Governors

[billybovine]

In fifth, sixth for the 1330, gear you're correct. But in lower gears the ECM does limit the revs. I've had my 2014 RT flat out stop accelerating at the the red line in 3rd & 4th gears.

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That brings up another tidbit of info. A friend of mine has a 2017 RT. He told me max speed is higher in 5th gear than in 6th gear. Engine does not have enough power to get the same speed in 6th.

Have you found the same to be true for your 2014?

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

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That brings up another tidbit of info. A friend of mine has a 2017 RT. He told me max speed is higher in 5th gear than in 6th gear. Engine does not have enough power to get the same speed in 6th.

Have you found the same to be true for your 2014?

Can't say for sure, but it very well could be. The only time I've had mine up close to, or at, red line was while passing a semi as quickly as I could using 5th, and sometimes even 4th, which the RT doesn't do very well in 6th while pulling a trailer. Others don't agree but I contend the RT is short on top end torque. Your friend's comment goes along with that.

 

[Bob Denman]

Rev-limiter or governor... tomato tomato...

1. A governor, or speed limiter, is a device used to measure and regulate the speed of a machine, such as an engine.

Basically a rev-limiter produces the same results as a governor, so what difference does it make if someone calls it a governor? Most adults understand what a governor does.

Sorry... you're wrong. nojoke
A rev-limiter is in place to keep you from damaging the engine by spinning it too hard.
That's all that it's supposed to do.
Try it in first gear: full throttle right as hard as you can. :yikes:
Assuming that it works, and doesn't allow you to put the valvetrain into orbit: how can you call that a governor?
The speed is irrelevant...


Besides: these bikes run out of power LONG before they run out of revs. They're geared for theoretical speeds WAYYYYY beyond anything floated by us in here. They just lack the power to get there.

 

[BajaRon]

. That brings up another tidbit of info. A friend of mine has a 2017 RT. He told me max speed is higher in 5th gear than in 6th gear. Engine does not have enough power to get the same speed in 6th.

You are right. You're into a more robust portion of the power curve in 5th on the 1330 than you are at the same speed in 6th gear. So it pulls harder in 5th than it does in 6th. Think of 6th gear as an 'Overdrive'. It's made for cursing, lower, less aggravating (to some) RPM, and increased fuel mileage. Not for acceleration.

In fifth, sixth for the 1330, gear you're correct. But in lower gears the ECM does limit the revs. I've had my 2014 RT flat out stop accelerating at the the red line in 3rd & 4th gears.

Of course. That is what it is for. Otherwise they would not bother with a rev-limiter at all. In 1st -4th (5th for the 1330) the rev-limiter is a very important feature. It helps keep the pistons connected to the crankshaft! :yikes:

Sorry... you're wrong. nojoke
A rev-limiter is in place to keep you from damaging the engine by spinning it too hard.
That's all that it's supposed to do.

You are correct. They are not the same thing. A governor is designed to limit the speed of the vehicle regardless of the engines capabilities. Like a Go-Cart at an amusement park. The motor isn't working very hard at all. But you just can't go any faster. You could put a 350 ci Corvette motor in one of those Go-Carts and it wouldn't get you any additional speed because it has a governor installed.

A Rev-Limiter is designed to limit the RPM of the engine to keep it from grenading (in which case you're not going to go any faster for sure!), without regard for the overall speed of the vehicle.

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

A governor is designed to limit the speed of the vehicle regardless of the engines capabilities.

That is probably the most common concept of how a governor is used, but a governor, strictly speaking, is not a speed limiter, it is a speed regulator. Think old steam engines. As the load on the engine increases or decreases the governor adjusts the input so the speed stays constant. Same thing with old gasoline engines such as the John Deere hit and miss motor. In some applications the governor was fixed in its setting, like the John Deere E engine I have, and in other cases it was adjustable like in an old Economy gas engine my brother has. Small gasoline engines in lawn mowers, pressure washers, etc., all have governors. Many are simply vanes in the cooling air flow that operate the throttle butterfly valve. The throttle handle controls the governor, not the carburetor valve.

