• There were many reasons for the change of the site software, the biggest was security. The age of the old software also meant no server updates for certain programs. There are many benefits to the new software, one of the biggest is the mobile functionality. Ill fix up some stuff in the coming days, we'll also try to get some of the old addons back or the data imported back into the site like the garage. To create a thread or to reply with a post is basically the same as it was in the prior software. The default style of the site is light colored, but i temporarily added a darker colored style, to change you can find a link at the bottom of the site.

Do you think this will work?

Did for us..!!

Thats what we did and it has cut down considerably. The one thing we have to remember is it is summer and it's hot. Even the two wheeler's complain, I know I did while riding in Texas during the summer. Loved the heat off the engine in the winter...also add the heat shield behind the right peg where the cat is...:thumbup:
 
Huddleston said:
How much Tupperware did you take off to get to the headers.
Click to expand...
Let's just say the frunk and rear compartments and glove box stay on. Everything between and below come off. In my case, I even loosened the section in front of the oil cooler, so I could get to the front of the cylinder. You need to get the Spyder down to the exploded view to get it done.:(

:cus::yikes:and:banghead: not optional!
 
By all means try it for yourself if you wish. Just don't try to touch the pipes after they've been wrapped and the engine has been running for a bit. My infrared thermometer tops out at 850 degrees F and only reads "Hi" (overload) when I try to read the wrapped pipe temperature.

I saw no improvement whatsoever in the heat reaching my legs.

If anyone thinks an 1/8" to even 1/4" of fiberglass can be an effective insulation for anything (much less for exhaust pipes) then try insulating the walls in your house with the stuff and see if it makes a hill of beans difference or wear it as a coat on a frigid day. And yes, it's the same thing whether you're trying to keep heat in or cold out. Just trying to make a point. If it wasn't for all the hype would you believe it using common sense?
 
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pro10is said:
By all means try it for yourself if you wish. Just don't try to touch the pipes after they've been wrapped and the engine has been running for a bit. My infrared thermometer tops out at 850 degrees F and only reads "Hi" (overload) when I try to read the wrapped pipe temperature.

I saw no improvement whatsoever in the heat reaching my legs.

If anyone thinks an 1/8" to even 1/4" of fiberglass can be an effective insulation for anything (much less for exhaust pipes) then try insulating the walls in your house with the stuff and see if it makes a hill of beans difference or wear it as a coat on a frigid day. And yes, it's the same thing whether you're trying to keep heat in or cold out. Just trying to make a point. If it wasn't for all the hype would you believe it using common sense?
Click to expand...

It is not really a matter of trying to insulate the pipes. It is a matter of trying to reflect radiated heat back inward, so it is carried out the exhaust pipe. Becuase the exhaust temperatures have been measured to be increased in testing, it is obviously at least somewhat effective in that manner. Can't say how effective it is for these purposes, but it does reduce engine compartment temperatures on race cars and raise exhaust gas temperatures. I personally am not sure it would be woth the effort, but I doubt it is completely useless. JMHO
 
I suppose effectiveness would depend on what one's trying to achive. We know the front of the engine gets super hot and that's where the pipes are the hottest. We see wires, pipes and hoses running parallel with the headers and have had some posts about failures. We know electronic componnents fail more rapidly with severe heat. We know the gas tank sit's a 1/2 inch from the pipes against the next hottest sections (the bends). We know hot gas and hot intake air equals poor mileage and performance. We've read of instances of boiling gas, melting master cylinders, uncomfortably hot panels, etc.

I guess each person will have to decide if it's worth the effort. I can can vouch for the fact that I can now ride comfortably in 106 temps without too much concern, where last year things were much hotter. If nothing else, the wrapping has extended my riding season.

The Spyder running better in hot conditions and getting closer to 30MPGs this year vs. the 22MPGs in the same temps last year suggests it was worth the effort to me. I still don't feel like I'm strattling and ice cube after the mod, but then again, Phoenix is hot.
 
Removing the clunky air box and creating more air flow has helped my RSS to where i have no more hot foot and havent seen any bubbling gas from heat my last ride was 105 degrees on the guage and no problems or limp mode.
Mike
 
NancysToy said:
It is not really a matter of trying to insulate the pipes. It is a matter of trying to reflect radiated heat back inward, so it is carried out the exhaust pipe. Becuase the exhaust temperatures have been measured to be increased in testing, it is obviously at least somewhat effective in that manner. Can't say how effective it is for these purposes, but it does reduce engine compartment temperatures on race cars and raise exhaust gas temperatures. I personally am not sure it would be woth the effort, but I doubt it is completely useless. JMHO
Click to expand...
That is absolutely correct about the radiation. Heat is conducted three ways, conduction, convection, and radiation. Fiberglass wrap cannot stop convection (the real villain in the case of burning legs), it cannot stop conduction for long (just try to touch your wrapped pipes), and is only very mildly effective with radiation. It's not even the fiberglass that helps with radiation but the small amount of pigments they add to the wrap. Fiberglass is made of glass fibers (surprise) and glass cannot stop infrared radiation well at all (just look at all the modern kitchen stoves that actually use relatively thick glass as the stove top above the ribbon infrared heating elements). They only use fiberglass for the wrap because it doesn't burst in flames at these temperatures and because they can no longer use asbestos. So the only "active ingredient" in exhaust wrap is the minute amount of pigment trying to stop massive amounts of infrared radiation. You would be better off using something that radiation has a tougher time penetrating such as foil as long as you could insulate it enough from conduction so it doesn't begin to radiate itself. That's why foil is used over thick foam by BRP under your tupperware. That actually has a decent chance of lowering conduction and convection by use of the foam, and radiation by use of the foil. Notice however that BRP doesn't even bother with exhaust wrap even though I'm sure they would absolutely love to solve the heat problem that has been plaguing them with all of their Spyder models all these years. You don't even see it on the 2013 redesigns. That's because they've either tested it and it failed or their thermodynamic engineers tell them it's a total waste of time. This should have been the first clue that it doesn't work for this purpose.

