Sena 20S problems

[Bob S]

I have two Sena 20S's on two helmets being used with the Sena sm10 dongle on a 2015 Spyder RT Ltd. and also have it paired with the Zumo Nav.

1. When I have it set with audio multitasking, I cannot get any intercom to work between me and my passenger. The music
stays on at the same sound level. The intercom only works when I have the audio multitasking disengaged on both units.

2. Every 5-10 minutes, I hear a "Swoosh" and I loose the signal to the music from the Spyder audio system. It then comes back on
after about 5 seconds.

3. I often loose the media music signal from the Spyder when I try to make a phone call from the Sena 20S to an Iphone 6 and it does not come back on. I try double tapping and saying, "Connect Devices", however, it does not reconnect the Media. I have to turn off on of the Sena 20S's and turn it back on to get back to hearing the music from the Spyder Audio system.

I am now on the third set of Sena 20S's and a new sm10.

I have paired everything according the written instructions from Sena.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Bob S

[WA5VHU]

Always go online to the Sena website and update the firmware in all the Sena products. Just because your units are new does not mean they have the latest firmware. When updating is complete, do a full reset on the units.

Can't help you much with your specific problems, our 20s units have always worked good, at least once we updated their firmware.

Charles

[trikerbiker645]

No surprise to me,
Our group bought 6 20s units and they have been nothing but trouble with a variety of things from day one. We had Collet Communicator's for years which were trouble free but we wanted to get away from being wired to their battery pack.Pretty much hands free units, worked great. Anyway, some of our issues with the 20s units you mentioned plus we have a number of other issues, range, popcorn noise, static to name just a few of the big ones especially when you try to do a group intercom. The noise pretty much makes them useless as a group thing so we revert back to the piggyback method which defeats the purpose we bought them for. Talked with Sena CS number of times, did everything they said. Won't authorize sending them back yet. One Cs said they are working on a revision number 1.7 that will cure the problems.huh......other Cs said they don't have problems? They usually just say, gee we don't have a problem with that but go on their forum and there's numerous complaints on the same troubles we are having. Or usually they say to do a factory reset or a fault reset which doesn't help. All our units are updated as the updates come out, we use the Sena app. and all phones/headsets are set the same. Antenna's are always up. We do set the 8-way to on when we have more than 2 or 4 units. If use 2 units everything works pretty good but start adding the other 4 and things go downhill fast. At the Soar / Robs Performance Rendevous event a couple weeks ago they had a rep there that says we probably have a bad unit or 2 or all of them and says we should send them in. He did give us his card in case we have trouble doing that. I guess that will be the plan once riding season ends since nothing else they suggested or we have tried has helped. Good luck with yours! safe riding......

[BitSlayer]

We also have Sena 20S and the SM10 on a 2015 RT. We have had similar, but different, issues with that combination. If I do not pair the intercom with my wife's headset, then all is well and I can get the bike's audio and navigation. If I add my wife's intercom to the mix, sooner or later, the bikes audio will drop off an I cannot get it to repair until I shutdown my headset and restart it. I am in the process of trying to troubleshoot to determine a common factor. Nothing yet, but about to call Sena to see what they can do. All Sena products, there should be ABSOLUTE NO ISSUE WITH COMMUNICATIONS!!!!!!

[srumlin]

Let me try and help you with your issue, I understand how frustrating these electronic devices can be.

The SM10 is an outdated piece of hardward that Sena is passing off as new. Go to this link and see the latest firmware update: http://www.sena.com/firmware/ (hint: last one was October 2012)

I asked Sena about this issue via email conversation and they were not forthcoming. The EDR for this device is 2.1, your EDR for the Sena Dual 20S is 4.1, you are going to have issues pairing with an outdated firmware... After speaking with other riders, I returned my SM10 to the dealer and I purchased the SR10 (firmware March 2013).

I have a 2015 Spyder RTSPE, I have the Zumo 590 GPS, and I am using my Valentine radar detector which is wired directly to the SR10 (via Valentine's motorcycle device), and is paired to my 20S. I have my iPhone paired to my 20s. I decided not to pair my GPS because I wanted to hear the Valentine alerts through my 20S speakers (in headset). You have several options such as pairing your 20S directly to the GPS, you just have to play around with it to see what works best for you.

