DESS Key code again!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[trikermutha]

Not very likely ...... the DESS module is extremely limited to what it's SPHERE of influence is/does etc ...... You have been given notice by you Spyder ..... this is the beginning ..... it doesn't self - cure ..... no matter what BS a dealer may tell you :banghead::banghead::banghead: ..... If you are coming to the Homecoming look me up and I'll show where my MODULE is now ..... If mine fails, I can fix the problem in less than five minutes with my eyes closed ...... The best BRP tech alive can't say this ....... But then they have to work with OEM Spyders ........... Mike :thumbup:

Getting quotes now for a new DESS Module..I really didn't think it would go away since its getting worse.. :yikes:.. Probably turn it off so I can still ride..:thumbup: May look into that quick change feature myself.. :thumbup:

 

[Deanna777]

I got the DESS error today on EASTER..:yes::yes::yes: That really made my day :thumbup:

Starting to wonder if it was related to a recent Farkle?? But that is just a thought at this point..

What year is your spyder?

What spyder model do you have?

If you have warranty on spyder it is covered. Take it your dealership, and be sure your dealership has the DESS Module . Deanna

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Getting quotes now for a new DESS Module..I really didn't think it would go away since its getting worse.. :yikes:.. Probably turn it off so I can still ride..:thumbup: May look into that quick change feature myself.. :thumbup:

"Probably turn it off so I can still ride" ????? ..... you do realize that the dealer isn't going to do this :yikes: .... and as far as I know only "Joel the biker" (NY) and JC Thorne (Tx) can do it ...... (not will, but can) ...... Mike :thumbup:

 

[trikermutha]

"Probably turn it off so I can still ride" ????? ..... you do realize that the dealer isn't going to do this :yikes: .... and as far as I know only "Joel the biker" (NY) and JC Thorne (Tx) can do it ...... (not will, but can) ...... Mike :thumbup:

YEP that is the plan. Turn it off so I can ride. :thumbup: :yes:

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

YEP that is the plan. Turn it off so I can ride. :thumbup: :yes:

Are you doing this with a Magic wand ??? ..... Mind over Matter ????? .... cause the Dealer isn't DOING IT .... or did you miss that part on my post . ?????? ..... Mike :thumbup:

 

[trikermutha]

I never said a dealer was doing it . :roflblack:

 

[jcthorne]

Not very likely ...... the DESS module is extremely limited to what it's SPHERE of influence is/does etc ...... You have been given notice by you Spyder ..... this is the beginning ..... it doesn't self - cure ..... no matter what BS a dealer may tell you :banghead::banghead::banghead: ..... If you are coming to the Homecoming look me up and I'll show where my MODULE is now ..... If mine fails, I can fix the problem in less than five minutes with my eyes closed ...... The best BRP tech alive can't say this ....... But then they have to work with OEM Spyders ........... Mike :thumbup:

I can fix any of them in about 5 minutes....but I do need my eyes open.

Will be at the Texas Trike Rally this weekend in Kerrville if anyone needs DESS disabled.

 

[beaker]

Hi

I think I may've found out the issue...

First post. Have been having the same issues as everyone else with DESS errors. (2014 RS-S).

However, being an Electronic Engineer, I've taken some time to try and work out the pattern between when it does and does not occur. Lots of testing doing this and that and I've come across this.

'Pay-wave' (or whatever you call them) Credit Cards and POS Cards.

YEP

100% DESS error fail if they're in my wallet in pocket and I'm near Spyder when starting.
0% (except one possible false positive) if I stand 2m (6') away putting jacket/helmet on whilst starting.

So when I thought 'WHY' has this started
- well, when I got Spyder I had one pay-wave card - now I have four!!
- recent update in cards from Bank have cards that work from POS terminals from further distance (more sensitive electronics in card)
- Can-Am DESS likely to be using same frequency band as pay-wave and hence cards may be accidentally responding to the security check.

So please anyone else, try to replicate my tests above!!

Greg@Oz

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Dess theory

Hi

I think I may've found out the issue...

First post. Have been having the same issues as everyone else with DESS errors. (2014 RS-S).

However, being an Electronic Engineer, I've taken some time to try and work out the pattern between when it does and does not occur. Lots of testing doing this and that and I've come across this.

'Pay-wave' (or whatever you call them) Credit Cards and POS Cards.

YEP

100% DESS error fail if they're in my wallet in pocket and I'm near Spyder when starting.
0% (except one possible false positive) if I stand 2m (6') away putting jacket/helmet on whilst starting.

So when I thought 'WHY' has this started
- well, when I got Spyder I had one pay-wave card - now I have four!!
- recent update in cards from Bank have cards that work from POS terminals from further distance (more sensitive electronics in card)
- Can-Am DESS likely to be using same frequency band as pay-wave and hence cards may be accidentally responding to the security check.

