Back to Service Again

[PCBeachBum]

For weeks I was getting a coolant smell and after numerous visits to the service dept. they had no fix. They did add coolant since it was down but still I was getting a coolant smell. BUDS showed that operating temp was at 225 degrees. The charge for that visit $53.00 and some change and still had the coolant smell.

I took off the panels and rinsed down the radiators and engine and the smell stopped and now I'm getting the smell of gas fumes, everytime I stop. First I thought it was coming from the car in front of me but, after getting home there it was again. Taking off the panels I found no leak and checking the fuel cap found it to be fine.

It seems that every two weeks I'm back to service and now wish I never bought a demo. 2600 miles and I'm disgusted with this Spyder. I'd sell it but, won't sell it knowing it could burst into flames with another owner. I couldn't live with myself, knowing I could put someone else in danger.

Sure it could be a simple fix but would it be covered under the warranty? I read in a post last year where some of the 08 models caught fire but, was unable to find it.

Anyone got a fire suit they aren' using? I'm taking it over in the morning and if it's not covered, they can keep it. I'm sick of spending a day every other week waiting around the dealership, so they can tell me that everything checks out with BUDS and we couldn't find anything wrong.

The only good thing about this dealership, is I don't need an appointment to bring it in. They take it right in as soon as they see you drive in. Will I make it without a fire? Cross your fingers cause if it gets too hot, I'm pulling over, jumping off and getting away from it.

Everytime they see me over there, they say you back again,:hun:

 

[WaltH]

Don't give up too quickly. The rewards of Spyder ownership are huge. If I didn't have my Spyder, I would have to go back to riding Harleys. I am going to ride until they put me in the ground.

Make sure that the updates have been done on your Spyder. The first update (mandatory recall) included a re-programing of the purge valve for the evap canister. This cleared the gas vapors from the canister more often. The second update (engine performance optimization) added length to the vent hose for the canister and redirected it forward. Both of these changes reduced the gas smell others had been experiencing. Best of all, do a canisterectomy. This gets rid of the canister all together. Much has been written on this subject. Do a search on canisterectomy.

Others have faced much bigger problems than a gas smell. This problem can be solved. Stay with it. I had the first Spyder fire on May 4, 2009. I am very grateful that I did not give up at that time. I bought a new Spyder and started over. I am loving it more all the time.

 

[PCBeachBum]

Don't give up too quickly. The rewards of Spyder ownership are huge. If I didn't have my Spyder, I would have to go back to riding Harleys. I am going to ride until they put me in the ground.

Make sure that the updates have been done on your Spyder. The first update (mandatory recall) included a re-programing of the purge valve for the evap canister. This cleared the gas vapors from the canister more often. The second update (engine performance optimization) added length to the vent hose for the canister and redirected it forward. Both of these changes reduced the gas smell others had been experiencing. Best of all, do a canisterectomy. This gets rid of the canister all together. Much has been written on this subject. Do a search on canisterectomy.

Others have faced much bigger problems than a gas smell. This problem can be solved. Stay with it. I had the first Spyder fire on May 4, 2009. I am very grateful that I did not give up at that time. I bought a new Spyder and started over. I am loving it more all the time.

Thanks for the advice! I had the first update done, the mandatory recall and that picked up a problem with the DPS. After leaving the dealership I was getting the scroll on my dash to Check DPS. I took it back and they couldn't find a problem and sent me on my way. They told me to bring it back the following week. They had to come pick it up cause the steering locked up 4 days later. The DPS was replaced and since it has worked great.

Don't misunderstand, the Spyder got me off the sidelines after 32 years of not ryding and I do enjoy this machine more than I did the two BSA's I had when I was younger. I just wish I didn't have to return to the service dept. every other week for this problem now with gas fumes and the problems before with the coolant.

I do know that with all new machines the bugs need to be worked out but buying a demo was a mistake, I won't make again. It's like buying anything used, your buying someone else's problems.

I'm not going to give up on the Spyder and (if) I could start over, I would have gotten the 2009 next to it instead. Would it had been differant? I can't answer that and all I know is what I have now and it does have me down and I'll be really down, if this isn't covered under the warranty. I guess I'll find out in about 6 hours.:dontknow:

 

[SpyderWolf]

Hey Brian, check the PM I sent you this morning. :thumbup:

Chances are your Y Gaskets, especially the one on the right side, have burned away and need to be replaced. I also started smelling fuel on my Spyder without any leaks detected anywhere. Then it started spitting and sputtering and running like crap when it got hot outside. After reading more about the Y Gaskets on here I decided to replace mine, as I figured it couldn't hurt anything. A little more than half of my right one was totally gone.