This is what I would do, return the SM10 (if you can), purchase the SR10 through Amazon. There is one thing you need to know about the SR10, you will have to charge it before each use, I plug mines in every night. There is no ground isolation loop built into the device, and when you try and use the USB micro cord that you may be using with the SM10, it will blow the fuse to any other device that is plug into the SR10. I blew several of my Valentine fuses before I figured it out.

Side note: before you start pairing your devices, ensure they all have the latest firmware to include the computer software.

Let me upload some pictures of my current setup. If you have further questions please ask, Steve.

[finless]

The SR10 and the SM10 are two totally different devices.

The SM10 is a media streaming device. On the Spyder this is for playing music from the Spyders audio system into your helmet.
One feature of the SM10 is it can pair to two helmets. Thus you and your passenger can hear the same music. All the audio out of the SM10 is stereo!

The SR10 is a TWO-WAY communication device. It is used for hooking two-way radios like CB's,. etc. It allows you to listen AND talk back to things like a CB. It also has a AUX input for other audio input like music if you like. BUT!
1) It is mono only not stereo
2) It will only pair to ONE headset (helmet)

So not sure why you swapped out the SM10 to the SR10 but unless your using it for two-way communications, you reduced your capabilities! Bye the way you can in fact have both the SR10 and the SM10 as they pair differently.

FYI the SM10 while a few years old and BT 2.1 is still fully functional. The SR10 is about as old as well and also is BT 2.1! Sena has never replaced them with new products yet probably due to the low demand.

Bob

[finless]

I have two Sena 20S's on two helmets being used with the Sena sm10 dongle on a 2015 Spyder RT Ltd. and also have it paired with the Zumo Nav.

1. When I have it set with audio multitasking, I cannot get any intercom to work between me and my passenger. The music
stays on at the same sound level. The intercom only works when I have the audio multitasking disengaged on both units.

2. Every 5-10 minutes, I hear a "Swoosh" and I loose the signal to the music from the Spyder audio system. It then comes back on
after about 5 seconds.

3. I often loose the media music signal from the Spyder when I try to make a phone call from the Sena 20S to an Iphone 6 and it does not come back on. I try double tapping and saying, "Connect Devices", however, it does not reconnect the Media. I have to turn off on of the Sena 20S's and turn it back on to get back to hearing the music from the Spyder Audio system.

I am now on the third set of Sena 20S's and a new sm10.

I have paired everything according the written instructions from Sena.

Any suggestions?

Thanks,

Bob S

Bob S. Where is your SM10 (I assume you have that) located on the Spyder? Or are you just listening to music from the GPS?

Bob

[Bob S]

Let me try and help you with your issue, I understand how frustrating these electronic devices can be.

The SM10 is an outdated piece of hardward that Sena is passing off as new. Go to this link and see the latest firmware update: http://www.sena.com/firmware/ (hint: last one was October 2012)

I asked Sena about this issue via email conversation and they were not forthcoming. The EDR for this device is 2.1, your EDR for the Sena Dual 20S is 4.1, you are going to have issues pairing with an outdated firmware... After speaking with other riders, I returned my SM10 to the dealer and I purchased the SR10 (firmware March 2013).

I have a 2015 Spyder RTSPE, I have the Zumo 590 GPS, and I am using my Valentine radar detector which is wired directly to the SR10 (via Valentine's motorcycle device), and is paired to my 20S. I have my iPhone paired to my 20s. I decided not to pair my GPS because I wanted to hear the Valentine alerts through my 20S speakers (in headset). You have several options such as pairing your 20S directly to the GPS, you just have to play around with it to see what works best for you.

This is what I would do, return the SM10 (if you can), purchase the SR10 through Amazon. There is one thing you need to know about the SR10, you will have to charge it before each use, I plug mines in every night. There is no ground isolation loop built into the device, and when you try and use the USB micro cord that you may be using with the SM10, it will blow the fuse to any other device that is plug into the SR10. I blew several of my Valentine fuses before I figured it out.

Side note: before you start pairing your devices, ensure they all have the latest firmware to include the computer software.

Let me upload some pictures of my current setup. If you have further questions please ask, Steve.

Thank you very much for your effort here.
Are you telling me that you cannot put the SR10 in trunk and use the same Spyder connectors to its sound system and the low voltage power input?

Bob S

[redrt]

20 and 10, Ok we had the seina 10's I went to the 20 because I play music to my head set. wife has speakers, long and short of it what you pair up 1st gets the best signal. So that being said pair up head sets 1st then music and phone or gps last then you can talk the best. As we ride our own bikes and not two up on one this is what we do. Best of luck do what works for you, Jim

[_..stiffler..]

Just asking...

If you both have 20s's. Why do you need the sm10 to hear music from your spyder.

Why not just Bluetooth music from your phone to your 20s's and then have your intercom on and music sharing on.

Turn the radio off on your spyder. If you want radio the 20s's have radio as well.

And use your phone gps (way better than garmin) and you can hear directions etc through the headset.

My wife and I have 20s and this works perfectly. Never had an issue.

Stiff

Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

[finless]

Thank you very much for your effort here.
Are you telling me that you cannot put the SR10 in trunk and use the same Spyder connectors to its sound system and the low voltage power input?

Bob S

I must ask what connector your talking about?

The one in the trunk is INPUT only to the radio. It does not output audio from that connector. So no you cannot hook a SM10 or a SR10 to that connector. This is why the special dongle cable that hooks to the radio's RD-01 connector on the radio under the right passenger armrest.

Bob

[finless]

Just asking...

If you both have 20s's. Why do you need the sm10 to hear music from your spyder.

Why not just Bluetooth music from your phone to your 20s's and then have your intercom on and music sharing on.

Turn the radio off on your spyder. If you want radio the 20s's have radio as well.

And use your phone gps (way better than garmin) and you can hear directions etc through the headset.

My wife and I have 20s and this works perfectly. Never had an issue.

Stiff

Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

Well yes you can do this but let me tell you the limitations. If these limitations do not bother you then your good.

Your phone can only pair to one helmet Thus your passenger cannot hear what you hear.
Now depending on the headset model, some of them have media sharing and then you can share what you hear in your helmet, from your phone, to your passenger.

In some states you must be "hand free" with your phone. If your caught using it, ticket. Let alone how unsafe it is to be using your phone's touch screen while riding. Using the Spyder radio and your phone (or iPod, etc) connected to the iPod connector in the trunk, you can control all of your music choices from the handlebar buttons (legally).

The SM10 can pair to 2 helmets with no limitations. Even different model helmet comm systems. Thus both people hear what the Spyder is playing.

Hope that helps answer the questions.

Bob

[_..stiffler..]

Yes the sm10 is good for some devices for sure.

But talking about the 20s's it's not needed.

My phone pairs to my headset my wife and I can still talk while music sharing from my phone. She can hear the music and the gps from my phone even tho my phone is not paired with her headset.

The 20s's can do voice activation for pretty much everything so no need to touch your phone. Most states and provinces up here in Canada are hands free or heavy tickets (here anyway)

Now I do understand if you have an iPod or mp3 player or if you do not have 20s's. Or if you want to use the spyder stereo then yes it's needed. But there is almost no need for the spyder stereo unless your batteries die on your headsets.

But the OP is talking about the 20S devices and having issues.

Stiff

Sorry finless I'm not arguing with you. Hope you don't take this the wrong way.

Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

[finless]

Yes the sm10 is good for some devices for sure.

But talking about the 20s's it's not needed.

My phone pairs to my headset my wife and I can still talk while music sharing from my phone. She can hear the music and the gps from my phone even tho my phone is not paired with her headset.

The 20s's can do voice activation for pretty much everything so no need to touch your phone. Most states and provinces up here in Canada are hands free or heavy tickets (here anyway)

Now I do understand if you have an iPod or mp3 player or if you do not have 20s's. Or if you want to use the spyder stereo then yes it's needed. But there is almost no need for the spyder stereo unless your batteries die on your headsets.

But the OP is talking about the 20S devices and having issues.

Stiff

Sorry finless I'm not arguing with you. Hope you don't take this the wrong way.

Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

Yes we did spin off on another topic due to questions from others.

But he did say this:

2. Every 5-10 minutes, I hear a "Swoosh" and I loose the signal to the music from the Spyder audio system. It then comes back on
after about 5 seconds.

So this made some of us assume he has a SM10....

So now I will try to help him.

