BRP reply re surging

[barb36jack31]

Had update installed Tuesday. Bike surged badly and I went back to dealer. He had other bikes that surged also after the update was installed, so he called BRP and asked what could be done. Today, 21 Aug, BRP calls him back and said they were aware that the update causes a disruption in the electronics and causes surging in some bikes. He went on to say there was nothing BRP could do and that the surging condition was just something I would have to live with. I felt this was a rarher peremptory remark, but my dealer said that was what he actually said. BRP suggested doing the ground cable disconnect exercise, but did not offer much hope that this would help.

Thought I would pass this along for what it is worth. I plan to monitor my Spyder's performance very carefully and fully annotate what happens. I don't really believe this is the end of it all, but that is where we stand as of now.

For Lamonster - do you think the Juice Box would be able to rectify the surging?

 

[Dudley]

When we were still 3000 miles from home and the Spyder started running like a spastic rabbit, though I was a bit disappointed, it brought us home. Took it out Tuesday for about 150 miles, and never a burp. Go figure! We will be going out again in a few minutes for about 200 miles, so we shall see. I will try to get it to do what it was doing with the 5 bars, etc. Surging is something (though unhappily) I can live with, as long as we don't get stranded. I will be pulling the plastics off this weekend for oil change and clean-up, etc., and look for anything strange. If the surging stops altogether in the next few days, I will post my thoughts on why I think it did.

 

[bone crusher]

Had update installed Tuesday. Bike surged badly and I went back to dealer. He had other bikes that surged also after the update was installed, so he called BRP and asked what could be done. Today, 21 Aug, BRP calls him back and said they were aware that the update causes a disruption in the electronics and causes surging in some bikes. He went on to say there was nothing BRP could do and that the surging condition was just something I would have to live with. I felt this was a rarher peremptory remark, but my dealer said that was what he actually said. BRP suggested doing the ground cable disconnect exercise, but did not offer much hope that this would help.

Thought I would pass this along for what it is worth. I plan to monitor my Spyder's performance very carefully and fully annotate what happens. I don't really believe this is the end of it all, but that is where we stand as of now.

For Lamonster - do you think the Juice Box would be able to rectify the surging?

I am not a Lamonster but I play one on TV...the JB will help as you can adjust the fuel/O2 mixture...this tweaking makes a HUGE difference in the performance of the bike...

 

[Tom in NM]

Great!

I am not a Lamonster but I play one on TV...

:clap::roflblack::clap:
Funniest thing I have ever read on this forum . . . . .

From all the other threads on the update, my take is that there are a variety of factors, conditions and combinations that trigger "problems". If you can control one of the factors, you may lessen or possibly eliminate the "problems" until another Perfect Storm occurs - if it ever does.

My stock 2008 SE5 Spyder has been great since the update. Different, but great and nicely improved. The day before yesterday, I left the Spyder in the driveway before I was going to run some short errands. High 90's air temp, 6% humidity, full gas tank, and in the Sun. When I started the Spyder, the dash showed Zero Engine Bars and a Temp of 125F. The Spyder did not run as badly as some have described, but certainly not as well as it had been. Hesitations on starting to move in 1st, but 7mph in 1st at idle, and it just didn't seem as "smooth" - no backfires or anything like that. About 5 miles of errands, no speed over 35, the Engine Bars got to 3 and the Temp down to 113F. It was running a little better, but not normal.

I do this type of ride at least 5 times a week. Never felt like this before. Has not done it since. Since that one ride, it has been running great.

Maybe the 125F Temp gave it a data point that computed out some bad values for the different systems and things got a little rough. Maybe it was something else.

There seems to be a lot of variability in how and when the Spyder manifests some of these running issues. There does not seem to be one thing to be done that will fix everyones problems. I think someone posted in another thread ( Scotty, maybe ), that the update moved the Spyder systems closer to some operational and setting limits. That could expose some equipment flaws that were not noticeable before. And it could be more sensitive to some outside factors, like heat or Ethanol content of gas, and so on.

One theme that is common though, is that for many, the Spyder seems to "adjust" or "learn" its way out of the problems. Or maybe the Perfect Storm conditions are just not there.

