Front scrapping on driveways

[spacetiger]

This is not a limited problem - my 2014 RT scrapes on rough roads, but not on curbs -perhaps I automatically take those at an angle.

Last summer I was on a ride with a lot of weather damage, and could not go slow enough to keep the Spyder from scraping. I have Ron's anti-sway bar ready to install this winter, and may put wedges in the springs too. Spending $1K+ for a set of shocks is out of the question.

Sounds like you may just need better aftermarket springs. Do you know to read the front shock rubber bumpers to see if you are bottoming out? And you weigh?, sorry, have to ask to help solve the problem. BTW, the cost for good set of front springs are ~150 (inc shipping).

Post a pick of the front underside so all can see the scraping. It would be good for others to check too and comment.

 

[Dragonrider]

These pics show the damage from a single trip on a paved, but weather damaged road, and a picture of my hand under the Spyder, showing the ground clearance (or lack thereof).

There is NO adjustment available on my Spyder's shocks... It frequently sees 450# when loaded and two up. Probably had 300# on the day this damage was done.

 

[spacetiger]

These pics show the damage from a single trip on a paved, but weather damaged road, and a picture of my hand under the Spyder, showing the ground clearance (or lack thereof).

There is NO adjustment available on my Spyder's shocks... It frequently sees 450# when loaded and two up. Probably had 300# on the day this damage was done.

Well that isn't too cool.

If you have good access to the bike can you check the front shock to see how it is performing under a static load. If you look at attached pic, you will see the rubber bumper. The bumper is your last safety net. When the shock fully compresses, the shock body pushes the bumper up at the top of the shock. To keep the shock from hitting metal on metal, the rubber bumper absorbs the impact. The trouble is, its a hard impact. You need strong enough springs for the weight load you have. This should be one of the first things you check.

An easy way to check how soft your springs are for the load you are carrying is to check the sag of the bike. To do this, you need to push the bumper all the way down to the shock body. The gap above the rubber bumper to the top is essentially the working range of the shock. For my 2012 RTS, the total gap is 2.5" (you can measure this if you jack the bike up, then push the bumper all the way down, then measure the gap). Once the bumper is all the way down, get on the bike carefully taking care not to bounce the bike. Sit on the set, then dismount. You just put your solo riding weight on the front suspension and it compressed the front shocks. Now, you can check to see how far up the rubber bumper was pushed by you just sitting on the bike. If you have a working range of 2", your gap should not be more than 25% x 2" = 0.5". That is just a rule of thumb. A smaller gap is okay, but a bigger gap isn't a good thing depending on how much more.

Can you do the step above and report back what you find? A pic would be great for all the other 2014 RTS riders.

Jerry

 

[jimnsusie]

This is not a limited problem - my 2014 RT scrapes on rough roads, but not on curbs -perhaps I automatically take those at an angle.

Last summer I was on a ride with a lot of weather damage, and could not go slow enough to keep the Spyder from scraping. I have Ron's anti-sway bar ready to install this winter, and may put wedges in the springs too. Spending $1K+ for a set of shocks is out of the question.

I see we are on a similar page. I have Ron's sway bar ready for install as well. I hope to get it done in Jan with a stretch of good weather so I can ride over to a friends place. He has the heated garage as mine isn't. Have had a minor scraping incident already also. That caught me by surprise. Would like to know if you are able to raise your bike any. I can see something needs to be done and another bunch of money is not likely from me.

 

[Dragonrider]

Jim;

I'm going to add the rubber wedge shown earlier in this thread as well as the Ron's bar. I want to raise the bike 1".

I suspect the 14s were lowered to give better fuel economy, and that's probably also the reason we get so much stuff in the intake ducts... On non-damaged roads, it's not a problem, and was never a problem on my 2010 - with the same loads.

 

[Flamewinger]

I'm thinking of trying a set of Spring Compressors to compress the spring then adjusting the lock rings. (while the wheels are off the ground)

Lock rings on Fox shock


Spring compressor set

 

[spacetiger]

I'm thinking of trying a set of Spring Compressors to compress the spring then adjusting the lock rings. (while the wheels are off the ground)

Lock rings on Fox shock
View attachment 100308

Spring compressor set
View attachment 100309

flamewinger,

those spring compressors can work okay if the shock is off the bike. You may struggle to get them on in the confined space if the shocks are still on the bike. The ratchet straps are good for the tight space.

Where able to read the bumper with just your static weight on the bike?

 

[Flamewinger]

Not sure about "Where able to read the bumper with just your static weight on the bike?"

Just looking at the bike from the front and you can see the front wheels cave inwards.

First pic is looking at the front. Second pic is a bullet level on the inside rim.

 

[spacetiger]

Flamewinger,

I understand about the inward tip of the wheel and your desire to adjust the springs to get the wheels more upright.

You do not want to just start changing the preload on the shocks to get the wheels look upright. I believe you want to get the spring adjusted properly; when this is done, I believe the wheels will look right as the spring will keep the front suspension A arms parallel to the ground. That will insure the wheel is up and down.

I will post a separate link with plenty of pics so you can understand how to adjust your springs: http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/...cks-lots-of-pics&p=917893&posted=1#post917893

As you go through your adjustments, keep posting back what you find out so other benefit from your experience.