Here is a thread with details on the Y Gasket replacement process:

http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?t=19691

Best of luck with getting your issues resolved. It might also be worth your time to talk to the dealership about your concerns, and the constant visits to get things fixed. Perhaps they will work with you on a price break for service, or a good trade in deal for a newer Spyder. :thumbup:

Let us know what you find out.

 

[NancysToy]

Your post hints of a problem that seems to be growing rapidly in the industry. More and more techs are tied too tightly to their computers, and lack the mechanical skills or experience to troubleshoot problems outside the monitored systems. Not everything that goes wrong can be explained by BUDS! Physical ills, like coolant leaks, fuel leaks, oil leaks, misalingment, or worn suspension components are not monitored, and will not show up on a stinking computer screen. Don't get me wrong, I admire the knowledge and skills needed to tune and repair these modern electronic marvels, but our machines are hybrids...part electronic and part mechanical. Sometimes they require a keen eye, a feel for the machine, some mechanical experience, and persistence and dedication on the part of the tech, more than an umbilical cord connected to a laptop. Alas, these are qualities that seems to be increasingly lacking these days.

Your dealer seems to be all too quick with the pat answers and a desire to push you out the door. You need somebody with some old-school skills and the dedication to get to the root of your problems no matter what it takes. You can't find loose fuel clamps or a bad purge valves on a computer. No laptop is going to tell your tech where to look for them. Part of the solution is old fashioned troubleshooting, and some may require physical tests which are outlined in the shop manual. I hope you can find the right dealer, and make your Spyder well again.

 

[ThreeWheels]

I took off the panels and rinsed down the radiators and engine and the smell stopped and now I'm getting the smell of gas fumes, everytime I stop. First I thought it was coming from the car in front of me but, after getting home there it was again. Taking off the panels I found no leak and checking the fuel cap found it to be fine.

How do you fill the gas tank ??
Did you top it off? I know I did for a while. The poor range of an RT encourages you to put as much gas in it as possible.
It turns out that I overfilled the tank, putting liquid gas into the Evap cannister. Until the cannister empties itself, you get the smell of gas. So just be careful that you don't overfill the tank and the smell will go away. It took me running a whole tank (and then not overfilling anymore) before the smell went away.
I don't mean to minimize your issues, I'm just sharing my experience with something similar to yours, hoping that you might have a simple fix.

 

[jabba11]

There has been an issue with the coolant tank cracking you should check that if the coolant smeel returns. Also the gass smell is somewhat common. I get it occasssionally too and it seems to come and go for no real reason. Some have said the gas cap leaks others talk about the evap canister etc. I have NEVER seen gas leaking anywhere though and while the fumes are a concern unless you are in an enclosed evironment I doubt there would even be enough for combustion. Maybe your fumes are a lot worse than mine though and a gas leak is serious problem. You might want to look over your fuel lines although a leak should defintely be read by buds as a low fuel pressure. I also agree with the post about the techs. There seems to be a real lack of knowledge and care when it comes to servicing these bikes. Its a new machine so it too takes time for them to get used to working on them and discovering the ins and outs of the bike.

 

[PCBeachBum]

There has been an issue with the coolant tank cracking you should check that if the coolant smeel returns. Also the gass smell is somewhat common. I get it occasssionally too and it seems to come and go for no real reason. Some have said the gas cap leaks others talk about the evap canister etc. I have NEVER seen gas leaking anywhere though and while the fumes are a concern unless you are in an enclosed evironment I doubt there would even be enough for combustion. Maybe your fumes are a lot worse than mine though and a gas leak is serious problem. You might want to look over your fuel lines although a leak should defintely be read by buds as a low fuel pressure. I also agree with the post about the techs. There seems to be a real lack of knowledge and care when it comes to servicing these bikes. Its a new machine so it too takes time for them to get used to working on them and discovering the ins and outs of the bike.

Thank you all for the advice. I took it in this morning and the service managers could smell the gas fumes. They took it to the service dept and the Spyder tech, who is old school didn't put it on the computer. He removed the panels and checked everything out. He found no leaks and while it was over there, the service managers asked what octaine I was using. I told them 87 and Earnie who has a couple ATV's said he uses nothing but 93 octaine in his.