We could properly characterize the ECM in the Spyder as a governor since the throttle sends a control signal to the ECM, and the ECM then controls the fuel flow to make the engine run at the speed we desire. The cruise control system is actually a governor.

So I will say, "Yes, the Spyder does have a governor in it!"

 

[Bob Denman]

You're over-thinking what is a very simple concept... :banghead:
The ECM isn't a governor:
1. It does far too many things, to be dismissed in such a way
2. It Never limits your speed (At least not until you're up against the rev-limiter, and this is done for completely different reasons)
3. Based upon your description of what they ECM does to "regulate" the speed to what we desire: that very same description applies to a carburetor with any form of device that controls how much fuel it feeds into the engine. :banghead:
It could be a twist-grip, and thumb-throttle, foot-pedal, a column-mounted lever... they ALL regulate speeds.
Based upon your very description: the only governor on our bikes: is us!
(Which is pretty accurate! :thumbup
Simply put:
Governors are used to set a top speed limit for a vehicle (The Spyder DOESN'T have one!)
and rev-limiters keep the engine in one piece! nojoke

 

[spyderjeffrey]

My dealer told me can am spyder on my 2015 sts are governed to 130 mph. This spyder has a 998cc engine, does anyone know if this is true. I will never get to this speed just wondering if it is true

I have had my 2013STS to 110 that was all it had.:spyder2:

 

[Bob Denman]

My dealer told me can am spyder on my 2015 sts are governed to 130 mph. This spyder has a 998cc engine, does anyone know if this is true. I will never get to this speed just wondering if it is true

Let's just say it one more time, and then give this Dead Horse a bit of a break... :bdh:


There has never been a speed-limiting governor on ANY model Spyder of ANY model year... EVER!
Are we clear on this?

 

[billybovine]

Let's just say it one more time, and then give this Dead Horse a bit of a break... :bdh:

View attachment 143020
There has never been a speed-limiting governor on ANY model Spyder of ANY model year... EVER!
Are we clear on this?

.

Well that's not true.

In the context of the original posters question. There is no governor limiting the maximum speed in normal operation. Maximum speed is limited mostly by HP and wind resistance.

There is a speed limiting governor in relation to one of the the several limp home mode states.

 

[Bob Denman]

:lecturef_smilie: Nobody was discussing the parameters that were invoked in a situation where systems were compromised...

That's a necessary feature of the bike's safety systems, and it's presence is inarguable.

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

You're over-thinking what is a very simple concept... :banghead:
The ECM isn't a governor:
1. It does far too many things, to be dismissed in such a way
2. It Never limits your speed (At least not until you're up against the rev-limiter, and this is done for completely different reasons)
3. Based upon your description of what they ECM does to "regulate" the speed to what we desire: that very same description applies to a carburetor with any form of device that controls how much fuel it feeds into the engine. :banghead:
It could be a twist-grip, and thumb-throttle, foot-pedal, a column-mounted lever... they ALL regulate speeds.
Based upon your very description: the only governor on our bikes: is us!
(Which is pretty accurate! :thumbup
Simply put:
Governors are used to set a top speed limit for a vehicle That is only one of their uses, and only when that is in their design. (The Spyder DOESN'T have one!)
and rev-limiters keep the engine in one piece! nojoke

I can't resist!!!!!!!!!!!!

From this page: https://mechanical-engg.com/blogs/e...ernors-speed-control-governor-speed-limiters/

Assume a driver running a car in hill station, at that time engine load increases, and automatically vehicle speed decreases. Now the actual speed is less than desired speed. So driver increases the fuel to achieve the desired speed. So here, the driver is a governor for this system.