Jerry

 

[Dragonrider]

There are no adjustments available on my shocks... Do I assume correctly that the rubber doughnut shown earlier in the thread fits on the top of the shock spring? I also noted the mention of "wedges", and think I've seen them before, but can't find a picture/source... Let me know where to find these - thanx

 

[spacetiger]

There are no adjustments available on my shocks... Do I assume correctly that the rubber doughnut shown earlier in the thread fits on the top of the shock spring? I also noted the mention of "wedges", and think I've seen them before, but can't find a picture/source... Let me know where to find these - thanx

Before you buy anything, you ought to really have some feel for what you need. I'm not sure the wedge is what you thinking of, perhaps something like these: http://store.resuspension.com/product.php?productid=18892&cat=352&page=1

These are not the right size but are inserts that go between 2 coils.

I put a post out to guide you through how to read your front shocks. Pm me if you need help encoding it. I tried to make it understandable.

jerry

 

[Dragonrider]

Bumper was as shown in #3 - RT does not bottom out coming in the driveway, but does on a hard stop, pothole, etc., with just me on the bike. I need to add an inch of compression to make this stop.

Since there is no adjustment available on the shock, my only choice is a rubber wedge/donut on the shock. Do you know the proper size? Prices range from $15 to $40 on fleabay... changing shocks and/or springs is not an option, since I've already spent my budget on Ron's sway bar.

 

[spacetiger]

Bumper was as shown in #3 - RT does not bottom out coming in the driveway, but does on a hard stop, pothole, etc., with just me on the bike. I need to add an inch of compression to make this stop.

Since there is no adjustment available on the shock, my only choice is a rubber wedge/donut on the shock. Do you know the proper size? Prices range from $15 to $40 on fleabay... changing shocks and/or springs is not an option, since I've already spent my budget on Ron's sway bar.

Dragonrider,

I do not have experience with these devices, so I don't know how to guide you on what to get. I would hate to guess with your money.

Perhaps another 2014 owner will chime in as you cannot be the only one having this issue. I know some find it hard to believe there is a common problem like this. Is there a way to use some play doe (from the grand kids); make a ball and place it under the bike so it touches the ground and the bike. Measure this height. Then get on the bike. Then dismount and examine the play doe. It should be thinner, measure this height. Now, get back on the bike with feet on the foot pegs/floorboards and hands on steering wheel and bounce up and down causing the bike to do the same. Now examine the play doe. Take a pic of this as it shows how much margin is left.

A pic of this will show other 2014 RTS riders what they are facing and someone else (or more) will figure out how to fix it. BTW, I looked at the spec of the 2014 RTS and it indicate there is 6.85" of front suspension travel. That is a lot, so if your pic of the 2014 is accurate, I can see how the bike can scrape the bottom when one of the front wheels goes in a road dip/pot hole.

edit: the 2012 RTS front suspension travel is 5.9", the 2013 is 6.85"

jerry

 

[Dragonrider]

My stock 2010 shocks had adjusters, these do not - I replaced my '10s with works shocks because of overall handling issues, and it was a terrific improvement, at half the cost of the competitors shocks. However, my '10 never bottomed out, with the adjusters at "4" - Given that the '14 has "more" travel, the springs must be softer. I believe I will get the improvement I want in overall handling from Ron's bar, rather than wasting money on expensive shocks.

Weather related "heaves" stick chunks of asphalt as much as 2 to 3" in the air, cutting clearance in half - with softer springs, the shocks will allow the bike to scrape, regardless of the travel.

I undersand the math and discussion, but new springs/shocks are out of the question, so I need an alternative to stiffen the springs a bit. Under "normal" riding, it has never been an issue, but road damage is fairly common in our winters, so being proactive is needed. If the wedges will help, or there is a rubber spacer I can put at the top or bottom of the springs, let me know the proper size, and I'll go in that direction.

 

[PMK]

My stock 2010 shocks had adjusters, these do not - I replaced my '10s with works shocks because of overall handling issues, and it was a terrific improvement, at half the cost of the competitors shocks. However, my '10 never bottomed out, with the adjusters at "4" - Given that the '14 has "more" travel, the springs must be softer. I believe I will get the improvement I want in overall handling from Ron's bar, rather than wasting money on expensive shocks.

Weather related "heaves" stick chunks of asphalt as much as 2 to 3" in the air, cutting clearance in half - with softer springs, the shocks will allow the bike to scrape, regardless of the travel.

I undersand the math and discussion, but new springs/shocks are out of the question, so I need an alternative to stiffen the springs a bit. Under "normal" riding, it has never been an issue, but road damage is fairly common in our winters, so being proactive is needed. If the wedges will help, or there is a rubber spacer I can put at the top or bottom of the springs, let me know the proper size, and I'll go in that direction.

I thought I read in a post here that BRP had optional spring rubbers available.

PK

 

[Flamewinger]

Ok I read a bit more on how to adjust the preload on outer coil shock springs. Got my large channel locks and, along with the spanner wrench, I loosened the lock ring and turned the upper ring 4 full turns. Took the bike out for a short spin-around-the-block and it just felt better. No more squishy feel and it didn't scrape either. No Scraping!!! I tried rolling down the driveway and nothing. The skid plate is saved. ( so to speak )

I will be looking into Works or Elka's or even Baha Ron's shocks and getting a set for the front as well as one for the rear sometime next year. Hopefully before full riding season.
First pic is before lock ring adjustment. Second is after adjustment.

.