Earnie said he had to tear down one of the engines on an ATV and found the parts to be clean as a whistle and said after doing the same when using 87 octaine it was much worse. Now he uses nothing but 93 in his and found he also gets better performance than he did with the 87.

They both said with these engines, you need a higher octaine. It burns off better than the 87 and when it gets low on fuel, more fumes end up in the cannister.

I needed gas and on the way home I filled up with the 93 octaine. How far did I fill it? I only put the nozzle in between 2 and 3 inches. I also turn on the key, so I can see how much fuel its taking. I never have over filled it.

After filling it and with every stop, I wasn't getting the gas fumes anymore and when I got home, I didn't smell anything. I'm hoping this is the fix, cause Dave the Spyder tech, wants me to drop it off and leave it for a few days so he can get into it. I also noticed it had more get up and go with the 93 octaine and will use that from now on.

In 1979, I bought a Mazda 626 and with that I had to use at least 91 octaine and anything less it ran like crap. That didn't have the rotary engine in it but a 4 banger and still it needed the higher octaine. Spending a few dollars more to get better performance out of the Spyder, I'm willing to do and I won't allow the gas guage to drop much lower than a half a tank.

As for the coolant tank, that is fine and I check it when its cold and it's at the Max line. Thanks for the advice on that and I'll continue to check it. Since rinsing down the radiators and the engine, the coolant smell has gone away.

So I'm not as down as I was yesterday and after the ryde home, I'm having a natural high. I still may take it over and let Dave have it for a few days. With hurricane season here I'll wait til one is in the Gulf to do it. At least it will be inside and I can hold off in getting a storage unit with Sam my ryding buddy.:thumbup:

 

[Smylinacha]

I hope it is the different fuel that solves the problem!

 

[Tripod]

If the coolant smell returns, I'll wager it is a cracked coolant reservoir. How was yours tested? At a ride lunch with other Spyder owners ( 18 of us) I asked if anyone else has had a bad reservoir...me and five other raised our hands

I can't address the gas smell issue, I just suggest that you get the BRP update that fixes the fuel cannister vent...if you haven't already.

Best of luck, I know these issues are frustrating, but a lot of us have gone through them, and they seem to be behind us now and we're enjoying the **** out these fantastic machines.

Tripod :joke:

 

[boborgera]

For weeks I was getting a coolant smell and after numerous visits to the service dept. they had no fix. They did add coolant since it was down but still I was getting a coolant smell. BUDS showed that operating temp was at 225 degrees. The charge for that visit $53.00 and some change and still had the coolant smell.

I took off the panels and rinsed down the radiators and engine and the smell stopped

Just for heck of it, Right side behind the radiator you'll see a black hose that go's to the water pump it's held on with a worm clamp, it might be a little lose check it with a screwdriver. A few Spyders had lose clamps[mine included] and if so it will leak intermittently.

 

[jabba11]

Thank you all for the advice. I took it in this morning and the service managers could smell the gas fumes. They took it to the service dept and the Spyder tech, who is old school didn't put it on the computer. He removed the panels and checked everything out. He found no leaks and while it was over there, the service managers asked what octaine I was using. I told them 87 and Earnie who has a couple ATV's said he uses nothing but 93 octaine in his.

Earnie said he had to tear down one of the engines on an ATV and found the parts to be clean as a whistle and said after doing the same when using 87 octaine it was much worse. Now he uses nothing but 93 in his and found he also gets better performance than he did with the 87.

They both said with these engines, you need a higher octaine. It burns off better than the 87 and when it gets low on fuel, more fumes end up in the cannister.

I needed gas and on the way home I filled up with the 93 octaine. How far did I fill it? I only put the nozzle in between 2 and 3 inches. I also turn on the key, so I can see how much fuel its taking. I never have over filled it.

After filling it and with every stop, I wasn't getting the gas fumes anymore and when I got home, I didn't smell anything. I'm hoping this is the fix, cause Dave the Spyder tech, wants me to drop it off and leave it for a few days so he can get into it. I also noticed it had more get up and go with the 93 octaine and will use that from now on.

In 1979, I bought a Mazda 626 and with that I had to use at least 91 octaine and anything less it ran like crap. That didn't have the rotary engine in it but a 4 banger and still it needed the higher octaine. Spending a few dollars more to get better performance out of the Spyder, I'm willing to do and I won't allow the gas guage to drop much lower than a half a tank.

