Gasoline Tank Failure

[satownsendsr]

What is BRP saying? Have they even been contacted? Ask your dealer for the claim number and call the fine folks in Wisconsin yourself.

No, BRP has not been contacted. The foreman states that he is trying to keep from contacting them because they will claim the exhaust caused the failure and I would definitely have to pay for the tank and repairs. The tank is $500.00. I know, it sounds like he is trying to cya. If he still comes back with the exhaust as the issue, then I will contact BRP myself.


Thanks,
Steve

Sent from my Galaxy Note Pro 12.2

 

[cuznjohn]

i mean tanks are built strong, so i can't see how this can happen. brp might be in panic mode now because they don't need another investigation on something else bad with one of their bikes. so i will think they will do everything in their power to try and say that it is caused by owner alterations done on the bike and not product failure.

this is just my opinion and i am not a mechanic.

 

[BajaRon]

...I talked with the shop foreman and he is thinking that the failure is tied to the Spyder Attitude exhaust system that I put on a few months back. He isn't sure but seems to think that by changing the exhaust system to a Spyder Attitude that it caused the engine to run leaner, thus creating more heat in the piping which caused the tank to get hot and when I put cold gasoline in the tank it caused it to collapse....

Seriously! They told you this with a straight face! These guys should be playing poker in Vegas!

You need to schedule them for one of these. But I can tell you right now, they won't go.

But don't feel alone in this. My DPS went out on my Spyder and the dealership told me it was because I installed an aftermarket cruise control unit. Right! My cruise control killed the electric motor which operates the DPS! We had a little discussion on the subject and I got a new DPS installed at no charge.

Dealer stories know no boundaries.

 

[billybovine]

i mean tanks are built strong, so i can't see how this can happen. brp might be in panic mode now because they don't need another investigation on something else bad with one of their bikes. so i will think they will do everything in their power to try and say that it is caused by owner alterations done on the bike and not product failure.

this is just my opinion and i am not a mechanic.

BRP can't be in panic mode if as the OP says they have not been contacted.

 

[cuznjohn]

BRP can't be in panic mode if as the OP says they have not been contacted.

i thought they wanted the tank back to see what happened. sorry if i was wrong

 

[billybovine]

i thought they wanted the tank back to see what happened. sorry if i was wrong

The dealer is dancing here and what he is telling the OP is not consistent. What is the truth?

 

[billybovine]

Sorry but his 'theory' is complete bunk. The vent system for the fuel tank has failed and vacuum has been applied to the tank.

The aftermarket exhaust would apply LESS heat to the tank as the cat is gone from under the tank which is a MAJOR source of heat. The heat goes out the tail pipe instead of up into the tank. Cooler, not hotter.

Next, even IF the exhaust did heat the fuel and you put cold fuel in, there are vents in the fuel system to prevent vacuum. One in the gas cap, one in the evap system. Both have failed in your case as EITHER would have prevented this. There are LOTS of spyders with aftermarket exhaust and NONE have done this. Do not agree to pay for the fault. Push it up to BRP.

I would strongly suggest they test both the gas cap and the evaporative emissions system and find the faults rather than making odd theories. If they do not have the expertise to do these tests, have BRP recommend a dealer that does.

The gas cap on the Spyder is not vented. Agree that the venting system must be fully tested to find the root cause. It is certainly not the gas tank's fault.

 

[Huddleston]

.... I tried to explain to him the same thing about the exhaust making it run cooler, not hotter, but he kept going back to the "running lean" thing causing it to run hotter....

Did you ever get lean fuel code? The Buds report should show if it was running lean.

 

[satownsendsr]

Did you ever get lean fuel code? The Buds report should show if it was running lean.

No, I have never received any codes of any kind since I owned it and I bought it new.
Here are some pictures of the tank still in the bike.

 

[cuznjohn]

is it possible for a fuel pump to suck so much to suck a tank in like that

 

[BajaRon]

If the gas tank is so hot that cool gasoline will make it collapse, consider this.

Putting gasoline into a tank that hot is not only DANGEROUS! But it is going to immediately vaporize (boil) the gasoline probably spewing fuel out the fill hole. I would think the person doing the filling might notice this! :yikes:

But in any case, this reaction of hot tank/cool fuel will create ADDITIONAL pressure, not a vacuum. They really need to think these preposterous conclusions through a little better.

This entire scenario is so ridiculous that I'm a bit embarrassed to even be discussing the possibility.

The vent system failed, plain and simple. Ray Charles could see that. The sooner they admit this the sooner you can get to a solution.

 

[billybovine]

If the gas tank is so hot that cool gasoline will make it collapse, consider this.

Putting gasoline into a tank that hot is not only DANGEROUS! But it is going to immediately vaporize (boil) the gasoline probably spewing fuel out the fill hole. I would think the person doing the filling might notice this! :yikes:

But in any case, this reaction of hot tank/cool fuel will create ADDITIONAL pressure, not a vacuum. They really need to think these preposterous conclusions through a little better.

This entire scenario is so ridiculous that I'm a bit embarrassed to even be discussing the possibility.

The vent system failed, plain and simple. Ray Charles could see that. The sooner they admit this the sooner you can get to a solution.