One final point, I really dislike the statement; "its just something you will have to learn to live with." Especially without looking at the specific case and being able to compare it to a measurable baseline. How do they know that you are not experiencing unusual and dangerous surging? That is sloppy, irresponsible, uncaring and totally unprofessional. I realize that it was 'hearsay', but it did sound like the dealer accurately captured it. When ever you hear that statement, you know you are not getting Support, Service, Aid or Assistance - you are getting the "Brush Off".

Tom

 

[dabreitbach]

My bike was running like s--t since the update. Popping, surging,backfiring ect. I pinched off the vaccum line to the evap canister befor the valve. WOW what a difference. Its running great now. Just a slight bit of surging around 4200 rpm. Other wise its great. Try this to see if it fixes yours. Mine is either a bad purge valve or bad programing. Now they can fix it.:2thumbs::2thumbs::2thumbs:

Its pretty bad when we have to do the troubleshooting work for them.

 

[barb36jack31]

Which side is the evap cannister on? Don't want to take off more panels than neccessary.

 

[dabreitbach]

Right panel by knee. The one that says can am on it . 4 screws. Evap canister is right there. I just used a hose clamp to pinch it off.:2thumbs:

 

[Hoog]

Had update installed Tuesday. Bike surged badly and I went back to dealer. He had other bikes that surged also after the update was installed, so he called BRP and asked what could be done. Today, 21 Aug, BRP calls him back and said they were aware that the update causes a disruption in the electronics and causes surging in some bikes. He went on to say there was nothing BRP could do and that the surging condition was just something I would have to live with...

Jack, I musta been in there right after you...

The new mapping has obviously affected more than "some" bikes and I would bet BRP comes out with another software load soon. This stuff isn't rocket science fer crissakes. I put the factory off road pipe on both of my Triumphs and had the dealer flash the chip with the factory "off road" mapping. They run perfectly.

Get with the program BRP.

 

[Arachnid]

I think I have asked this before. But I will do it again as I cant remember if or what answer I got.
Do you have to get the upgrade?
My Spyder rides, turns and runs just fine the way it is. I would hate to clobber it up with an unnecessary upgrade for a problem I don't have.

Thanks,
Mike

 

[jwfranklin]

I think I have asked this before. But I will do it again as I cant remember if or what answer I got.
Do you have to get the upgrade?
My Spyder rides, turns and runs just fine the way it is. I would hate to clobber it up with an unnecessary upgrade for a problem I don't have.

Thanks,
Mike

I asked my dealer this on Wed. Said they have been told that any Spyder that comes in without the upgrade, to do it. He said if you specifically asked him not to do it, he won't, it is our bikes, they don't belong to BRP.
That said, he told me anything that needed to be done to to the Spyder that required hooking it up to the BUDS system, it would make him do the upgrade before he could go any further.

 

[Tom in NM]

A much more reasonable BRP statement

I saw this on the other thread - BRP's Official statement on the update;

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=13594

A much better way of saying it, than what Barb36Jack31's dealer was told.

Tom

 

[BRPjunkie]

I asked my dealer this on Wed. Said they have been told that any Spyder that comes in without the upgrade, to do it. He said if you specifically asked him not to do it, he won't, it is our bikes, they don't belong to BRP.
That said, he told me anything that needed to be done to to the Spyder that required hooking it up to the BUDS system, it would make him do the upgrade before he could go any further.

My service guy said that if a Spyder is brought in for sevice, they have to do the DPS update for liability reasons. Owner cannot request it not be done since it is a NHTSA safety recall. Once hooked up to BUDS, recall must be done. Only way to avoid it is not bring it in. Can't do that for long and maintain warranty since 6,000 mile service requires some dealer inspections.

 

[Dudley]

I have no idea, but after all the surging, etc., that our Spyder did after the steering update in MN, we have taken it out 2 times this week and it purred like a contented kitten. Could it be that it got better as the miles we driven after the update? It's now been about 3000 miles. I am as puzzled as anyone else. Although I was not too happy about the surging, etc., I was going to ride it as long as we weren't left stranded. We didn't get left stranded, so maybe it all worked itself out. Maybe we just all aught to ride our Spyders and put miles after the update and see if anything gets better.