As for the coolant tank, that is fine and I check it when its cold and it's at the Max line. Thanks for the advice on that and I'll continue to check it. Since rinsing down the radiators and the engine, the coolant smell has gone away.

So I'm not as down as I was yesterday and after the ryde home, I'm having a natural high. I still may take it over and let Dave have it for a few days. With hurricane season here I'll wait til one is in the Gulf to do it. At least it will be inside and I can hold off in getting a storage unit with Sam my ryding buddy.:thumbup:

OOOHHHH MAN your opened up the ole can-o-octane debate LOL get ready for a gazillion replies about octane and the spyder. In 1.....2......3..... :roflblack:

 

[SpyderWolf]

Keep us posted as to if running the higher octane is actually the cure for your Spyder.

 

[wyliec]

There should be no can of worms opened regarding octane. PCBeachBum should use whatever he wants with no commnets from the peanut gallery regarding the virtue of 87 octane.

 

[garganos]

Have your dealer perform a pressure test on the cooling system. It's fairly easy. We have had quite a few tanks that have cracked. We have replaced them under warranty. The crack is very hard to see and almost looks like a seam line. I have also seen a few of the hose clamps loosen over time. They are an otiker style clamp. If you can not get them to stop leaking they can be replaced with screw type clamps.

Over filling the fuel tank is usually the biggest cause of raw fuel smells. One recomemndation is to fill up the tank about 10-20 miles from home. Also be certain that the evap hose rerouting was done.

 

[boborgera]

Have I have also seen a few of the hose clamps loosen over time. They are an otiker style clamp. If you can not get them to stop leaking they can be replaced with screw type clamps.

Not all the the hose clamps are otiker style, one in particular, the one that leaked on mine and a few others is a screw [worm type], and can be tighten with a screwdriver with out removing any panels.

 

[PCBeachBum]

For weeks I was getting a coolant smell and after numerous visits to the service dept. they had no fix. They did add coolant since it was down but still I was getting a coolant smell. BUDS showed that operating temp was at 225 degrees. The charge for that visit $53.00 and some change and still had the coolant smell.

I took off the panels and rinsed down the radiators and engine and the smell stopped

Just for heck of it, Right side behind the radiator you'll see a black hose that go's to the water pump it's held on with a worm clamp, it might be a little lose check it with a screwdriver. A few Spyders had lose clamps[mine included] and if so it will leak intermittently.

Thanks for the tip, I'll check it out Friday and see if its lose.

 

[PCBeachBum]

Checked that hose clamp with my hand and it felt tight but, than put the screwdriver to it and it was loose and took a turn to tighten it up. Thanks for all the information from everyone. :2thumbs:

I found another bike shop here that works on Spyders. They use Spyder parts so no worries about losing warranty coverage. They charge $65.00 an hour for labor and if its less than an hour they adjust the cost to the time it takes to do the work.:thumbup:

I was in the post office and behind me in line was the wife of the owner. She offered me there card and I told her I had one. This was certainly the last place I would have thought that serviced Spyder's. The name of this shop is "Black Jack Choppers."

Talking to the owner he said he has ridden the Spyder as has most working there and they all had nothing but positive things to say about it. They also mentioned they have seen me go by just about everyday and were wondering when I would stop by.

I'm glad I did cause now I have a place on the beach just a few miles from me to take it to if a problem comes up. One tech asked how much HP it had and I told him 106 and he smiled saying that'll work. With all the new choppers sitting outside in a line, the Spyder got a lot of attention. Mostly from older riders who aren't ready for a rocking chair.:hun: :roflblack:

The 93 octane is working out fine for me and Friday being a hot and humid day, I didn't smell any fumes.

The last thing I want to do is start an octane war here and learned from SpyderWolf, that octane was a rather large subject here. All I can say is use what you feel is best for you and your Spyder. :thumbup:

 

[SpyderWolf]

I found another bike shop here that works on Spyders. They use Spyder parts so no worries about losing warranty coverage. They charge $65.00 an hour for labor and if its less than an hour they adjust the cost to the time it takes to do the work.:thumbup:

Glad to hear you found another shop that can service your Spyder. :thumbup: It sounds like their rates are very reasonable as well. Best of luck with everything.