2015 lineup rumors?

[billrob71]

i cant afford 6 figures for that one

[daveinva]

As a happy RS owner, I'll repeat my mantra:

1. The 1330 as presently tuned makes no sense in the RS. It's a touring engine, not a sport engine.

2. A cheaper RS makes perfect sense for BRP, but that probably leaves us RS aficionados high and dry. I'm not really interested in *downgrading* in the performance/options department.

3. A hybrid RS would be a sales disaster, IMHO. A hybrid would obviously have a cost premium, further pushing it away from the "entry level" RS, and anyone who wanted more range out of a Spyder is already in the market for an RT or an ST (eventually; I have to bet the ST is going to get the 1330 at some point, potentially re-tuned). A hybrid RS would cannibalize more profitable sales. If BRP still insists on making a hybrid, I see them putting it out on the RT or ST, not the RS (the ol' green RS "test mule" aside).

4. The above all said, if the new RS is either a leaner or fully electric... THEN I'm doing the happy dance!

[Chupaca]

Depends by what you mean when you say "more". I have zero interest in an ST w/ the 1330. That's not a sport bike engine. It's a touring engine. Perfect for the RT and maybe for some ST buyers but not for those of us that ride the RS-S because we want the lightest/fastest. I don't ride an RS-S because I can't afford an RT. I ride an RS-S because it's the lightest and fastest of the 3 models. Give me more of that and my 7 month old RS-S gets traded in no, no doubt.

I have no interest in the ST or RT's either. I have no interest in the 1330 ACE and when asked by brp told them I would much rather see a 1200/1300 Vtwin in the RS/RSS...question was what might they do for 2015 jmo

[tigerdr]

It seems like everything BRP makes is driven by some kind of rubber belt so I really doubt that shaft drive will be available anytime soon.

An entry level Spyder would be a great idea, but given the model line up I think 10-12K would be the price point.
BRP pulled the same kind of thing way back when they introduced the ski-doo elan. That was wildly successful.

They did the same thing in 2014 with the Spark as entry level for the Sea-Doo line. And, 3 weeks ago, BRP unveil an entry level for the 2015 Outlander ATV line-up.

I will not be surprise to see the same thing happen for the RS with a new ACE engine ( may be a 900???).

[Bob Denman]

They've got an ACE 600 on the shelf right now... If they took that, PLUS the CVT drivetrains that they're so good at; they could build a much lighter and cheaper RS for entry-level folks!

[tigerdr]

And they also have a 900 ACE available in the Ski-Doo line-up.

[retread]

I've been hearing about a "smaller, lighter Spyder", with a CVT and a 600 -850 engine since 2008. Seeing is believing.

john

[Dizneyman]

"They did the same thing in 2014 with the Spark as entry level for the Sea-Doo line. And, 3 weeks ago, BRP unveil an entry level for the 2015 Outlander ATV line-up.

I will not be surprise to see the same thing happen for the RS with a new ACE engine ( may be a 800???)."



They can not keep the sparks in the dealers down here in Florida they are selling so fast. I think they have found a niche with the entry level products...

[Bob Denman]

Dealers up here are selling them like beer and hot dogs at a softball game!

[ARtraveler]

I remember reading a year ago in April that the hybrid was on its way.

Wow! The second acknowledgement of the April Fool post from a year ago.

I have already commented on the hybrid in this post, but the comments were serious this time.

[sledmaster]

Look at it this way. With a brand new RT series for 2014, this is NOT going to be where we need huge new model introductions. More features and new colors are most logical here.

The ST series was just introduced last year, so it is already "new" to most of us. Maybe a triple ACE engine for the Limited model? Might be some sense there.


So that leaves the RS line. Maybe some sizzle for this segment? But then again, how many RTs does BRP sell compared to RS and STs for that matter? Face it, RTs is where the demand is and where the money is going to be made.

As for a low cost option, like an ACE 900 in a RS, we need to know how many prospective buyers are out there if the price came down? Is price an objection? Not with all of the RTs being sold.


No way would they do a "leaner", that is contrary to the whole premise of the stability of the Spyder as designed.


