billybovine, battery question...

[wyliec]

I have an odyssey PC680 along with the battery maintainer that goes with it from odyssey. I always connect the maintainer thru a powerlet outlet (unswitched circuit) on the dash of my 2008GS. A couple weeks ago I disconnected the maintainer from the wall outlet, but left the maintainer plugged into the powerlet outlet. Today when I connected the maintainer to the wall outlet the lights go to the second orange (out of a total of 5 orange and 1 green), and then goes to OFF, as indicated by a light. First I thought I must have drained the battery because I left the maintainer plugged in to the powerlet outlet; but, there is nothing else in the circuit. I also noticed when I first plugged the maintainer in to the wall outlet today, the lights went crazy, each one blinking in succession until I pulled the plug, and plugged back in. I also tried to start the spyder after all this, and it was a no go. Any ideas?

I can tell you the battery would be going on its 3rd year next season. Also, normally after plugging in, it only takes about 2 minutes to go from the 1st orange light to the green light, like it did a few weeks back.


Thanks

 

[canamjhb]

I don't know anything about your particular charger. Having said that, I suspect your battery is toast. If you plug a charger/maintainer in and attach it to a completely dead battery, it doesn't know that it is attached. There needs to be something there to tell the charger that is needs to go to work. So try plugging it in while jumping your battery to a known good source to see if it doesn't behave. If it does, your battery needs to be replaced. These small batteries can go TU in an instant. Good luck

 

[jaherbst]

Just a short reminder. A maintainer/tender will not charge a fully depleted battery. You will need at least a 5+ amp charger.

Jack

 

[Easy Rider]

Two things:
It is possible that the isolation diode (or similar circuitry) in your charger is bad, allowing it to discharge the battery if it is not plugged into the wall.

AND....if you ride the machine at least once a week for a fair distance, it is NOT necessary (or desirable even) to plug in the charger every time you turn the engine off.

Note: if you have added something like an alarm that is powered all the time, all bets are off.

 

[wyliec]

Just a short reminder. A maintainer/tender will not charge a fully depleted battery. You will need at least a 5+ amp charger.

Jack

I removed the schumacher maintainer, and put the odyssey ultimizer 6 amp back on, and now it seems to be working again. I went from 1 orange to all orange (4 or 5 lights), and then the green light. It'll switch itself off when done. Tomorrow I'll try to start the spyder again. If it doesn't start, I'll pull the battery, and let the dealer check it out. I think forgetting to disconnect the charger (pull the plug from the dash mounted powerlet outlet) after unplugging from the wall outlet (2 or 3 weeks ago) created the problem.

 

[wyliec]

Two things:
It is possible that the isolation diode (or similar circuitry) in your charger is bad, allowing it to discharge the battery if it is not plugged into the wall.

AND....if you ride the machine at least once a week for a fair distance, it is NOT necessary (or desirable even) to plug in the charger every time you turn the engine off.

Note: if you have added something like an alarm that is powered all the time, all bets are off.

I'm hoping now that the ultimizer is working again, like I said above, the problem is solved. This time I won't forget to disconnect both plugs.

 

[Easy Rider]

like I said above, the problem is solved. .

Regardless of what initially caused it, if the battery went completely flat the problem may NOT be completely solved.

 

[wyliec]

Regardless of what initially caused it, if the battery went completely flat the problem may NOT be completely solved.

You are correct. Although the Odyssey Ultimizer 12 volt 6 amp indicates the battery is charged (by the lights that are lit) the battery is dead. I tried starting the spyder, and just clicks. I know someone will say check the battery terminal connections; they are fine. I'll pull the battery, and take to the dealer to see if they can charge it. Then the question is, why does the Ultimizer show the battery as charged?

The Ultimizer is for the Odyssey battery.

 

[Chupaca]

Here's the thing....

In my time we ran across this quite often. We called it a surface charge. Somehow the charger registers full charge but you hit the starter once and pooof..:yikes: it's all gone. Not sure but suspect surface debris from the deterioration of the plates picks up the charge and transfers it across the surface of the battery and the plate pickup non of the charge going in. Not familiar with your brand but still happens to pre-filled, gel-filled in the newer batteries out there. :thumbup:

 

[Easy Rider]

The Ultimizer is for the Odyssey battery.

That is just marketing hype. There is nothing that "matches" a charger to a specific battery.