So please anyone else, try to replicate my tests above!!

Greg@Oz

Well I had one failure 2014 RT ... and Yes I did have a cc in wallet in my rear pocket ... it has a CHIP and a Strip ..... However my card was in pocket for the 18,000+ miles before and I didn't get a DESS failure .... Was it sleeping???? .... Your Ignition Key has a Chip in it that Talks (so to speak) with the ignition Cylinder chip (?) and the range on that is about 4 inches or less .......... I think your theory isn't valid .....HOWEVER, I applaud :clap: your thinking about it and trying .....:thumbup: :thumbup: :thumbup:.........Mike

 

[Deanna777]

Hi

I think I may've found out the issue...

First post. Have been having the same issues as everyone else with DESS errors. (2014 RS-S).

However, being an Electronic Engineer, I've taken some time to try and work out the pattern between when it does and does not occur. Lots of testing doing this and that and I've come across this.

'Pay-wave' (or whatever you call them) Credit Cards and POS Cards.

YEP

100% DESS error fail if they're in my wallet in pocket and I'm near Spyder when starting.
0% (except one possible false positive) if I stand 2m (6') away putting jacket/helmet on whilst starting.

So when I thought 'WHY' has this started
- well, when I got Spyder I had one pay-wave card - now I have four!!
- recent update in cards from Bank have cards that work from POS terminals from further distance (more sensitive electronics in card)
- Can-Am DESS likely to be using same frequency band as pay-wave and hence cards may be accidentally responding to the security check.

So please anyone else, try to replicate my tests above!!

Greg@Oz

The following info is what I got from my dealership (July 14, 2015) about the D.E.S.S. *** Problem: Intermittently, the ignition key may not be recognized causing the unit not to start. The D.E.S.S. ERROR message will be displayed in the Cluster***

Solution: Replace the D.E.S.S. module. Program the keys using B.U.D.S referring to 2014 RT shop manual section DIGITALLY ENCODED SECURITY SYSTEM.

Technical Explanation:
When the D.E.S.S. module sends its signal to the antenna to read the key chip, the radio frequency produced by the antenna is too strong and the key chip is saturated. The saturation changes the data transmitted back to the D.E.S.S. module causing a bad lecture of the key chip.

They have had cases where a cell phone or magnetic card, placed near the ignition switch cause this. This includes any device that may emit type of frequency.

I have a 2014 RTS-SE6 and have had 2 DESS modules replaced, (July 14, 2015, & Aug. 28, 2015) and on Aug. 28th, 2015, a switch replaced, reprogrammed keys, new trailer lock, reshaped keys, trunk lock. Since then, I have not had the D.E.S.S error. I have 19,700 miles on my Spyder now.

Deanna

 

[HankD]

Hi

I think I may've found out the issue...

First post. Have been having the same issues as everyone else with DESS errors. (2014 RS-S).

However, being an Electronic Engineer, I've taken some time to try and work out the pattern between when it does and does not occur. Lots of testing doing this and that and I've come across this.

'Pay-wave' (or whatever you call them) Credit Cards and POS Cards.

YEP

100% DESS error fail if they're in my wallet in pocket and I'm near Spyder when starting.
0% (except one possible false positive) if I stand 2m (6') away putting jacket/helmet on whilst starting.

So when I thought 'WHY' has this started
- well, when I got Spyder I had one pay-wave card - now I have four!!
- recent update in cards from Bank have cards that work from POS terminals from further distance (more sensitive electronics in card)
- Can-Am DESS likely to be using same frequency band as pay-wave and hence cards may be accidentally responding to the security check.

So please anyone else, try to replicate my tests above!!

Greg@Oz

Try it with an RFID blocking wallet and with your cards in it. Glad I have one now, just in case. It matches my tinfoil hat also. :clap:

 

[beaker]

Well I had one failure 2014 RT ... and Yes I did have a cc in wallet in my rear pocket ... it has a CHIP and a Strip ..... However my card was in pocket for the 18,000+ miles before and I didn't get a DESS failure .... Was it sleeping ???? .... Your Ignition Key has a Chip in it that Talks ( so to speak ) with the ignition Cylinder chip (?) and the range on that is about 4 inches or less .......... I think your theory isn't valid .....HOWEVER I applaud :clap: your thinking about it and trying .....:thumbup::thumbup::thumbup:.........Mike

Hi

No harm taken from your reply ... However, yes, a positive read may need to be within 4 inches... but the distance an object can be to interfere with one may be much larger.

In my testing, I had to be at least 2 metres away during the entire power on cycle (up to point where 'push mode' comes on) to avoid the DESS error. I also tried this with and without my phone in my pocket or smart watch on (so it's not bluetooth or wifi at large).