 

[Hoog]

I have no idea, but after all the surging, etc., that our Spyder did after the steering update in MN, we have taken it out 2 times this week and it purred like a contented kitten. Could it be that it got better as the miles we driven after the update? It's now been about 3000 miles. I am as puzzled as anyone else. Although I was not too happy about the surging, etc., I was going to ride it as long as we weren't left stranded. We didn't get left stranded, so maybe it all worked itself out. Maybe we just all aught to ride our Spyders and put miles after the update and see if anything gets better.

MotoGirl and I are leaving for a ~4500 mile trip a week from today. Last year's trip to Utah had the GPS go bad, leading to a few long days, but we did not get stranded. I'd like to hope this thing sorts itself out somewhere between Orlando and Rapid City...

 

[Smylinacha]

Once hooked up to BUDS, recall must be done. Only way to avoid it is not bring it in.

Well goody for BRP - of course they don't want anyone suing them for steering mishaps. But now they've screwed up so many :spyder:with the other cr@p they threw in with the update - unbeknownst to many Ryders and they better figure all that out soon! My level of confidence has gone down regarding BRP since all these problems started. Now I like my dealer but all this stuff seems to even be out of the dealer's control - he hooks it up to BUDS and who knows what other surprise downloads we'll get that they aren't informing anyone about.

My steering seems okay but every time I ryde now I think "so when is mine gonna start acting up?" Kinda takes the joy out of ryding for me.

Just ranting - very crabby - Just quit smoking last night. And right now I'm mad that many ryders have messed up :spyder:due to no fault of their own.

 

[duneside]

Congrats on the smoking thing, it was hard for me but definately worth it,much more money to buy toys with!

 

[Firefly]

Well goody for BRP - of course they don't want anyone suing them for steering mishaps. But now they've screwed up so many :spyder:with the other cr@p they threw in with the update - unbeknownst to many Ryders and they better figure all that out soon! My level of confidence has gone down regarding BRP since all these problems started. Now I like my dealer but all this stuff seems to even be out of the dealer's control - he hooks it up to BUDS and who knows what other surprise downloads we'll get that they aren't informing anyone about.

My steering seems okay but every time I ryde now I think "so when is mine gonna start acting up?" Kinda takes the joy out of ryding for me.

Just ranting - very crabby - Just quit smoking last night. And right now I'm mad that many ryders have messed up :spyder:due to no fault of their own.

Man--- did I ever pick the wrong day to stop doing heroin .....:roflblack:

Love that movie!

 

[3wheeldemon]

Man--- did I ever pick the wrong day to stop doing heroin .....:roflblack:

:roflblack::roflblack::roflblack:

 

[bjt]

Well goody for BRP - of course they don't want anyone suing them for steering mishaps. But now they've screwed up so many :spyder:with the other cr@p they threw in with the update - unbeknownst to many Ryders and they better figure all that out soon! My level of confidence has gone down regarding BRP since all these problems started. Now I like my dealer but all this stuff seems to even be out of the dealer's control - he hooks it up to BUDS and who knows what other surprise downloads we'll get that they aren't informing anyone about.

My steering seems okay but every time I ryde now I think "so when is mine gonna start acting up?" Kinda takes the joy out of ryding for me.

Just ranting - very crabby - Just quit smoking last night. And right now I'm mad that many ryders have messed up :spyder:due to no fault of their own.

After reading a lot of info on the update and the problems involved and discussing it with our service manager, I don't think this is a BRP update problem but a service tech problem. If they don't do the other resets that they are supposed to do with the update, the computer is trying to run the engine with bad input data. If your dealer says they have completed multiple updates without having any owners complain about bad running and they know about the other resets that they are supposed to do, I'd go ahead and let them do the update. They know how to do it properly.

 

[barb36jack31]

I wonder how many dealers will admit to doing the upgrade improperly? How about somewhere between zip and zero?