RT ACCIDENT

[TexasTripod]

????

I was following the couple who had the accident on the RT . They had completed a left-hand turn was going straight about 15 to 20 mph when without any notice the RT turned turned right without any notice causing the L/H tire off the ground causing the RT to turn over in the couple being thrown from the RT . I was only 15 feet behind the couple when I pulled over engine was still running in the RT was still in first gear is my personal opinion that the DPS caused this accident and BRP to should take responsibility I also believe it's about time that all SPYDER owners Sue BRP for the what they paid for the spyder and take all existing SPYDER and drop them in the middle Atlantic Ocean because they are becoming a death trap . We'll you be next ?

Am I missing something here? I don't understand how the Spyder making a right-hand turn could lift the left tire off of the ground.

 

[Lamonster]

I'm very sorry to hear this. I hope they heal up okay and they can nail down the cause of the accident. I'm sure BRP will be just as concerned as all of us.

Scotty explained the operation of the DPS very well. I do know from personal experience that if the DPS is not zeroed out correctly after being replaced that the torque sensor and the steering angle sensor will fight each other. This will be less likely to show up if you're doing a lot of turns because there is less to reference but you'll notice it more if you're heading down a straight road with little variations in your steering. That gives the computer time to check the angle sensor and to try and make corrections with the torque sensor. I believe it can be no more than 4 degrees out of calibration. I'm sure Len at Cowtown could tell us what is required by BRP to properly setup a new or replaced DPS.

 

[wyliec]

I was following the couple who had the accident on the RT . They had completed a left-hand turn was going straight about 15 to 20 mph when without any notice the RT turned turned right without any notice causing the L/H tire off the ground causing the RT to turn over in the couple being thrown from the RT . I was only 15 feet behind the couple when I pulled over engine was still running in the RT was still in first gear is my personal opinion that the DPS caused this accident and BRP to should take responsibility I also believe it's about time that all SPYDER owners Sue BRP for the what they paid for the spyder and take all existing SPYDER and drop them in the middle Atlantic Ocean because they are becoming a death trap . We'll you be next ?

I'm glad they are okay.

But, before you toss your spyder into the ocean, let me take it off your hands.

 

[SpydermanCT]

My thoughts and prayers go out to our hurt Spyerlovers and I hope for a full and speedy recovery. What ever the outcome of why this happened I hope they can continue to ride and enjoy their dream of touring.

 

[SpyderWolf]

I was only 15 feet behind the couple when I pulled over engine was still running in the RT was still in first gear is my personal opinion that the DPS caused this accident and BRP to should take responsibility I also believe it's about time that all SPYDER owners Sue BRP for the what they paid for the spyder and take all existing SPYDER and drop them in the middle Atlantic Ocean because they are becoming a death trap . We'll you be next ?

I understand your concern after witnessing the accident in person, but the last thing we need to do is spread fear, uncertainty, and doubt, as to the cause and whether all of us are in immenent danger. Suing BRP and dumping all of the Spyders into the ocean will not solve anything.

As Wyliec stated, if you no longer feel safe on your RT, there are many who would be more than happy to buy it from you.

In the meantime, it is up to each individual to asses the amount of risk they are willing to take in their own lives. There are inherent risks in everything we do, from walking across the street, to eating different foods, to driving any type of vehicle. This was an accident, and accidents happen from time to time. If you tripped over a curb and broke your ankle, would you want to sue the city to remove all of the sidewalks? :dontknow:

 

[MMcc]

DPS quick turns

I had similar problems with my :spyder2:2008 GS SM5. While driving on the highway at speed if I changed lanes to pass another vehicle and then moved back into the original lane the sypder would make a quick jerk to the right.:gaah: I could not make that happen at low speeds (below 50 mph). Only happened when moving from right lane to left lane and then back to right lane. Tried it from left lane to right lane and back to left, no problems. Took it to the dealer and asked them to take it for a test drive. They did not have time for that. Had a friend drive it and I rode his RT and followed him. Same response for him so I knew it was not just me. Calls to Carlo and located a dealer who had DPS units on the shelf and made an appointment for the next week. Trailed it there and in 3 hours a new DPS. New learning curve with the improved steering. Still careful about lane changes, waiting for the sudden lurch to occur. Has not happened again but still gun shy.

