Why oil in Air filter box & hose?

[RangerRick]

So on my 2013 Spyder st-se5. I discovered this hose outlined in yellow was oily and the crimped clamps were not very tight, so I replaced with the adjustable ones. When I undid the clamps that hold the lid on this box and lifted it up in the red area there was oil in the groove that the square gasket is in. So is this normal?

 

[Warlock]

I would check and see if they have a crank case vent into the air box. This will create a oil residual
David

 

[BajaRon]

Extremely common. A very poor crankcase vent design allows oil into the airbox. It tends to settle on throttle body parts causing issues down the road. In extreme cases it soaks the air cleaner and will drip out the weep hole at the front right corner of the air box onto the front cylinder making it appear that the valve cover gasket is leaking.

Here is my solution. It is maintenance free, easy, cheap and works great!

Scroll down to post #9 in this thread. It is a bit of a tight fit (tighter on the RT than the other models). But if you trim the 7/16" fuel line right, it will fit just fine. Put one on an RT just last week. It's a One & Done install.
https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?125583-Oil-in-998cc-air-box&highlight=catch+can

 

[RangerRick]

Thanks so much everyone for this info, Will be ordering this mod for sure.

Now to figure out if there is a flash or chip mode that will cure the terrible off Idle in 1st at around 15 to 20 MPH, surges bad and stumbles a bit otherwise it runs like a R-- Ape.

 

[CopperSpyder]

With the 998 it is common for people to over fill the oil, and it will get into the air filter area when they do. Make sure and check the oil when the engine is hot and within about 1 minute or so of shutting off your engine. Due not check and fill your oil when cold that is how people over fill the 998.

 

[Snowbelt Spyder]

Thanks so much everyone for this info, Will be ordering this mod for sure.

Now to figure out if there is a flash or chip mode that will cure the terrible off Idle in 1st at around 15 to 20 MPH, surges bad and stumbles a bit otherwise it runs like a R-- Ape.

Hey Rick. Once you do that mod, the off idle may very well improve once you get the oil out of the intake. Plus, you will want to replace your MAP sensor vacuum hoses. Do a forum search on that and for the term “canisterectomy”. Another common problem on the 998. Everybody with a 998 needs to do that “canisterectomy” and replace their vacuum hoses and plug wires. Ron can fix you up with the plug wires, too. No flash or chip mod just for that.

But, there is a flash for the 998 from Monster Fuel Injection for overall improved performance. Check out their offering. Pricey though. And, don’t forget to run some fuel injector / system cleaner through it a couple times a year.

The 998 has a unique personality. Once you get it, it’s a great motor.

 

[RangerRick]

Hey Rick. Once you do that mod, the off idle may very well improve once you get the oil out of the intake. Plus, you will want to replace your MAP sensor vacuum hoses. Do a forum search on that and for the term “canisterectomy”. Another common problem on the 998. Everybody with a 998 needs to do that “canisterectomy” and replace their vacuum hoses and plug wires. Ron can fix you up with the plug wires, too. No flash or chip mod just for that.

But, there is a flash for the 998 from Monster Fuel Injection for overall improved performance. Check out their offering. Pricey though. And, don’t forget to run some fuel injector / system cleaner through it a couple times a year.

The 998 has a unique personality. Once you get it, it’s a great motor.

So I see the discussion about re-routing the tank vent to the rear, but what about eliminating the canister? There must some vacuum lines that need capped off?

 

[Snowbelt Spyder]

So I see the discussion about re-routing the tank vent to the rear, but what about eliminating the canister? There must some vacuum lines that need capped off?

Hey Rick. Absolutely correct. You're bypassing the canister when you re-route the vent. Since there is then, no more need for it, you disconnect it and remove it. One of the lines goes to the purge valve. You plug that line, leaving the purge valve installed and electrically connected. The remaining vent line hose that you didn't use can be removed and discarded.

It's not that critical to route the vent line to the rear of the machine. Some folks are more comfortable with that arrangement. That's OK. I left mine going out the bottom in it's original location and haven’t turned into a ball of fire, yet. The operational problem that this solves is that the purge valve is only connected to the rear cylinder intake for its vacuum source. It's a pretty big "intentional" vacuum leak for the single cylinder to handle. Any issues with the valve or canister at all, and you end up with the rear cylinder running lean and tripping codes. Plus, it just runs better. This system seems to work OK on the 1330, but on the 998 - not so much.

 

[BajaRon]

Hey Rick. Absolutely correct. You're bypassing the canister when you re-route the vent. Since there is then, no more need for it, you disconnect it and remove it. One of the lines goes to the purge valve. You plug that line, leaving the purge valve installed and electrically connected. The remaining vent line hose that you didn't use can be removed and discarded.

It's not that critical to route the vent line to the rear of the machine. Some folks are more comfortable with that arrangement. That's OK. I left mine going out the bottom in it's original location and haven’t turned into a ball of fire, yet. The operational problem that this solves is that the purge valve is only connected to the rear cylinder intake for its vacuum source. It's a pretty big "intentional" vacuum leak for the single cylinder to handle. Any issues with the valve or canister at all, and you end up with the rear cylinder running lean and tripping codes. Plus, it just runs better. This system seems to work OK on the 1330, but on the 998 - not so much.

Routing straight down works. But it has its drawbacks. It is not uncommon for the very shallow vent hose to get raw fuel in it. This is why the Evap Canister fails. You eliminate that issue by removing the canister as described. But routing the vent hose straight down means the fuel that used to go into the Evap Canister is just going out on the ground. I like to fill my tank all the way up until I get the last indicator on my fuel gauge. Most people tell me they don't have that last block. But it's only because they've never filled their tank all the way up. I get around 20 more miles out of that top-off. But if you do this with the vent hose going down from the tank, you'll lose more fuel. I run the line up from the tank along the upper right hand frame rail to about mid fender. This way the vent hose goes up a few inches above the top of the tank and then gently downhill. I've never had any raw fuel in that hose. I even punched a vent hole in the top of the filler neck to vent air so I can get more fuel in the tank.

