I had put a sway bar and Elka shocks on it. Each addition helped the handling. Defenitly recomend them for spyders older than 2013.

The one thing I found was that after adding the brackets I couldn't use the A arm covers.

:yikes:....Then you were the only one, I didn't hear of anyone else encountering that problem. They were designed as BOLT on NO trimming..........Mike :thumbup:

 

[Peter Aawen]

...... The one thing I found was that after adding the brackets I couldn't use the A arm covers.

You didn't put them on the bottom shock mount position did you?? :yikes: I thought they were meant to go on the top!! :roflblack:




Seriously tho, why couldn't you use the A arm covers :hun: there doesn't seem to be any obvious way they'd interfere? :gaah: