2015 RTS SE6 Fast Crank, no start, no fuel - fuel blockage maybe? Any Help?

[Handyman76]

Had the bike at the dealership for months waiting on steering parts. They never put it on a tender or disconnected the battery. So, by the time I got it back the battery was shot. I decided to go with a new battery Lithium battery. Installed it, rode it maybe three times, and then I left it off the trickle charger for 3 weeks... Dead! Charged it back up over a week; tried to start it; fast crank; no start; and no fuel smell coming out of the exhaust. I can hear the fuel pump come on and charge the injection system but again no start just that weird fast crank.

I have a Dynojet tune on it, love it, had it a year. Did this as I'd modified the exhaust, drove it, and this caused it to run far too rich; the tuner fixed that and gave it some more throttle response. Well, I assumed that the one the last major thing I'd done to the bike was the Dynojet. Plus, I'd assumed I may be taking it back to the dealer to get it running again. So, I restored the original tune. No help, it still won't fire off.

I checked for codes on the tuner and found P0335 and P0406C. The first correlated to cam position sensor, so I ordered one. It appears that this is a common failure at 40,000 plus miles on these 1330's. The one I received was a made in Mexico, with no metal tip over the sensor like on the original. I installed it and got the same result. Contacted the custom tuner that wrote the code and picked his brain. He claimed it couldn't be the tune, as they just don't get corrupted out of the blue.

I caught a thread on here where someone put out that over long-term storage, fuel could go bad in the lines, and block flow to the filter or beyond. I only keep alcohol free fuel in my bikes. But I tried this trick I've used on machines stored over the winter. I lightly, lightly pressurize the tank to try and force the blockage to the filter or get some fuel flow. Did it and same result, even got a stick to push the starter button while I was down low near the exhaust. Yeah, the neighbors love that shot! No fuel smell. So, I'll start de-paneling the left side, track the fuel lines, and see if I can find a blockage.

Anyone got any experience in this one? HELPPPPPPP?? I can't stand to taking this thing to the Dealer! Thanks guys, enjoy the ride; summers are short!

 

[2dogs]

Give it a tiny shot of starting fluid and see if it fires. Just give it a bit; too much and you can hurt it.

 

[Handyman76]

Give it a tiny shot of starting fluid and see if it fires. Just give it a bit; too much and you can hurt it.

Did it - no JOY! Started at the intake snout. Nothing went back; took the side off, gave it a shot across the air cleaner - Nothing. So now I'm thinking the ECU has gone bad. One of the weirdest things is that the safety screen doesn't come up anymore, the screen that you had to acknowledge before being able to start. I doubt it would have been in the latest firmware update of the Dynojet tuner - I asked the guys in the get go if I could get rid of that with a tune. Does the ECU have its own fuse? Thanks for your suggestion, but I guess I'll just need to dig in a lil deeper....

 

[happyspyder2039]

Try a different battery?

 

[Mikey]

Make sure you have spark at the plugs! If not check your kill switch! And fuses. When was the last time you put fresh fuel in it?

 

[2dogs]

Did it - no JOY! ....

No spark, if you didn't get a couple of fires with starting fluid. Like Mikey said check the fuses and if all is good, I'd trailer it to a qualified repair shop. Diagnostics is your next best move. These things can be a real headache if you don't have the proper equipment and knowledge to accurately diagnose it yourself. Good luck.

 

[BajaRon]

Too bad you're in Washington state. I'd love to take a shot at this one.

 

[JWK70]

I am by no means a Spyder mechanic, but what you described about the weird fast crank reminds me of a bad Bendix gear in the starter.
I’m not sure how the starter on a Spyder works, but on a vehicle, the centrifugal force from the starter spinning pushes out the drive gear on the starter that engages the flywheel to spin the engine over. When the Bendix sticks, it doesn’t allow that gear to go out and engage the flywheel, which is what causes that weird sounding fast spinning noise you hear. Sometimes lightly tapping the starter with a hammer would be enough to free it up as a short-term bandage.
Not sure if this will help, but thought I would mention it...

 

[Handyman76]

Haven't had a chance to get back out there and check it out. But the starter issue sounds pretty much the way its acting, only I can tell the engine is turning over.... I'm convinced it's the ECU and somehow, it's not allowing the injectors to pass fuel and there's no spark. But one: it would be hard to get one right now; and two, I'm sure they're priced astronomically...

Then this morning while riding to work on my FJR, a homeless guy ran into the street! He destroyed my fairing windscreen and flew up into my chest. So it will be a few days before I'll be wrenching on anything. And I just finished upgrading that bike a few months ago.

Still, above all else, the drug addicted kid survived - just a broken leg and a head injury. Hopefully this pulls him out of that destructive spiral. God Bless us all.