OK, maybe there will be a "retro" Spyder that goes back to the roots of being a REV snowmobile with wheels? That is how the Spyder started, but then transitioned to an ATV-like frame construction. Here is a good old image of the REV-Spyder. How many of these would they sell for 2015?? Just kidding.....

spyder rev1.jpg

[NetJunkie]

They sell a lot of RTs because that's how they've skewed the market. No doubt they make the most there...but their recent big push in to a younger demographic shows they see that as a big growth area.

Very different target here:

https://twitter.com/officialspyder

[Bob Denman]

Let's hope that they're right!

[Illinois Boy]

They sell a lot of RTs because that's how they've skewed the market.

Can you tell me how "they" skewed the market? Or how any company can skew the market?

Market/demographic research data, I work with, shows the demand is strongest for touring-type machines.

The 55+ crowd has the most wealth in the U.S. and their preference clearly indicates a want for touring machines and SUV's; which is why sales of these types of vehicles are top sellers across many vehicle platforms and companies.

Do you have data I am unaware of? Just wondering where your statement comes from.

[ARtraveler]

Can you tell me how "they" skewed the market? Or how any company can skew the market?

Market/demographic research data, I work with, shows the demand is strongest for touring-type machines.

The 55+ crowd has the most wealth in the U.S. and their preference clearly indicates a want for touring machines and SUV's; which is why sales of these types of vehicles are top sellers across many vehicle platforms and companies.

Do you have data I am unaware of? Just wondering where your statement comes from.

Your statement makes a lot of sense to me.

[NetJunkie]

Can you tell me how "they" skewed the market? Or how any company can skew the market?


Do you have data I am unaware of? Just wondering where your statement comes from.

If you don't have a product that a market really wants you won't sell many to that market. BRP has never targeted the younger, sport rider type market therefore they don't sell a lot in that area. They go after the RT crowd for the right reasons...and reasons you said. That's where the money is for a $30K toy like this.

My point wasn't that BRP is doing something wrong...it's the "Well, they sell a ton of RTs so that's what they focus on!" argument. They could sell a ton of RS type Spyders if they'd actually focus on that and I think they will. RS owners today are RT owners tomorrow.

[dguisinger]

If you don't have a product that a market really wants you won't sell many to that market. BRP has never targeted the younger, sport rider type market therefore they don't sell a lot in that area. They go after the RT crowd for the right reasons...and reasons you said. That's where the money is for a $30K toy like this.

My point wasn't that BRP is doing something wrong...it's the "Well, they sell a ton of RTs so that's what they focus on!" argument. They could sell a ton of RS type Spyders if they'd actually focus on that and I think they will. RS owners today are RT owners tomorrow.

Theres a lot of truth in that....On several levels. I paid nineteen five for my RSS.... what 20 year old is going to afford that?

I also sometimes wonder if I should get an RT as my next ride as my back often is sore (whether I ride or not), but I really like performance vehicles. An RT may eventually be in the cards... or maybe they could bring the comfort seat from the newer RTs down that have the installable driver backrest...

What I really want to see in the next RSS:
1) 1200 or 1300cc gas engine with turbo -OR- high performance lithium ion electric
(My understanding is no drivetrain on an electric, you wouldn't need gears, clutch or the SE5 system)
2) Articulating body
3) Eco/Touring/Sports mode button like my SeaDoo GTR215 has, these things are such gas guzzlers...
4) Optional drivers backrest and adjustable handlebars for longer rides
5) Heated options... I try to ride mine all the way to 30 degrees here in MN..... it would be nice to be able to feel my hands when I get off the spyder.
6) A better parking brake, one that doesn't kill your leg when you slip off it it in the rain
7) Better looking front end! I mean, common, it looks amazing from the sides!
8) The reversible fan on the radiator from the RTs would be very nice on hot days!
9) Better oil sensor... my oil has been low enough to effect SE5 operation at times, yet my oil light has never come on.

[ThreeWheels]

My dealer told me the '15 RT is overall bigger than the '14 with a bigger engine as well.