Exhaust wrap was originally designed by some automotive thermodynamics experts in an attempt to retain just a little more heat within the walls of the header pipes in an effort to keep the heat of the exhaust gas temperatures as high as possible. This in turn lowers the density of the gasses which expedites flow. This process is known as exhaust gas scavenging and may slightly increase power. Any increase in power is appreciated for racing vehicles so they often take the trouble to wrap the exhaust. That's why exhaust wrap even exists, it was not designed or meant to lower external temperatures. The very slight decrease in externally radiated heat may help lower the temperature of surrounding components a little but not enough to resolve the heat conducted by convection which it cannot stop. So you can't stop the hot legs problem we are having by using exhaust wrap, and if you think you can then I don't know what more to tell you. Feel free to try though, I did and now I'm embarrassed I believed any of the hype because I should know better, I'm angry I wasted my time and money, and everytime my legs burn while riding I think about it.

Just for my own curiosity I went down to the thermodynamics lab where I work this morning where the highly experienced and expert thermal engineers there are trusted to resolve any and all issues concerning both heat and cold. The company I work for trusts them with hundreds of millions of dollars worth of revenue which would be lost if they failed at their jobs. When I passed this by them and asked if there was any way it could work they just laughed and commented "Not very :cus: likely". I wish I talked to them before I wrapped my pipes or at least used my own head.

Hope you enjoyed this episode of Spyderlovers Mythbusters!
 
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pro10is said:
I went down to the thermodynamics lab where I work this morning where the highly experienced and expert thermal engineers there are trusted to resolve any and all issues concerning both heat and cold. The company I work for trusts them with hundreds of millions of dollars worth of revenue which would be lost if they failed at their jobs. When I passed this by them and asked if there was any way it could work they just laughed and commented "Not very :cus: likely".
Click to expand...
So what did they suggest? I don't know an engineering mind that wouldn't at least take a stab at it.
 
Before my retirement, I was a designer of high pressure, high temperature piping systems. Even steam at 350-500 deg.F, steel piping requires a minimum of 2" of calcium silicate insulation and even that has to be jacketed so the surface temperature is tolerable. Exhaust systems are at higher temperatures so you can appreciate the amount of insulation required to attain the same comfort conditions...my engineering specs call for a min. of 4" at 600 deg.F..
 
Okay I'm not arguing the facts presented here, so no flaming required.

For those of us who have notice a reduction in heat on the seat and tupperware, have not noticed boiling gas and have seen an increase in mileage from pre-wrapped pipes. How does the physics and math work out to explain the change? has improved scavanging improved mileage? Has wrapping the pipes redustributed the concentration of heat is some spots and evened it out across the pipe, so It's not as hot up against the tank or imediately under the air box?

:chat:
 
MidLifeCrisis said:
Okay I'm not arguing the facts presented here, so no flaming required.

For those of us who have notice a reduction in heat on the seat and tupperware, have not noticed boiling gas and have seen an increase in mileage from pre-wrapped pipes. How does the physics and math work out to explain the change? has improved scavanging improved mileage? Has wrapping the pipes redustributed the concentration of heat is some spots and evened it out across the pipe, so It's not as hot up against the tank or imediately under the air box?

:chat:
Click to expand...

Good gosh, I hope you didn't think I was flaming you, my posts were only to present a view of my experiences and research, nothing else. I thought a balance of opinions was in order so others would not make the same mistake as I did and so they could spend their money on more effective heat reductions methods like the SpyderPops heat mods (which actually do seem to help). Also the original poster has a GS/RS so I though he needed a view from another RS owner. You have an RT so the difference in models could explain some of the differences in our experience. It's not inconceivable that exhaust gas scavenging could give you slightly better fuel mileage, and so can numerous other things. Also it's not inconceivable that the slight reduction in infrared radiation could possibly help with the gas boiling in some cases especially in very hot weather, but again so could numerous other factors. I have no explanation about the heat on the RT seat you mention, the exhaust pipes on the GS/RS don't affect the seat temperature that I can tell, only on the legs which was what I was trying to find a solution for.

I was disappointed with a few who posted that exhaust wrap was the end all solution for leg heat on the GS/RS when clearly it isn't. It was my fault however for believing them when I knew better. I won't take their advice again without a healthy grain of salt though. Live and learn.
 
Pro10,

I didn't take your comment as flaming me at all. Just wanted to avoid being misunderstood with my question. :) was just wondering if the science and math would explain things better, so we (all readers) would be able to understand the real impact to the mod. I figured someone here would know.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD
 
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