 

[Handyman76]

Thanks I downloaded the maintenance manual for the bike to check a few more things out. I've tried to get further and further into working on this thing its to expensive to take to the shop for little things. But some times its the littlest things..... I haven't had a chance to go over the maintenance manual since I got it downloaded Sunday night ... This my second one and they've been pretty reliable.... Doesn't sound like anyone else has experienced this exact same scenario.... So as the other guy mentioned put the old battery back in it and check some fuses.... Or take it back to the dealership and hope the kid knows what he's doing..... Thank for all your help guys and God Bless us all.

 

[Mikey]

You never said if you had spark??????:dontknow: If you did, I missed it.

 

[SpyderJerry]

If the engine is turning over with little resistance, you may want to take a compression test. Possible camshaft idler may have failed. Check out Y-der on youtube.

 

[Handyman76]

Who was this in response to?

No doesn't appear to be but the weird fast crank may point to other issues.... I'm hoping a starter issue and not internals on the engine I'm way out of warranty I believe. 15 with 44K on it.

 

[Handyman76]

Who was this in response to??

Thanks I'll take a gander was just out going thru fuses and relays and such everything checks good there... I'm leaning towards a starter issue its self... I would hate to think a Rotax had a major internal malfunction... I'll look up the youtube video. And look for starter failures. the maintenance manual I downloaded has a few trouble shooting tips I'll try them tomorrow. Finally bit the bullet and called the shop local here only 3 weeks out! Well that gives me time to stumble on the fix....Thanks Jerry

 

[Peter Aawen]

No doesn't appear to be but the weird fast crank may point to other issues.... I'm hoping a starter issue and not internals on the engine I'm way out of warranty I believe. 15 with 44K on it.

It might help us to follow what you're saying/who you're responding to if you at least address them by their Username in the text of your reply; or if there's part &/or all of their reply that should be considered/is going to help make your response meaningful, then you should use the 'Reply with Quote' button down in the bottom RIGHT Hand Corner of the post you are responding to, Handyman; like I have done here in this post; I've done for you in post #3 of this thread, where it was clear who you were responding to; and 2Dogs has done in post #6! You CAN edit down the quoted post if it's a bit long and only a small part of what they've posted is important to help your post make sense, just use ..... or <snip> to show where you've removed bits, and make sure that you leave both ends of each pair of Square Brackets ( [ & ] ) AND the entire word QUOTE at each end of the quoted post completely intact (plus the / at the beginning of the end QUOTE command - And PLEASE DO NOT use those square brackets anywhere else/for anything but the approved command delimiters!! :lecturef_smilie

Or if you want to reply to a couple of/a few posts within minutes like you have here, just click on the little 'quotation mark " in a little thought bubble followed by a + symbol' that's even further to the Bottom Right Corner of EACH of the posts you should be quoting, then click on the Red '+ Reply to Thread' button that's down below the bottom LEFT corner of the Quick Reply field in each thread, and then when the screen paints up with all the posts you indicated shown as quotes, insert put your applicable text/comment BELOW the appropriate quote before submitting your response. :thumbup:

You really should try to avoid posting consecutive posts without any quotes or attribution in them as you've been doing here in this thread - it makes it VERY hard to follow what's going on, even more so if you're using 'text to talk software' cos you can't actually see the posts; &/or if you can't readily scroll up & down in the thread to try and make sense of who/which post/poster you are addressing!

Drop me a PM if you want a hand with any of this - but please, do try to help us make sense of the thread/follow the discussion so that we can better help you! :thumbup:

 

[Handyman76]

Darn peter I'm sure your trying to help but your list of instructions are a bit long there sir...... I'll try and conform.. Got out and checked out the starter all looks good it rotates the engine fine but at a fast rate. Yes there's compression coming out of the pipes but no fuel smell. And the pre-start warning does not come up anymore and soon after this issue started I noticed that too.... Weird. No text to talk here peter I don't like computers as it is!

 

[Peter Aawen]

Darn peter I'm sure your trying to help but your list of instructions are a bit long there sir...... I'll try and conform.. Got out and checked out the starter all looks good it rotates the engine fine but at a fast rate. Yes there's compression coming out of the pipes but no fuel smell. And the pre-start warning does not come up anymore and soon after this issue started I noticed that too.... Weird. No text to talk here peter I don't like computers as it is!

Orright, at its briefest:

1. Please, always tell us who &/or what you are replying to when you post something that's obviously 'a reply'; and

2. The need to be clear about who/what you are responding to (as you did in the quote above by using my name! :thumbup is NOT FOR YOU (altho who knows, it might be one day!! I've recently had a few turns at needing it! nojoke ) it's for everyone else, including those trying to help you, and ESPECIALLY for those 'readers' who would LIKE to 'read' your posts, but they can't do that the same way most might for a whole range of reasons, so they rely on other methods, like text to talk - only it's even harder for them to make sense of the thread when you aren't clear in your posts &/or don't tell us who/what you're responding to!! :gaah: :banghead:

Just Sayin' :2thumbs:

Ps: Read slow & follow the steps - those instructions were just to give you and any others doing the same thing/having the same difficulties a few options, and they are a LOT harder to explain and type than they are to follow/use!