Check Key - could it be the cell-phone is too close?

[George1]

This last weekend I installed a cell phone holder/charger on the handle bar of my 2021 Spyder RT Limited. It is with 4 to 5 inches from the ignition key. Tonight when my wife & I were going out to eat, I put the key in the ignition & turned it. The dash lite up & then a waring came on stating "Check Key". After several tries I went & got the spare key. It did the same thing. But after eight or so additional tries the message went away & the bike started & off to dinner we went (keeping in mind the cell phone is in the charger, charging). When we got ready to leave the restaurant the message reappeared & we could not leave. We were getting the same message of "Check Key". I had & tried both keys & still got the message on the TFT screen "Check Key". I then got the owners manual out & it said for a Check Key message to contact a Can Am dealer.

Then my wife said to hand her my cell phone so she could Google it & see if there is anything on the internet that may help. I pulled my cell phone out of the holder/charger & handed it to her. Then when I tried the key again the Check Key message didn't come up so I started the bike & we made it home. Once home I kept the cell phone in my pocket & turned the key on & off several times and not once did I get that message again. I have to think it was something to do with the cell phone being close to the ignition switch or the wireless cell phone charger.

Here is the cell phone charger: https://www.ebay.com/itm/113897473730


Is there anyone on the site that may know anything about this? Or had this issue before? Thanks in advance, George

Prosper, Texas

 

[Arion]

I'm not familiar with the specific charger you showed but my guess is that it's the wireless charging feature that's causing the trouble. You should be able to confirm this by disconnecting the charger's power supply then, with your phone turned on, mount it in the bracket and see what happens when you turn on the key. It just might be an Occam's Razor issue

 

[George1]

I have determined it is not when the phone is close to the ignition switch & it is not when the charger is on & the cell phone is not in the charger, it seems to trip the "Check Key" warning & disable the bike from starting when the cell phone is in the charger & the charger is on. If the cell phone is in the charger & the charger is turned off the bike operates correctly. There must be something that creates a signal that causes the bike to not read the chip in the ignition key. I think I have it figured out & I will keep test and see what happens. Thanks for your help. George

 

[Peter Aawen]

I don't think it'll be so much of a 'causes the bike to not read the chip' thing per se.... it's far more likely to be, as Arion suggested, that the act of 'charging the phone' is swamping the DESS Antenna. :gaah:

Basically, cos the wireless charger's pumping out enough rf energy to charge the phone, the antenna can't 'read' the passive chip in the key simply because that signal is drowned in amongst all that other rf noise that's just the phone charger doing its thing!! :shocked: And that'll tie in with your observations above - it's not the phone itself, either on or off; it's not the charger itself, either on or off; but it IS when the phone is in the charger and the charger is actively charging... And THAT's going to be because that's the only time the charger is pumping out great wads of rf energy! :yikes:

You MIGHT be able to solve the problem by moving the 15W wireless charger further away from the key & the antenna that's just below it; but I suspect the amount of rf energy needed to charge the phone will still swamp the antenna & key; cos the key is completely passive & the DESS antenna needs that key to be within about 40mm to 'read' it, so that particular relationship is gonna call for a relatively tiny amount of power while the 15W wireless charger is pumping out several hundred orders of magnitude of that power/rf energy, so the antenna/DESS simply doesn't stand a snowball's chance in hell - and probably wouldn't even if you put the phone/charger right out on the end of the handlebars! :banghead:

You MIGHT get away with it if you put the phone & charger in the frunk, or better yet, in the trunk - even better again, you could put a fully earthed and complete metal mesh cage around the phone/charger.... something sorta like what they generally call a 'Faraday Cage' - but then you could charge the phone, it just probably wouldn't get any signal, in or out! :cus: Or maybe you could revert to a 'plug-in charger' - that should work, there shouldn't be much in the way of radiated rf energy... well, probably not unless your phone, the cable, &/or the plug is about to burst into flames! :dontknow:

Good Luck! :cheers:

 

[billybovine]

Interesting problem. I agree with Peters explanation on what's happening. There is a really easy fix. Since the DESS is only active for a couple seconds after the ignition key is turned on. It looks for the key and verifies it. Then is not active again until the next time the key is turned on. So just turn the key on before putting the phone in the charger. But of course you will forget once and a while. I would.

 

[old Timer]

Peter is correct.

 

[Jdr00ejr]

It's all about the RF noise. Peter is spot on so I won't repeat what he said. And I agree with Billy, just don't put the phone in the charger until after you've turned the key on and the DESS has recognized the key. Minor inconvenience to use the mount charger you like and when you forget, you just have to remove the phone and try the key again.

 

[George1]

Yes, I believe Peter is correct along with all of you & I appreciate your help & input. I played with the phone, the charger & charging system last night & I determined that must be the answer. I had this same charger on my BMW K1600 with no issues so it threw me for a loop for awhile. Thanks everyone. George S

 

[K80Shooter]

Just one other question, (I do however agree with the interference suggestion)

Just how did you wire this up? Where did you get your power from? If you got it from the GPS plug you should be good, if however you spliced in somewhere else that also could be the issue.

 

[PaladinLV]

I reported this problem way back in 2016 in the DESS thread.
Like many problems stemming around the "key" issue no answer.
However, check to see if Deactivating Bluetooth and/or WiFi effect the results.
For me, just the phone resting near the ignition "was" enough to mess with the system.

AJ

 

[George1]

K80Shooter I ran the power & ground wire direct to the battery so I could charge my cell phone when the bike is off. But yesterday I drove the bike & did not use the cell phone charger I mounted and had zero issues. I did connect the phone to the USB wire in the small glove box in front of the handlebars. So I believe we have solved this issue. At least now I know what was causing it (I hope). Thanks for all the help & advice. George