Interesting thoughts.
I'd find it hard to believe they would change the engine out after only one model year.
Maybe they'll drop the 1330 into other models like the RS ?
I might be tempted to upgrade to a leftover 2014.......................................

[NetJunkie]

7) Better looking front end! I mean, common, it looks amazing from the sides!

Funny you mention this. Was out riding the other night and stopped at a new Jeep dealer to look at a new Grand Cherokee (Have a 2011 now). As I walked back to the Spyder I was headed straight toward the front and thought "Man, that front-end looks dorky." but from an angle on it's GREAT. Make it more aggressive straight on.

[Illinois Boy]

If you don't have a product that a market really wants you won't sell many to that market. BRP has never targeted the younger, sport rider type market therefore they don't sell a lot in that area. They go after the RT crowd for the right reasons...and reasons you said. That's where the money is for a $30K toy like this.

My point wasn't that BRP is doing something wrong...it's the "Well, they sell a ton of RTs so that's what they focus on!" argument. They could sell a ton of RS type Spyders if they'd actually focus on that and I think they will. RS owners today are RT owners tomorrow.

I understand what you are saying now; however I can tell you BRP thought their first iterations of the Spyder would appeal to the sport-bike, jet-ski, ATC, and snow-mobile crowd (younger-crowd) -- not the +55 market.

Price likely influenced initial sales to the under-55 market (as was stated on here); which forced the gradual changes made through the years (adding saddlebags, then RT models, then the 1330 engine) to appeal to their majority buyers' demands.

However, there remains a market to be built with the under-55 crowd; and it likely deserves some attention along the lines of what Harley, Victory, and Triump have done with their new models to appeal to that crowd.

While many on here are not going to like this, but the truth is the Spyder has begun to gain a reputation as an "old-folks" machine. I am soon to be 59, so don't anyone get their feathers all ruffled-up with my comment. It is the truth whether it is painful to anyone or not. It is what it is - period.

BRP will likely continue to concentrate on their immediate buyers' needs/wants for the near-term; but be certain they are also looking to the segment of buyers that are younger than their buyers are -- thus the celebrity endorsements.

[NetJunkie]

While many on here are not going to like this, but the truth is the Spyder has begun to gain a reputation as an "old-folks" machine. I am soon to be 59, so don't anyone get their feathers all ruffled-up with my comment. It is the truth whether it is painful to anyone or not. It is what it is - period.

BRP will likely continue to concentrate on their immediate buyers' needs/wants for the near-term; but be certain they are also looking to the segment of buyers that are younger than their buyers are -- thus the celebrity endorsements.

Agree with everything you said. And if people here get ruffled at the "old-folks" machine comment their head is in the sand. I catch some very good hearted flack for riding one at 39. It doesn't bother me...I stopped caring what other people thought a long time ago...but there is absolutely that perception. I think targeting the mid-late 30s through 40s segment is a good idea. I think I'm a good example (go figure...). Late 30s. Never really ridden a street bike before. Have a family to consider. Didn't want to take 2 years to get really comfortable on one and go through that process so I got a Spyder and within a few months I was riding it VERY hard. No way would I be riding a street bike like I do this RS-S in only 6 months.

I think that market is out there.

[daveinva]

Regarding the marketing, it's a self-licking ice cream cone of an argument.

The Spyder sells to older, wealthier individuals. In time, the Spyder became *associated* with those individuals-- to the point that anyone not in that category doesn't bother looking twice at the product line.

Eventually, you have great vehicles built and sold in the image of a "retirement trike," the vehicle people buy when they finally can't hold up their bikes (or, even worse, people who are seen as "too chicken" to ride bikes-- THAT goes over well in marketing, "Our product isn't cool!" is never something you want to hear in a boardroom).

The dilemma is this: the market is skewing younger because of basic demography. The Baby Boomer wave has crested. Sure, the Spyders can sell RTs all day long to the Boomer crowd finally aging off of their Harleys, but that's not a growing market. Getting into the younger game-- just like HD is right now-- *that's* the growth market.

You're not going to make the RT cheaper, nor the ST. That leaves either making the RS cheaper, or introducing a fourth "stripper" model.