 

[Desert Spyder]

I hope to be visiting or talking on the phone with my friends this afternoon. I know things happened very quickly once they completed their left hand turn (it was not a right turn as someone mentioned). They were part of the Boron run that is held every year on New Years. We left from my church parking lot and had traveled maybe 3 miles (3 rights and a left). There were 6 bikes in the group and I was leading the group. The road we were on, though straight, is kinda wavy. At that particular stretch I was going bout 45 (much slower than I usually do) and gradually increasing to 55. We were in staggered formation so I could only see the next 2 bikes and once in a while the fourth. I never realized we were missing 2 bikes until the freeway onramp about 2 miles from the incident. Maybe I should have stopped and waited but its not wise to stop on an onramp unless its an emergency so I continued. I thought they either got caught at the signal light or Spyderflyer may have needed to stop at home for something which is only a couple hundred yards from the accident site. I didn't know about the accident until I arrived in Boron 40 minutes later. Before leaving the parking lot and asking for the Lord's protection, I briefed the group that when we get in 2 lane traffic it would be wise to split in 2 groups and have a 10-15 second interval between us to install a safety space for any nutty cagers who needs to pass unwisely. There were 4 bikers, you recall, who died on a secluded road near the Mexican border within the last 2 months, possibly because there was no safety interval. Ironically, this was not the only accident on this run. I heard there was a member of the Blacksheep club, a Christian Harley club with a chapter in Victorville, that crashed on Hwy 395 and had to be airlifted out. I don't know his condition at this moment.

So my brothers and sisters, do be careful out there. Not only do we have to brave the elements, other vehicles, potholes, debris and distractions, but we also have to be alert for changes in our own vehicles at a moments notice whether they were caused by a manufacturers defect or by a mechanics error and the common element in all is man. If man made it, it will fail eventually. If God made it, man will try to improve upon it or get rid of it.

I knew about the dangers of ryding early. Another friend of mine (TJFischer) was one of the early ones who's byke locked up on him causing him serious injuries. He's still ryding and loving it. I will continue to ryde and I hope my friend and his wife will continue to do so as well.

The morning air was cold and the fellowship of the ryde is outstanding. There were 3 ryders that rode 3 hours to come here for a burrito. Only in America!

 

[sinkhole]

:agree: What Scotty and Lamont mention must have some effect on steering issues like this. After experiencing a situation similar to this, although nowhere as bad, I followed Lamont's tip of doing figure eights to reset the sensors, and it worked. Evidently, turning lock to lock "nudges" the sensors back into position and resets them. Mine has been acting fine for the last 500 miles. I'm still in the queue for the new DPS, and maybe the longer it takes, the better.

 

[Campverdefela]

I was following the couple who had the accident on the RT . They had completed a left-hand turn was going straight about 15 to 20 mph when without any notice the RT turned turned right without any notice causing the L/H tire off the ground causing the RT to turn over in the couple being thrown from the RT . I was only 15 feet behind the couple when I pulled over engine was still running in the RT was still in first gear is my personal opinion that the DPS caused this accident and BRP to should take responsibility I also believe it's about time that all SPYDER owners Sue BRP for the what they paid for the spyder and take all existing SPYDER and drop them in the middle Atlantic Ocean because they are becoming a death trap . We'll you be next ?

If anyone is to be sued it probably should be the dealership that did the recall work, not that I'm saying anyone should be sued. Also the Spyder is way safer than any 2 wheelers on the road, way way safer....

 

[wyliec]

I was wondering how long it would take.........

The guy witnessed the incident first hand, for cryin' out loud. It was HIS friends that were involved. He's entitled to his opinion as much as you are yours. If he is unhappy with his machine, or its manufacturer, that's OK. The DPS has been an ongoing, unhappy saga for a lot of people. It's not exactly a long stretch to suspect that's the cause. We thought it was over. Maybe it's not.

If YOU are comfortable with YOUR machine, then that's good. I'd bet that he was before yesterday also. I'd also bet that if you saw your friends get tossed into the street from a rolled over Spyder, you'd see it differently, too.

Maybe it is time for one our overstaffed, underutilized government agencies to get involved and have a closer look at things.......

HDX,

Not saying you are right or wrong; actually not saying anybody is right or wrong. But, you are consistent.

 

[Boriken]

Glad to hear that your friends are OK, keep us posted on their condition.
Thanks
Boriken

 

[bullant12]

I was following the couple who had the accident on the RT . They had completed a left-hand turn was going straight about 15 to 20 mph when without any notice the RT turned turned right without any notice causing the L/H tire off the ground causing the RT to turn over in the couple being thrown from the RT . I was only 15 feet behind the couple when I pulled over engine was still running in the RT was still in first gear is my personal opinion that the DPS caused this accident and BRP to should take responsibility I also believe it's about time that all SPYDER owners Sue BRP for the what they paid for the spyder and take all existing SPYDER and drop them in the middle Atlantic Ocean because they are becoming a death trap . We'll you be next ?