When you pair a smart phone to the SMH10 or the 20S that standard pair is HFP+A2DP.
HFP = Hands Free Profile - This is for phone calls only.
A2DP = Media - This is for media like music ONLY e.g. like music from your phone or a SM10, etc.

Now the 20S headset can have ONLY ONE active A2DP connection. Would not make sense to have more than one music device coming into your headset.
The 20S allows TWO HFP profiles. So this can be our phone for calls, a GPS, etc.

Now pretty sure this is his issue IF he has a SM10 which I assume he does based on his questions.
If he does a standard pair to his phone, he had both the HFP and the A2DP pairing.
When he then pairs his SM10 this is a A2DP pairing.

Are you seeing what might happen now since it only allows one A2DP active connection?

If when you turn on your headset and it connect to your phone, you will hear "phone connected". All good so far right? Now when he turns on the SM10, it usually will take over the A2DP connection from the phone BUT NOT ALWAYS! They are arguing with each other! Mine will usually take over the A2DP connection and in the headset I hear "Media connected". But again not always.
NOW... if for any reason the signal from the SM10 drops, the phone will take over that A2DP connection and the SM10 won't "always" be able to take it back unless you power cycle the SM10.

Another thing and lets reverse that. If you have you phone off or BT disabled on the phone, and you power up the headset and then power up the SM10, you will hear "media connected". If you then turn on your phone, the phone will then connect and TAKE OVER the A2DP connection from the SM10. In general, the last A2DP device you power up will be the connected one. But not always since they are arguing with each other.

So people having issues like this with multiple A2DP devices paired to the headsets can have drop outs, disconnects, etc.

So how to fix it?
You pair devices with the "selective profile" described on page 19 of the 20S manual.
When you pair your smart phone you pair it using HFP only. This will keep the phone from trying to connect A2DP and play music. But it will allow you to make and take phone calls.
Now pair the SM10 which will pair A2DP.
The arguments and take overs will stop then.

Oh and of note.... If you do a standard pair with Zumo GPS' it is also a HFP+A2DP! So now you could have 3 A2DP pairings all arguing with each other.

Hope this helps,
Bob

[_..stiffler..]

Ok so to Bob S the OP.

What it seems to me is you have 2x 20S's headsets. And you want to talk to eachother through intercom and listen to the same music. Also you have an iPhone 6 that I'm assuming you listen to your music from. Correct me if I'm wrong.

You also have a zumo gps that you want to hear directions from.

So here's what I'm saying.

Ditch the spyder stereo (don't use) and ditch the sm10 dongle.

Turn on intercoms between the two coms. The press play on your music from iPhone 6. Then you should hear music in your headset (if phone is paired with headset) hold jog dial till you hear 3 continuous beeps and it will say music sharing on and you and your wife can listen to music and talk at the same time.

As for zumo just keep it on spyder Speakers. Or use phone gps (maps app) etc to listen through headset. Or add zumo gps to 20S as per manual.

Stiff


Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

[finless]

Ok so to Bob S the OP.


Ditch the spyder stereo (don't use) and ditch the sm10 dongle.

Totally disagree! From a simplistic point of view the SM10 gives you the full media capability and each person can have their phone for calls.

Doing and using all this sharing stuff is fine but can be complicated for many. There are limitations too. If the driver takes a call, the music to the passenger is cut off. Other limitations like that.

I could go on and on with this but for me and many that I show them how to setup and working, they are super happy with the SM10 as it removes all the A2DP issues when you have multiple devices IF you pair things correctly!

Bob

[_..stiffler..]

I guess just depends on what you're doing and using the communication devices for. I agree different ways are better for different people.

I know I'm never on my phone longer than a min when riding.

And my wife has her phone paired to her 20s and she can take her own calls.

Plus if she wants to listen to her music she can.

Bob S what's the best way for you.

Sent on Note 5 in Taptalk

[finless]

Agree... everyone has their own way or desire of doing things.

I guess to help him he really needs to give us more detail of his setup.

Bob

[Rukpub]

Good day all. It just so happened that my riding partner and I had a similar discussion we both use Sena's. I the 10C and He owns 3 of the 20S models. In the video, Khaos talks about this other model that may be Better than Sena I have never heard of it until now. Is there anyone out there that uses this? and what are your opinions as far as it being a better universal bluetooth device?