2013 RT LTD - analog fuel gauge - accuracy - NOT !

[finless]

The orange/red wire should be power for the light.

No not correct. There is another wire for the light. I forget it's color now and my video does not show it well.

Time to take it apart again and have another go.

Bob

[finless]

Well Scotty asked if I had ever connected the analog gauge to the sender prior to entering the cluster.

I now suspect you might be able to get both gauges that way.
What I don't know is how much that would
1)compromise the accuracy and
2) would you, by essentially trying to drive two loads instead of one, fry something the cluster.

What happens in the cluster, as they say, stays in the cluster.

For me, although quite adventuresome I wouldn't try it on mine.

I will try it myself. As for load causing inaccuracy, that can be adjusted by a pull up resistor or possibly a blocking diode.

When I return from my trip to Connecticut, I plan to dig into this again. Thanks for the info and findings!

Something that might help is reading the resistance between I, S, and ground on each gage.

Bob

[NancysToy]

No not correct. There is another wire for the light. I forget it's color now and my video does not show it well.

Time to take it apart again and have another go.

Bob

OK, I took a second look at the wiring diagram and it shows OR/RD for both the light and the gauge power. The light shows a 20 ga wire and the gauge power (I terminal on the gauge or P terminal on the diagram) shows an 18 ga wire...same color. They tie to a common junction ahead of the cluster.

The sticky part of making both the digital and analog gauges functional is that the fuel gauge is fed its signal from the sender, in parallel with the cluster, but the temperature gauge is fed its signal from the cluster, by way of the ECM. That explains why the temperature gauge acted differently in your tests. I don't think we could ever get both the digital and analog gauges functional and accurate at the same time, in any combination. It does appear that the gas gauge could be replaced with a different one, however. The trick would be to find a matching temperature gauge that worked. Roger found an interesting AutoMeter programmable fuel gauge.

[Ronbo]

2013 RT LTD with 3000 miles. My fuel gauge does not show good correlation with the exact amount of gallons that the spyder will take. Yeah, it's not exact, but provides a good enough picture of the fuel situation to keep from running out. It really doesn't take away from the fun of riding. Good luck!

ronbo

[NancysToy]

The fuel gauge I found I'm afraid isn't the silver bullet I had hoped.
It is programmable but a look at the instructions indicates it can only be programmed for two set points EMPTY and FULL.
It appears it then just linearizes between those two points just like the stock gauge.


http://www.autometer.com/productPDF/0994A.pdf

The time is right for you to invent one that is fully progammable. Don't forget the value engineering so we can afford it, though.

[finless]

Scotty, can you look at the diagram and see where the temp sensor is mounted on the engine? Does it show what kind of sensor it is e.g. external like a thermistor, etc? Or maybe internal like it is reading oil temp?
Then does it show where this sensor comes into the cluster (what pin, wire color, etc)?
If we can pick that off before it goes into the cluster, we might be able to have both digital and analog temp gages.
This is what I want to keep is the analog temp gage. I am not casing the fuel gage myself as I want to replace that with volt/amp gage.

Thanks,
Bob

[NancysToy]

Scotty, can you look at the diagram and see where the temp sensor is mounted on the engine? Does it show what kind of sensor it is e.g. external like a thermistor, etc? Or maybe internal like it is reading oil temp?
Then does it show where this sensor comes into the cluster (what pin, wire color, etc)?
If we can pick that off before it goes into the cluster, we might be able to have both digital and analog temp gages.
This is what I want to keep is the analog temp gage. I am not casing the fuel gage myself as I want to replace that with volt/amp gage.

Thanks,
Bob

I believe you will find the coolant temperature sensor on the left side of the rear cylinder head. There is a connector near the sensor. The sensor is wired to the ECM at terminals ECMA-A1 and ECMA-J2. The sensing wire to the gauge is fed from the cluster at terminal CL-2. I would caution you against paralleling anything on the sensor side of the circuit. The coolant temperature enters is included in the EFI logic, and altering the resistance could adversely affect the engine operation. JMHO. I'd look for an unused port on the other cylinder head, install an addition sensor, and run that directly to the gauge or an aftermarket gauge).

[finless]

Thanks for the info!
I understand your caution but you should be able to tell if piggy backing off the signal effects the input. If so then the alternative is what I might do.
Do you suppose the sensor is "off the shelf" or proprietary to BRP?

Bob

[NancysToy]

Thanks for the info!
I understand your caution but you should be able to tell if piggy backing off the signal effects the input. If so then the alternative is what I might do.
Do you suppose the sensor is "off the shelf" or proprietary to BRP?

Bob

I am pretty sure it is made to their spec, but it may well be a suitable standard part. The resistance values are given in the shop manual.

[finless]

The resistance values are given in the shop manual.

This may help find a suitable off the shelf sender. Can you post the values?

Bob

[finless]

Hey Bob
You can download a complete shop manual instantly from an Ebay seller. The price is about 15 bucks.

It's on my list of things to get/buy.

Bob

[shroth]

Thanks again to all my fellow Spyderlovers!! By sharing your past experiences and knowledge, I took my instrument cluster apart today and disconnected my gauges. I Like the digital ones soooooo much better.

now I'll have to put in the old spaces. Haven't taken the gauges out yet. I'll wait for your suggestions.

[2 Stricklands]

Thanks again to all my fellow Spyderlovers!! By sharing your past experiences and knowledge, I took my instrument cluster apart today and disconnected my gauges. I Like the digital ones soooooo much better.

now I'll have to put in the old spaces. Haven't taken the gauges out yet. I'll wait for your suggestions.

The Volt Meter is easy, almost a direct replacement to the Gas Gauge. The Oil Pressure is a little harder, but Roger has a DIY drawing on another tread that I followed and it works great.

[M&Ms_Spyder]

Hi all.. I'm the one who started this thread. And just read-up on all the posts about figuring out the electronics of how the analog temp. and fuel gauges work, how to possibly wire around them, etc. AND.... I just wanted to share with you all about what I am now experiencing on our new 2013 RT Limited... in regards to the accuracy of its Analog fuel gauge - which was completely fubar off the dealers lot. I $...t you not - the d..n thing has started working - seems to be fairly accurate now. It's like it has gone thru some "self-calibration" process or something. Every time we put gas in "Cammie" (as my wife has dubbed our Spyder)... the analog fuel gauge seems to work more accurately. Last fill... drove it about 15 miles after low-fuel warning light came on - it held 5.1 gallons. So... what do you all say to this? Anybody else experience this phenomena?

[SPYDERFUZZ]

I talked to my dealer and he told me the same thing "they all are like that". You will see several thread about this same subject. I bought a 1 gallon motorcycle gas can, it was here when I returned from the dealer I am going to run it dry and see where the needle goes. Lot of people have disconnected their analog gauge. I'm wondering could you put in a amp meter to make sure the battery is charging. Does anyone know about that?

[rayeade]

My fuel gauge on my RT Ltd is very accurate.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

[mindman]

A few things:

1- The analog guage seems to be working correctly (for an analog guage)

2- The digital guages are waaaaaay more accurate, when you are down to your last bar you probably can go another 10 miles or so

3-Remember that when you unplug the analog fuel guage you must also unplug the analog temp. guage or the digital guages will not work.

4- Unplug them and enjoy your Spyder.

Cruzr joe

+1 Unplugged mine quite a while ago. The analog gauges are a "feature" BRP would be well advised to forget about.