Well said Ron!!!

 

[Lamonster]

No, BRP has not been contacted. The foreman states that he is trying to keep from contacting them because they will claim the exhaust caused the failure and I would definitely have to pay for the tank and repairs. The tank is $500.00. I know, it sounds like he is trying to cya. If he still comes back with the exhaust as the issue, then I will contact BRP myself.


Thanks,
Steve

Sent from my Galaxy Note Pro 12.2

You do know BRP reads these type of post right?

It was not your pipe, you had/have a vent issue that's it. Find that and your problem is fixed.

 

[satownsendsr]

You do know BRP reads these type of post right?

It was not your pipe, you had/have a vent issue that's it. Find that and your problem is fixed.

Yes, I was aware that BRP read these posts. The shop is checking the entire fuel system to ensure it is operating correctly. He wanted to do some checks before he contacted BRP, not that he was trying to keep something from them. He felt if he notified them now, they would want the tank back before he had a chance to do his tests. He is going to notify them what he finds. I am betting it will be the vent system also. When I talked to him yesterday he was speculating and told me he was since he had never seen this before.

 

[garb55]

Sounds like the dealer is trying to collect twice
First he said BRP wants the tank back
Then he said he did not contact BRP yet do to after market exhaust
Sounds like he wants you to pay then he will send tank back to BRP and collect from them too
If you pay you keep old tank

 

[satownsendsr]

Sounds like the dealer is trying to collect twice
First he said BRP wants the tank back
Then he said he did not contact BRP yet do to after market exhaust
Sounds like he wants you to pay then he will send tank back to BRP and collect from them too
If you pay you keep old tank

I don't think it is going to come to that. The exhaust didn't have anything to do with the failure. I believe he will find the vent system malfunctioned and all this is covered under warranty. I know a few RTL owners that have put Spyder Attitude exhaust on their machines far longer than I have had it on mine and they have had no issues of any kind with their fuel system. Remove the exhaust and the obvious thing left is the venting. I'm no mechanic, but this is JMO.
I'll know soon enough. I find it interesting and somewhat frustrating that I happen to be the only one that this has happened to from the people that have read these posts and the ones I've talked to personally. The dealer has never had this happen before. Just lucky I guess.
Now my wife is afraid to ride on it. She thinks it is going to catch on fire and burn us up. [emoji16] [emoji16] [emoji16] [emoji107] [emoji107] [emoji107]

Thanks,
Steve

Sent from my Galaxy Note Pro 12.2

 

[cuznjohn]

i can understand your wife's fears but it could happen to any one of us. just because your bike happened to have the problem it doesn't mean it might not happen to anyone else. any one of us can buy something and right out of the box there is a problem. just don't let them bs you, ask every question and any part the replace look at the old one

 

[jcthorne]

The gas cap on the Spyder is not vented. Agree that the venting system must be fully tested to find the root cause. It is certainly not the gas tank's fault.

I mis spoke. Not vented, its a 'sealed' system for the evap emissions system.

What I meant to say was the cap incorporates a vacuum relief, sometimes known as a conservation vent. Anyway, the cap is designed not to allow a strong vacuum in the tank.

 

[WA5VHU]

Are you sure it is a vacuum that was preventing you from removing the cap? It it is a vacuum you have a Major problem with the tank vent system. I am more inclined to say the reason the cap wouldn't come off is the expansion of the tank due to the heat as you described. After it cooled for 45 minutes you could unscrew the cap. Next time this happens just pour some water around the cap to cool it down and see if it comes off. Also if you look under the front right side look at the vent hose and see if you can see vapor coming out of the end of the tube.

Pretty sure it was a vacuum both times. There was a large sucking sound when the cap finally released and there was not a rush of gasoline fumes around the opening. Before and after the cap came off I could hear the gas "boiling" in the tank.

 

[BajaRon]

Pretty sure it was a vacuum both times. There was a large sucking sound when the cap finally released and there was not a rush of gasoline fumes around the opening. Before and after the cap came off I could hear the gas "boiling" in the tank.

Gasoline boils in a lot of tanks. Cars included. People just don't realize it. It doesn't have to be all that hot for gasoline to boil. As bad as it sounds, for the most part, it isn't a big deal.

Now my wife is afraid to ride on it. She thinks it is going to catch on fire and burn us up. [emoji16] [emoji16] [emoji16] [emoji107] [emoji107] [emoji107]

Vent systems, like every other system, can fail. It isn't common but it happens. It's been happening since fuel pumps were introduced to the world. The real problem here is not so much that the vent system failed (which I realize is the physical problem). But that someone is trying to put the blame on components that have nothing to do with the issue.

I'm sorry your wife is now leery of the Spyder. I think we've all run into this kind of concern from our wives from time to time. I sold a van a few years ago because my wife had lost confidence in it. I could have fixed it to be as reliable as ever. But she would never have been happy so I got rid of it and got another vehicle.

But your Spyder is not going to catch fire and burn up. It just needs a new tank and the vent system set right. Then you'll be riding trouble free like the huge majority of Spyder owners. If you can talk her into giving this another chance I think you will both be glad you did.