I don't see any Toyota owners throwing their vehicles in the middle of the Atlantic Ocean after the accelerator recall. In fact, Toyota loyalty is as strong as ever.

The only way I see that all Spyder owners sue BRP is when BRP admits that they had a fault in their design and recall all Spyders, which would be hard to happen. BRP, manufacturing products for as long as the Big 3 car US carmakers, will be testing and making sure that their product will not undergo any kind of obligated recalls that the Governments can push forward and make the company go under. As an example again, the Big 3, have gotten thru numerous class action suits and obligated recalls, and they are still in business. Your statement, as being your own personal opinion, can be seen as lacking of facts and data and just taking things to your own hands.

And that is my opinion...:cus:

 

[SpyderWolf]

I was wondering how long it would take.........

The guy witnessed the incident first hand, for cryin' out loud. It was HIS friends that were involved. He's entitled to his opinion as much as you are yours. If he is unhappy with his machine, or its manufacturer, that's OK. The DPS has been an ongoing, unhappy saga for a lot of people. It's not exactly a long stretch to suspect that's the cause. We thought it was over. Maybe it's not.

If YOU are comfortable with YOUR machine, then that's good. I'd bet that he was before yesterday also. I'd also bet that if you saw your friends get tossed into the street from a rolled over Spyder, you'd see it differently, too.

Maybe it is time for one our overstaffed, underutilized government agencies to get involved and have a closer look at things.......

Of course he has a right to his opinion, and I do not blame him for feeling like he does. However, this has been a long ongoing issue with DPS failures and people wanting everyone else to stay off their Spyders, or in this case dump them in the ocean. I have been consistent in my opinion as well, and will continue to be. If YOU, as an individual, are uncomfortable ryding YOUR Spyder and do not feel safe on it, then by all means sell it or dump it in the ocean. It is yours to do with what you see fit. At the same time, you shouldn't be telling everybody else to sue BRP and dump theirs in the ocean if THEY are comfortable taking the risk of ryding THEIR Spyder.

This argument has gone back and forth since the very first DPS problem was reported. The person who had the accident needs to report it to the NHTSA, and then it will be up to that overstaffed, underutilized, government agency to decide if they are going to look any further into it or not.

Even with all of the earlier DPS issues, and you never getting a solid answer on what the cause of the problem was, and if your wife's Spyder was truly fixed, you did not get rid or it, nor tell everyone else to dump them in the ocean. :thumbup:

 

[SpyderWolf]

Oh, I think I get it now-

It's OK for someone to have a different viewpoint, just don't discuss it......

I'm really not trying to argue, and I don't want to see this thread get closed.....BUT, the other side of the coin, is that some people have been scolding the disillusioned members since the DPS issues began, as well.

No one can sufficiently assess ALL of the risks if they are not presented with ALL of the information. Sometimes some negative opinion comes with it. So be it.

You're an adult. I'm an adult. I'm assuming the upset individual is an adult. Someone telling him what he shouldn't say is as silly as someone telling you to dump your Spyder in the ocean.......

I did not mean to sound as if I was scolding someone, and definitely do not want this thread to get closed either. I will agree that we are all adults, and have the right to make up our own minds on what we want to do. That is very easy to live with, and I can leave it at that as well. :thumbup:

 

[bruiser]

So my brothers and sisters, do be careful out there. Not only do we have to brave the elements, other vehicles, potholes, debris and distractions, but we also have to be alert for changes in our own vehicles at a moments notice whether they were caused by a manufacturers defect or by a mechanics error and the common element in all is man. If man made it, it will fail eventually. If God made it, man will try to improve upon it or get rid of it.

I agree with Desert Spyder. No one can predict how any mechanical object is going to act or react at any given time. Also, there are way too many frivolous lawsuits tying up our courts. BRP would be in a world of trouble if we sued for every thing that ocurrs with our :spyder2:'s. What would happen if they were forced out of the:spyder:business? Where would that leave those of us who have spyders. Yes, I am concerned about reliability, but I'm not going to give up ryding my :spyder2:. We all should work together to help make the Spyder a better product. Fear is a powerful emotion, easily elicited, and can cloud our judgement.

 

[IWN2RYD]

All the debate without technical or scientific facts is just emotion based off of personal beliefs/experience.

Personally I find it very hard to believe that the steering box itself did this because of my personal knowledge. And it if was, we have a real big problem on our hands because both the RS and RT use the same box right?

I also cannot figure out how a hard right turn pulls the left side tire off the ground pps:. Should it not be the right side tire coming off the ground with a right turn? And I understand it happened right in front of a member, so was this member watching the road, looked up and saw part of this or all of it happen?