In balance, I'm not saying it may not be being caused by other reasons as well (water, time, fault) but just that in my case, I can pretty much confirm its my wallet and contents (and since the rest is leather and paper/plastic, it's got to be the cards!)

Cheers anyways.

 

[loisk]

WOW

Has anyone else noticed - there have been almost as many Views of this thread
as the total number of spyders sold ! !

 

[RWM]

It has happened twice on my 2017 RT-S SE6. Both times it was after I washed it. The second time I went to the fuse box and there was Half a spoonful of water sitting on top of the outer box, so I left it open for an hour and then it fired up. Has me worried about riding in the rain away from home or shelter?

Wayne

 

[HankD]

It has happened twice on my 2017 RT-S SE6. Both times it was after I washed it. The second time I went to the fuse box and there was Half a spoonful of water sitting on top of the outer box, so I left it open for an hour and then it fired up. Has me worried about riding in the rain away from home or shelter?

Wayne

Dangit! When I was switching my fuses to have my 12v power "always on", I noticed the same water in my 2017 RT-S outer fuse box cover. Something else to talk to the dealer about during my 3,000 mile service in a month or so.

 

[Deanna777]

WOW

Has anyone else noticed - there have been almost as many Views of this thread
as the total number of spyders sold ! !

A double WOW

I did notice the # of Views/reply's on this thread, ( that I started 2 years ago) This thread has a lot of useful/helpful info about the D.E.S.S.

Deanna

 

[Deanna777]

Bump

Deanna

 

[HankD]

Dangit! When I was switching my fuses to have my 12v power "always on", I noticed the same water in my 2017 RT-S outer fuse box cover. Something else to talk to the dealer about during my 3,000 mile service in a month or so.

I found out on another thread (from someone much smarter about Spyders than I) that water in the OUTER fuse box covers is normal, as those covers are there to protect the Frunk from getting wet. Water in the inside covers is a problem. So, I am relieved. Just wanted to pass it on for others that might not have seen it and were concerned about water in the outer covers.

 

[PaladinLV]

It's been well over 10K miles since I had the original module and ignition switch replaced and no error . . . UNTIL YESTERDAY!

I made an important discovery. Your BlueTooth comms unit (in this case a Sena 20S) may and in this specific scenario does affect the system IF in close vicinity of the key.

After riding all day without a problem, was home and testing some "noise" coming from my unit. Was trying to determine if it was being caused by the SM10 (made a modification) or the iPod.
While checking the system I was leaning over the console and turned the key (20S was on) and BANG - DESS ERROR came on.
Of course I was in shock and since I was now no longer interested in my previous problem shut off the 20S, immediately tried to restart the Spyder and all was good!
Being curious, I removed the 20S from helmet turned it on, placed it on the console and turned the key.
BANG - DESS error.

I repeated this several times with the S20 off and on, and every time it was on, I got the error; every time it was off, no error.

So now to be safe, I decided to turn on the 20S - AFTER the Spyder starts.

I might add, there is NO INTERFERENCE, while sitting on the seat NORMALLY, but to be on the safe side decided to use the 20S on after starting just to reduce frustration.

Again, this was with a Sena 20S and a 2014 RT-S, I cannot state if other models of Sena or Spyder will have the same problem OR results.

AJ

 

[UtahPete]

.... Your BlueTooth comms unit (in this case a Sena 20S) may and in this specific scenario does affect the system IF in close vicinity of the key.

After riding all day without a problem, was home and testing some "noise" coming from my unit. Was trying to determine if it was being caused by the SM10 (made a modification) or the iPod.
While checking the system I was leaning over the console and turned the key (20S was on) and BANG - DESS ERROR came on.
Of course I was in shock and since I was now no longer interested in my previous problem shut off the 20S, immediately tried to restart the Spyder and all was good!
Being curious, I removed the 20S from helmet turned it on, placed it on the console and turned the key.
BANG - DESS error.

I repeated this several times with the S20 off and on, and every time it was on, I got the error; every time it was off, no error.

So now to be safe, I decided to turn on the 20S - AFTER the Spyder starts.

I might add, there is NO INTERFERENCE while sitting on the seat NORMALLY, but to be on the safe side I decided to turn the 20S on after starting just to reduce frustration.

....

My wife and I both have the Sena 20S and each have a 2014 Spyder RTL. So far, we have not experienced anything like this. We haven't yet tried leaning over the key with our helmets on and the 20S on ... is that what you were doing? It just says you were leaning over the console (instrument panel?).

Does anyone know what frequency band the D.E.S.S. uses to communicate with the key? I think we should only expect interference by other nearby electronics if those are operating in the same frequency band. It would be easy enough to compare the DESS frequency with, say, a BT device.