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Fouling Spark Plugs

glynnk

glynnk

RT-S PE#0134
Okay, some mechanically inclined members help me out. On another thread dealing with a seperate issue, it was mentioned by several folks that you shouldn't start your Spyder up without intending to ride it; that somehow if it runs for a short period of time you foul the spark plugs. In some cases, dealers confirmed that principle. The two Spyder dealers I've dealt with have never mentioned this at all. I'm no "wrench" by any means, but is this true?

Glynnk
 
glynnk said:
Okay, some mechanically inclined members help me out. On another thread dealing with a seperate issue, it was mentioned by several folks that you shouldn't start your Spyder up without intending to ride it; that somehow if it runs for a short period of time you foul the spark plugs. In some cases, dealers confirmed that principle. The two Spyder dealers I've dealt with have never mentioned this at all. I'm no "wrench" by any means, but is this true?

Glynnk
Click to expand...

:hun:
Read that post too, don't know what there talking about?
I had bikes 35 years or more, Have 11 thousand miles on my Spyder run it for short periods quite often never fouled a plug.
 
From what I saw that was RT related only. I can tell you that I've started my Spyder hundreds of times without 'riding it' and have never fouled a plug.

It really sounds like this is unique to the RT.
 
glynnk said:
Okay, some mechanically inclined members help me out. On another thread dealing with a seperate issue, it was mentioned by several folks that you shouldn't start your Spyder up without intending to ride it; that somehow if it runs for a short period of time you foul the spark plugs. In some cases, dealers confirmed that principle. The two Spyder dealers I've dealt with have never mentioned this at all. I'm no "wrench" by any means, but is this true?

Glynnk
Click to expand...



Interesting. I recall when I test rode a Spyder for the first time at the Dealer's, they replaced the plugs on the demo because there were bad, and they mentioned that is common if the Spyder is turned on and off frequently without a ride (they mentioned it was due to not getting up to the correct running temperature for a good period of time, etc...).

They mentioned this about the GS/RS model, not the RT.


Also, would be interesting to know the parameters and durations of 'intending to ride it'..... for how long for example?


I do now know the details behind it, but would like to know more.
:popcorn:
Cheers.
 
Here's the theory behind it, with fuel injected motor on start up the ECU is adding extra fuel the same way if you were choking a carbureted motor. the system will stay in rich mode until the motor reaches a specific temperature. If it doesn't reach this temp and you shut it down then extra fuel is left in the cylinder unburnt and on the next start up you could foul a plug. I have had this happen to me with the first year polaris fuel injected four stroke sled (FST). They have done a remap to correct this, but they still tell you not to shut it off tell it's warmed up.
 
j45p3r said:
Yep, this is RT only, and I would bet it will be fixed with a software update at some point.
Click to expand...


:agree:Only RT related. I think. First hand experience (happened to me), turning it on and off several times will do that! But I was installing new lights. Previous, it was sitting at the paint shop for 3 weeks, then it got really cold here, so it never got a good run.

Let it run for 10 to 20 minutes and rev it up a bit. :2thumbs:
 
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j45p3r said:
Yep, this is RT only, and I would bet it will be fixed with a software update at some point.
Click to expand...

rnet said:
Here's the theory behind it, with fuel injected motor on start up the ECU is adding extra fuel the same way if you were choking a carbureted motor. the system will stay in rich mode until the motor reaches a specific temperature. If it doesn't reach this temp and you shut it down then extra fuel is left in the cylinder unburnt and on the next start up you could foul a plug. I have had this happen to me with the first year polaris fuel injected four stroke sled (FST). They have done a remap to correct this, but they still tell you not to shut it off tell it's warmed up.
Click to expand...
:agree: The RT seems to be more sensitive to the problem, and mine even exhibits the problem after riding and hot restarts. Never had a problem with our RS. I think it is not only related to the "cold start enrichment" mapping, but also to a relatively weak ignition system. High output coils would probably improve the situation.
 
As usual, folks on here come through with relevant info. Thanks for helping me understand the issue.