But that does not mean it did not happen!

This bike needs to be gone through with a fine tooth comb by a third party and fast.

I am so pleased to read the owners are ok. So the next step is to find out if it was mechanical or user. And not one of us here can say which at this point.

 

[Desert Spyder]

OK, I got some new info to share after talking with the owner, and BTW they are doing OK although she's feeling better today than yesterday, and he's feeling worse...his ribs took a beating. They, Wayne and Sue, both shared with me how they DO NOT want this to be the end of their Spyder life. They want another and they want this experience to be shared with the community AND BRP, to help make this a learning experience. The last thing on their mind is to be sue happy.

I stopped by the scene of the accident on the way home from church today. Pretty easy because this was on the way home from church.

I mentioned earlier how he was turning left and was straightening out when it happened and this was not the case. Picture yourself at a 4-way stop with 2 lanes going each direction and the turn lane in the middle. Wayne was turning left at the intersection. Within 1-1.5 seconds he felt the right front dip suddenly but had no idea why. He remembered no sound. He was trying his best to steer to safety but the steering was locked and he struck a curb, the bike rolled to its side, throwing the occupants, and righted itself. As soon as he saw his wife was alright he turned the engine off and that was the last he had anything to do with the bike. He has not seen the bike since. It was actually towed about 200 yards away.

Wayne has no idea if it was the suspension, the steering, the cross arm, the brakes or what that went bad but he wants BRP to do an autopsy as you will on the byke and see what exactly went wrong so that it doesn't happen again.

The incident appears to have occured in the middle of the intersection and Wayne was only going 10-15 MPH. I have not seen the byke although there is quite a bit of plastic, the antenna, mirror on the ground. Even the top of the passenger backrest is ripped according to Wayne.

So he never really exited the intersection and it happened so fast its hard to recall every little detail.

Wayne and Sue would like to thank every one who said a prayer for them because they honestly feel better because of them. Ironically after saying the group prayer before we left the church and leading the group down 3 streets for 3 miles to the scene of the accident and after talking to Wayne and Sue, I thought what if I had taken the group to the nearest freeway onramp just blocks from the church and we had entered the freeway and this happened at freeway speeds and this happened. I am certain the results would have been much more unpleasant perhaps even fatal.

May God continue to protect the Spyder community and our 2 wheeling brothers.

 

[Raptor]

Personally I find it very hard to believe that the steering box itself did this because of my personal knowledge. And it if was, we have a real big problem on our hands because both the RS and RT use the same box right?

I don't know what personal knowledge you have but I tend to agree, I do not think it was the box itself. The problem with this system (in my mind) is that there is too much electronic garbage feeding the box trying to tell it how to behave. I never realized that until I had already bought our Spyders, and now it's too late. I have to say this; the BEST ride I ever had on 14 was on a day out just before I did the recall on our Spyders when my DPS just stopped working altogether. I rode harder than I ever had before on raw unassisted steering and it ROCKED! I didn't have to worry about it. I had what I had and I went after it. And guess what? She steered better than ever. It has not been that good since, even though the recall unit is working well. If there was ever a choice, I would love to bring my bike to that state again.

This bike needs to be gone through with a fine tooth comb by a third party and fast.

I think that at this point this is a critical action item. This has been going on for too long now, and things like this just feed the fire. This needs to be done by a party that has the tools and the expertise to do an impartial analysis of this system and determine what to do to make it safe once and for all. Untill that happens we will keep on wondering and spinning wheels.

 

[bruiser]

Now that is info we all could use, thanks DS :2thumbs:. Although there are still questions to be answered, I know we will all be interested in the results of the post-mortem, uh, investigation. At the risk of second guessing, it does sound to me as if something broke instead of software failure. Please pass on to Wayne and Sue our continued prayers for speedy healing.

 

[SilverSurfer]

Common Thread of Wisdom

On one fringe, we have those who are taking matters too personally. On the other fringe are those who want to introduce the Spyder to seawater, for some reason, sue everybody and start WWIII.

The Common Thread of Wisdom in this entire thread seems to be to ENSURE the mechanic, when doing the DPS recall re-sets the steering angle sensor using BUDS, and (without knowing the procedure myself) any other sensor that's applicable. It's great when everyone puts mental power (vs. emotion) on issues like this. With all the feedback, one can see what's common between the most owners. In this case, it sure appears to be sensor re-set ... something I will relay to my mechanics when I get my DPS done, and watch with an eagle eye.

Thanks, everyone.

~ Surfer