And from this page: http://www.dieselserviceandsupply.com/Diesel_Engine_Generator_Governors.aspx

Diesel Engine Generator Governors

Diesel engine generator governors are sometimes referred to as the speed controller for the diesel engine. The diesel engine must maintain a pre-determined speed to maintain generator output specifications. If the engine speed is not correct the generator will not maintain the required output specifications.

This article will explore the different types of governors equipped on diesel generator sets.
Governors can be divided into two basic groups: • Mechanical/Electrical Control – Older generator sets utilize these control systems. Fuel system is controlled by mechanical governor.
• Electronic Control – Newer generator sets use an electronic control system. This system interfaces and controls engine and generator control functions to provide a constant, reliable power source.

Here's what Briggs and Stratton says on this page: https://www.briggsandstratton.com/na/en_us/support/faqs/browse/governor-system.html

The governor system is like a cruise control system. It maintains the speed of your lawn mower or outdoor power products. When Briggs & Stratton governors are adjusted properly, they keep your speed steady regardless of engine load - the amount of work the engine must perform.

 

[Bob Denman]

What's your point? :dontknow:
Other than agreeing about the driver's role as a governor: your other two quoted statements simply do not apply to the Spyder.
(Diesel generators and lawn mowers: "C'mon man...")

"

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

What's your point? :dontknow:
Other than agreeing about the driver's role as a governor: your other two quoted statements simply do not apply to the Spyder.
(Diesel generators and lawn mowers: "C'mon man...")

"

My point is a governor is not just a speed limiting device as you are wont to say, but in the more complete definition it is a speed controller. One of the functions of the ECM, particularly when it is in cruise control mode, is to control the speed of the Spyder. Hence, the ECM is in effect a governor. A governor is any device that responds to an input signal to appropriately adjust the speed of the device it is controlling.

 

[Bob Denman]

You're just playing with semantics now... :banghead:
By calling a governor a "controller"; you've opened the definition up to all sorts of non-applying crap... :dontknow:
As an example: your reference to the cruise control function... :shocked:
You're trying to compare apples to earthworms; seemingly because they're both found in an apple orchard. nojoke

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Since we each know we are the one with the correct understanding and the other one is mistaken, I guess we'll just leave this at an impasse! :thumbup:

If this exchange has entertained any other forum members in the least, then all is not lost! hyea:

 

[Bob Denman]

 

[SPECTACUALR SPIDERMAN]

best i have done is 104, don't think it could do much more.

 

[Firefly]

Only thing I know is our Governor in Michigan sucks. ;-)
Aside from that.... the term 'Governor' has been used for a long time pertaining to speed. I do differentiate a governor from a rev limiter.
Look at it like this.... a rev limiter handles the front end power output, the governor handles the tail end speed.
There is no set 'speed' where a Spyder is limited.
Wind resistance is more of a limit than anything else on a Spyder.
I've had my 2008 GS up to 128 on the odometer, my Garmin would read that about 5 mph slower. I was not at redline yet... the wind resistance was the main restriction.
My 2012 RT I hit 116 once but dropped back... was not at redline but it just didn't seem to have any more.
I 'hear' my 2015 F3 can easily hit 130 and have plenty more left to go. At least that's what I hear...;-).



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[Bob Denman]

...Look at it like this.... a rev limiter handles the front end power output, the governor handles the tail end speed.
There is no set 'speed' where a Spyder is limited.
Wind resistance is more of a limit than anything else on a Spyder.

I 'hear' my 2015 F3 can easily hit 130 and have plenty more left to go. At least that's what I hear...;-).

How about what you see: at least for this set of circumstances?

https://youtu.be/oXHBVv-pKyc

 

[Firefly]

How about what you see: at least for this set of circumstances?

https://youtu.be/oXHBVv-pKyc

Meh... he's a wuss and backed off. I know for a fact that 130 + is obtainable.... know of some saying 140.
I guess the wind resistance is the real governor.


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