Just me. I like to have as much range as I can get on long trips. It's paid off more then once.

 

[RangerRick]

Routing straight down works. But it has its drawbacks. It is not uncommon for the very shallow vent hose to get raw fuel in it. This is why the Evap Canister fails. You eliminate that issue by removing the canister as described. But routing the vent hose straight down means the fuel that used to go into the Evap Canister is just going out on the ground. I like to fill my tank all the way up until I get the last indicator on my fuel gauge. Most people tell me they don't have that last block. But it's only because they've never filled their tank all the way up. I get around 20 more miles out of that top-off. But if you do this with the vent hose going down from the tank, you'll lose more fuel. I run the line up from the tank along the upper right hand frame rail to about mid fender. This way the vent hose goes up a few inches above the top of the tank and then gently downhill. I've never had any raw fuel in that hose. I even punched a vent hole in the top of the filler neck to vent air so I can get more fuel in the tank.

Just me. I like to have as much range as I can get on long trips. It's paid off more then once.

Thanks so much for this info and yes I will route the hose the way you suggested, I need to replace the air filter also, so when I'm into the spyder this far is that do able but I think I need to access the air box from the left side also meaning more panel removal, but I need to do the oil breather mod also so I will just wait till I have everything to do all at once.

 

[MrMagicFingers]

I just did all this...

I just went through all this a few weeks ago.

Before you put it all back together you will want to be cleaning your Throttle Body. If not, as the oil that has been sucked down into the Throttle Body congeals, your throttle body will stop working well. What your wrist tells the Throttle Body to do and what the Throttle Body is capable of doing become two different things and the computer will put you into "Limp Home" mode and leave you stranded.

You will end up ripping everything apart to clean it anyway. Might as well do it now.

See my post here:

https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?149550-2010-RTS-unexplained-quitting-fixed-amp-some-Engine-mods

Tim

 

[RangerRick]

I just went through all this a few weeks ago.

Before you put it all back together you will want to be cleaning your Throttle Body. If not, as the oil that has been sucked down into the Throttle Body congeals, your throttle body will stop working well. What your wrist tells the Throttle Body to do and what the Throttle Body is capable of doing become two different things and the computer will put you into "Limp Home" mode and leave you stranded.

You will end up ripping everything apart to clean it anyway. Might as well do it now.

See my post here:

https://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/showthread.php?149550-2010-RTS-unexplained-quitting-fixed-amp-some-Engine-mods

Tim

Thanks so much for the info here and in the link to your other post's. Good to know about cleaning the throttle body.

 

[RangerRick]

Routing straight down works. But it has its drawbacks. It is not uncommon for the very shallow vent hose to get raw fuel in it. This is why the Evap Canister fails. You eliminate that issue by removing the canister as described. But routing the vent hose straight down means the fuel that used to go into the Evap Canister is just going out on the ground. I like to fill my tank all the way up until I get the last indicator on my fuel gauge. Most people tell me they don't have that last block. But it's only because they've never filled their tank all the way up. I get around 20 more miles out of that top-off. But if you do this with the vent hose going down from the tank, you'll lose more fuel. I run the line up from the tank along the upper right hand frame rail to about mid fender. This way the vent hose goes up a few inches above the top of the tank and then gently downhill. I've never had any raw fuel in that hose. I even punched a vent hole in the top of the filler neck to vent air so I can get more fuel in the tank.

Just me. I like to have as much range as I can get on long trips. It's paid off more then once.

It was an improvement but it still has a slight stumble and once it was a dead miss/hick-up. Need to have the computer flashed I think like us guys did that had the yamaha Raider. world of difference.

 

[RangerRick]

Turns out the filter I bought was a little to long, so I did the old fashion method of crankcase venting, ran the hose down and out through the plastic panel underneath. Hope this works OK

 

[RangerRick]

Took the side panels off, changed air filter which was fine, but needed to take the big cover off the air box over the Throttle bodies to clean out all the oil and clean the throttle bodies of oil residue, only has 11,000 miles on it. :shocked:

 

[BajaRon]

Get a flashlight and look down the throttle body throats. You will see the top of your intake valves. If they are heavily coated with carbon, it would be a good time to deal with that.

Ron (bajaron)

 

[BajaRon]

Turns out the filter I bought was a little to long, so I did the old fashion method of crankcase venting, ran the hose down and out through the plastic panel underneath. Hope this works OK

Like I said. It is a tight fit. But if you cut the hose right it will fit. I am not sure if doing it this way will create issues with your PCV valve or not. Of course, if you do the Canister-Ectomy, that would not be a concern.

If you do it this way, I would keep an eye on the outlet to be sure you're not losing any oil. Good luck!

 

[RangerRick]

Get a flashlight and look down the throttle body throats. You will see the top of your intake valves. If they are heavily coated with carbon, it would be a good time to deal with that.

Ron (bajaron)

ok will do when I install the ignition kit I got from your e-bay store :thumbup:

 

[RangerRick]

Like I said. It is a tight fit. But if you cut the hose right it will fit. I am not sure if doing it this way will create issues with your PCV valve or not. Of course, if you do the Canister-Ectomy, that would not be a concern.

If you do it this way, I would keep an eye on the outlet to be sure you're not losing any oil. Good luck!

I did the Canister-Ectomy, ran the line clear back the frame rail to the tail light area ;-)