The current RS design is neat, but it's not optimal. Many RS owners are in the RT/ST demographic but bought the RS because it's cheaper (or they bought it before the RT & ST were available). BRP doesn't want that crowd buying the RS-- they want them buying the RT and ST instead. The RS as a "gateway Spyder" to the RT is a dead-end market-- that should be what the *ST* is.

Instead, making the RS either cheaper (stripper model) and/or dramatically different (leaner) is likely the way to go.

P.S. As a staunch advocate of the leaner, it's totally consistent with the BRP model-- you're still on three wheels, you're just as safe. But the leaner is *the* most obvious way of appealing to the very large and very vocal crowd of younger/traditional two-wheel buyers who see no appeal in the Spyder because of its non-leaning nature. A leaner is the easiest way of making the Spyder cool (or, well, *cooler*) to that market.

[chuck gross]

I've had a BRP rep assigned to this case since October with no results... BRP replaced the whole ignition system and some of my issues went away in the rain, but my biggest issue still remains. I sent them a pair of videos of what the spyder does a month ago since the dealer has never reproduced a single problem I've had. They told me they'd have their engineering guys look at it and myself and the dealer have never heard back.

I had a long thread on this website about my problems last year, and when i said i had it, i was going to sue, the admin on this forum shut down my thread.

They are non-public videos but with direct links you can view them if you'd like to see the odd behavior I get... once every few hundred to a thousand miles it does this. I can turn it on and off as many times as I like, but it just keeps doing it... walk away 10 minutes, come back and fire it up and it starts working normally again.

Throttle causing stuttering, no power, engine killing:


Refusal to shift:


If anyone has any ideas, I think everyone is at a complete loss....

My 2013 stl had those exact symptoms they threw some clutch parts at it and that didn't fix it so they put a new throttle body,new spark plug and wire,new charcoal cannister and now no more shuddering or stalling it has way more power and runs like a top I think it was primarily the throttle body Lifestyles worked closely with BRP to fix the issue and I was OK with leaving the spyder at the dealer long enough for them to get it right of course that was late winter / early spring time when I don;t ride as much any way it would be a rough deal this time of year

[r1100rider]

Regarding the marketing, it's a self-licking ice cream cone of an argument.

The Spyder sells to older, wealthier individuals. In time, the Spyder became *associated* with those individuals-- to the point that anyone not in that category doesn't bother looking twice at the product line.

Eventually, you have great vehicles built and sold in the image of a "retirement trike," the vehicle people buy when they finally can't hold up their bikes (or, even worse, people who are seen as "too chicken" to ride bikes-- THAT goes over well in marketing, "Our product isn't cool!" is never something you want to hear in a boardroom).

The dilemma is this: the market is skewing younger because of basic demography. The Baby Boomer wave has crested. Sure, the Spyders can sell RTs all day long to the Boomer crowd finally aging off of their Harleys, but that's not a growing market. Getting into the younger game-- just like HD is right now-- *that's* the growth market.

You're not going to make the RT cheaper, nor the ST. That leaves either making the RS cheaper, or introducing a fourth "stripper" model.

The current RS design is neat, but it's not optimal. Many RS owners are in the RT/ST demographic but bought the RS because it's cheaper (or they bought it before the RT & ST were available). BRP doesn't want that crowd buying the RS-- they want them buying the RT and ST instead. The RS as a "gateway Spyder" to the RT is a dead-end market-- that should be what the *ST* is.

Instead, making the RS either cheaper (stripper model) and/or dramatically different (leaner) is likely the way to go.

P.S. As a staunch advocate of the leaner, it's totally consistent with the BRP model-- you're still on three wheels, you're just as safe. But the leaner is *the* most obvious way of appealing to the very large and very vocal crowd of younger/traditional two-wheel buyers who see no appeal in the Spyder because of its non-leaning nature. A leaner is the easiest way of making the Spyder cool (or, well, *cooler*) to that market.

i agree a leaner would bring excitement and new younger buyers to the market plus nothing on the road would be able to keep up with it in a lot of conditions

[otter28169]

Leaning sucks, Hang ham just once on your spyder and you will be over it.

Just sayin'............