Glynnk
 
OUR SM5 fouled it's plugs the very next day it came home in 12/07

It had been getting started and stopped at the Dealer to "show people" this new type of bike alot before we got there to get it.

As usual luck would have it, the next morning after sitting in the trailer over night...nothing but crank and raw fuel smell.

I changed the plugs to a one hotter heat range, and have been fine ever since no matter what we do to it.

Our RT also fouled it's plugs in the shop with all the starts we have been doing to it without riding it. I know Bumble Bee had the same problem too with all her stopps and starts while getting it painted.

I fully believe the "RT's cold start fuel map" is very rich, and repeated starts without letting the bike warm up enough to "clean itself up" will have this happen to a bunch of us. :(

I also know the Green Filter we put into it seems to not make it not run so rich on starts and also helped the throttle responce quite a bit.

MM
 
groundeffect said:
Sorry - newbie question.


So... if you 'foul the plugs', can you start at all? or will it just run rough or bad?


thanks
Click to expand...

Mine did not start. Had to put mine in the shop and get new Spark Plugs.
Like MM said, mine came from starting and turning off while installing my lights.
 
Magic Man said:
OUR SM5 fouled it's plugs the very next day it came home in 12/07

It had been getting started and stopped at the Dealer to "show people" this new type of bike alot before we got there to get it.

As usual luck would have it, the next morning after sitting in the trailer over night...nothing but crank and raw fuel smell.

I changed the plugs to a one hotter heat range, and have been fine ever since no matter what we do to it.

Our RT also fouled it's plugs in the shop with all the starts we have been doing to it without riding it. I know Bumble Bee had the same problem too with all her stopps and starts while getting it painted.

I fully believe the "RT's cold start fuel map" is very rich, and repeated starts without letting the bike warm up enough to "clean itself up" will have this happen to a bunch of us. :(

I also know the Green Filter we put into it seems to not make it not run so rich on starts and also helped the throttle responce quite a bit.

MM
Click to expand...

So the Green Filter helped?
 
groundeffect said:
Sorry - newbie question.


So... if you 'foul the plugs', can you start at all? or will it just run rough or bad?


thanks
Click to expand...
Depends on if you foul one, or both. Mine usually fouls one, so will just crank a long time, but often picks up. Fouling just one is another reason I suspect I may also have an ignition problem. The second plug to fire will sometimes not get fouled, however, depending on where it is in the engine cycle.
 
rnet said:
Here's the theory behind it, with fuel injected motor on start up the ECU is adding extra fuel the same way if you were choking a carbureted motor. the system will stay in rich mode until the motor reaches a specific temperature. If it doesn't reach this temp and you shut it down then extra fuel is left in the cylinder unburnt and on the next start up you could foul a plug. I have had this happen to me with the first year polaris fuel injected four stroke sled (FST). They have done a remap to correct this, but they still tell you not to shut it off tell it's warmed up.
Click to expand...

You are correct sir. I asked about this when I called into BRP yesterday and it should act the same on the RS and RT as they both have an enrichment cycle to go through at startup.
 
Lamonster said:
You are correct sir. I asked about this when I called into BRP yesterday and it should act the same on the RS and RT as they both have an enrichment cycle to go through at startup.
Click to expand...

A few posts up......

"I fully believe the "RT's cold start fuel map" is very rich, and repeated starts without letting the bike warm up enough to "clean itself up" will have this happen to a bunch of us."

mm
 
Lamonster said:
You are correct sir. I asked about this when I called into BRP yesterday and it should act the same on the RS and RT as they both have an enrichment cycle to go through at startup.
Click to expand...

Thanks for helping confirm this, Lamont. I heard of this before, but I usually let my Spyder warm up to at least 1 bar before I ride. When I ride, I'm riding at minimum 15-20mins before I shutdown.

I'm guessing this will usually not foul the spark plugs...???


Lamont, any idea on how long it takes for our Spyders to complete the enriched state on startup, in minutes?

Cheers.
 
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