And it is typical for a failing battery to "take" what looks like a full charge but then not be able to give it back.
The voltage takes a big drop when any significant load is attached.

 

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

MATCHING

That is just marketing hype. There is nothing that "matches" a charger to a specific battery.

And it is typical for a failing battery to "take" what looks like a full charge but then not be able to give it back.
The voltage takes a big drop when any significant load is attached.

I believe you are wrong on this ....... Lithium Ion batteries usually have a special charger / maintainer ..................annnnnnnnnnnd ...Merry Christmas .... Mike :thumbup:

 

[wyliec]

That is just marketing hype. There is nothing that "matches" a charger to a specific battery.

And it is typical for a failing battery to "take" what looks like a full charge but then not be able to give it back.
The voltage takes a big drop when any significant load is attached.

Actually, it's not hype. I'd find the thread (but you wouldn't believe me) from a few years back when I got in touch with them (Odyssey) and a competitor (Deltran- technical support), and the reason why I couldn't use the battery tender, and Deltran agreed. In any case, maybe you can answer this: The battery was fine when I put the spyder up for the winter; like I said in a previous post, it was 2 years old. I have a digital voltage gage that showed 14.17-14.21 volts while at highway speeds. The charger was plugged into an unswtiched circuit on the spyder for about 3 weeks (by mistake); but, the charger was disconnected at the wall outlet. I'm wondering if that put a drain on the battery?

 

[billybovine]

Sorry I did not see your thread Until now.

Can a battery maintainer/charger discharge a battery when not plugged into a wall outlet. The answer is maybe. Depends on how the charger was designed.

Buy your description the battery appears to be surfaced charged. Surface charging happens when a battery is charged too fast from a near fully discharged condition. Often this can be seen by a high at rest battery voltage. The fix is to discharge it again. Then connect it to a low amp rate charger like a battery maintainer with a 1.5 amp or even better lower charge rate. Then let it charge for 2 or 3 days. Note if the battery after discharge is less than 10 or 11V. Depending on the charger. The charger may not work. May need to put booster cables or pack on the battery for 20 or 30 seconds to get the charger working.

Also could be the battery is damaged. But it was not sitting dead for very long and it is not that old. So not likely but possible.

 

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

I believe you are wrong on this ....... Lithium Ion batteries usually have a special charger / maintainer ..................annnnnnnnnnnd ...Merry Christmas .... Mike :thumbup:

I might not have it all correct, but I understand Lion batteries have a processor board in them that communicates with the charger to control the charging. Lion batteries also have a finite number of full recharges programmed in and when you reach that limit, ouch! The battery may still be functioning quite well but it will refuse to be charged again. Lion batteries are matched to chargers. Note all your power tools.

 

[billybovine]

Just a short reminder. A maintainer/tender will not charge a fully depleted battery. You will need at least a 5+ amp charger.

Jack

A battery maintainer/tender will charge a fully depleted battery as long as the initial battery voltage is higher than 10V. Using a battery charger rated at 5 amps or better on a battery that nearly fully discharged is a terrible idea. The OE battery has a charge rate rating of 2.1 amps. Charging at a higher rate will risk causing heat damage or a surface charge condition. I do assume the charge rate rating for the Odyssey battery is similar.

 

[billybovine]

I believe you are wrong on this ....... Lithium Ion batteries usually have a special charger / maintainer ..................annnnnnnnnnnd ...Merry Christmas .... Mike :thumbup:

Since the Odyssey PC680 battery is a AGM battery and is similar to the OE battery, not a lithium. I don't understand your point.

 

[Easy Rider]

I believe you are wrong on this ....... Lithium Ion batteries usually have a special charger / maintainer

Right. My statement was worded poorly. Thank you.

For most common types of batteries, any common charger will work with it.
No need to get one that "matches".

 

[Easy Rider]

I'm wondering if that put a drain on the battery?

OK so maybe you don't have a "common" type of battery.
What kind of design IS it ??

And as a couple of us have already said: Yes it could have discharged it......IF the charger is defective.

 

[Easy Rider]

(but you wouldn't believe me)

If you really believe that, then why even mention it ??? Except to inflame the issue ???

 

[wyliec]

OK so maybe you don't have a "common" type of battery.
What kind of design IS it ??

And as a couple of us have already said: Yes it could have discharged it......IF the charger is defective.

I guess if the dealer can charge the battery, then I'll know it's the charger. I'm pulling the battery now.