Oil research - read only if interested😀

[Habib]

I've Cant beleive the only oil for a Spyder is some special blend only available from selected outlets. I started searching and started with my owners manual and the API website (www.api.org). The oil recommended by BRP for my 2010 is API service SL, SJ, SH and SG and do not use API SM or ILSAC G4. The API website says:

SL is for 2004 and older automobiles
SJ is for 2001 and older automobiles
SH is now obsolete
SG is now obsolete

The main problem is with/or without friction modifiers that can raise heck with the wet clutch system in a Spyder. I started searching motorcycle oils and found the mellowing and others:

Mobil 1 motorcycle oil $9 a quart at WalMart

"Mobil 1 Motorcycle Oils are full synthetic, high-performance engine oils formulated specifically to meet the demanding needs of motorcycle engines. Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40 is designed primarily for on-road, high-performance, 4-cycle sport bikes, however, it may be used in other types of on and off-road 4-cycle motorcycles especially where a 10W-40 viscosity grade is specified. Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 is formulated to help offer outstanding protection in 4-cycle, V-Twin type engines, particularly those which are air cooled and tend to run hotter than other types of engines.
Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40 and Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 are recommended for 4-cycle, motorcycles which specify the use of a 10W-40 or a 20W-50 engine oil, respectively. These products will help provide excellent performance in motorcycle engines that are designed with a common engine/transmission lubrication system or where the engine lubrication system is separate from the transmission system. In the case of the latter, follow the manufacturer's recommendation for the type of fluid to be used in the transmission. Mobil 1 Racing 4T 10W-40 and Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 engine oils are designed to help provide the proper frictional characteristics necessary for wet-clutch common engine/transmission systems."

The price is the same if you buy a gallon jug at the dealer so that is not a big deal, I'm just thinking of an alternative if you get stuck in BFE. Is this a usable alternate in a pinch? Those with newer bikes, what are the oil recommendations?

[lousd1]

I have been using Amsoil and have been very happy with it. Runs smoother, shifts better and no foaming like I noticed on the BRP oil.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Highwayman2013]

Amsoil 10w40 Metric Motorcycle oil. Bajaron sells it.http://www.spyderlovers.com/forums/s...rs-amp-Helmets

[lousd1]

That is exactly what I use and who I get it from. They sell it at an auto parts store near me but it is $3-4 per quart more.

My buddy works for a company that specializes in automotive chemicals and he informed me that in industry testing, Amsoil always tests in the top few spots.

Sent from my SM-G900V using Tapatalk

[Stumpy6Guns]

I've used Amsoil exclusively since 1986. The first thing I do with any newly acquired vehicle is to change out any fluids for which Amsoil has a recommended product. I just ordered a couple hundred dollars worth of stuff, including oil for my 2012 RTL that I just bought.

Great products!

[Habib]

Dear NEWBIE .... .....but you aren't a good researcher....Besides Amsoil , you could use Valvoline 4T-stroke full synthetic motorcycle, I have paid as little as $6.25 per qt. at Walmart.....This oil has the second least amount of MOLY in it ( only Amsoil has less ).....Moly is BAD for WET clutches like ours..........and there are others........Mike

I never mentioned Amsoil it's highly recommended in all posts. I was speaking of alternatives to the sometimes "unobtainium" popular oils where a rider may find themself. Thanks for the info on the Valvoline. What are some others?

[Gray Ghost]

If you want to do a lot of research there is a gob of information just on this site. Run a search something like this "what oil can I use site:spyderlovers.com" on Google, ensure that you are using the "site:spyderlovers.com". I had over 6000 hits on running that query.

[Habib]

Thanks very much for the search tip Cliff. And to others for the tips on other compatible oils.

[billybovine]

From the owners manual for your 2010 RS.



As is clearly stated not to use an oil with a API service rating of SM.

From the Mobil 1 website.



Clearly states that the Mobil 1 oil carries a API service rating of SM.

[Habib]

Your data was for the 10W40. I see no reason a 20W50 could not be used especially in the summer months. Thanks everyone for your input it answers a lot of questions I had. Here is what Mobil says about their 20W50 V Twin full synthetic oil:

Features and benefits

• Superb shear stability can help resist viscosity shear down in high-performance engines and transmissions
• Exceptional thermal stability can help resist oxidation and high-temperature degradation
• Outstanding protection against wear of engine and transmission components
• Enhanced lubrication can help maintain maximum power and acceleration over the life of the engine
• Optimized wet-clutch performance
• Excellent low-temperature flow characteristics can help minimize engine wear during startup

• 20W-50 Specifications and approvals
  
  Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 meets or exceeds the requirements of:
  
  • API SJ (BRP approved)
  
  According to ExxonMobil, Mobil 1 V-Twin 20W-50 is of the following quality level:
  
  
  • API CF
  
  Technical details
  
  

  Engine/Application Type	4-Cycle
  SAE Grade	20W-50
  Service Classification	API SJ,CF (NO SM Listed)
  Density, g/ml @ 15.6°C (ASTM D4052)	0.87
  Flash Point, °C (ASTM D93),	214
  Pour Point,°C (ASTM D97)	-42
  Kinematic Viscosity, cSt @ 40°C (ASTM D445)	172.3
  Kinematic Viscosity, cSt @ 100°C (ASTM D445)	20.8
  Viscosity Index	142
  Cold Cranking, cP (ASTM D5293)	7,500 @ -15°C
  Pumping, cP (ASTM D468	14,000 @ -20°C

[Lew L]

Well---- While at Wally world I saw the Shell Rotella T full- synth oil and bought 2 gallons. I thought I had read on this site that it was a good oil for our s. BUT-- It is rated SM ( has more moly than lower grades)

So back to Wallyworld to see what they have for my RT.

Buying the wrong oil is causing:

Kaos

[billybovine]

Well---- While at Wally world I saw the Shell Rotella T full- synth oil and bought 2 gallons. I thought I had read on this site that it was a good oil for our s. BUT-- It is rated SM ( has more moly than lower grades)

So back to Wallyworld to see what they have for my RT.

Buying the wrong oil is causing:

Kaos

The 2014 RT uses the 1330 engine and does not have that warning about SM oil.

[SteveLaoyster]

Will it ever end??? Doubt it.

Just having fun!!! Hope everyone has a good weekend. Doesn't look like any riding is going to happen around here on Sunday.

[BajaRon]

Your data was for the 10W40. I see no reason a 20W50 could not be used especially in the summer months. Thanks everyone for your input it answers a lot of questions I had. Here is what Mobil says about their 20W50 V Twin full synthetic oil:

I would not recommend using Mobil 1 20w-50 in the 998 Rotax engine. You will surely slip your clutch.

A lot of confusion is generated because people say (This or that oil works perfectly in my Spyder) But you have to be careful. The 1330 has a much more forgiving clutch than does the 998 V-Twin. And there you go again with Mobil 1 and others putting 'V-Twin' on their oil. OK! My Spyder 998 is a V-Twin so it will work just fine, right? No! Not necessarily. Mobil 1 20w/50 has no JASO rating! So the clutch in your 998 will slip for sure and it won't take long at all.

Even MA rated oils can slip on the 998. This is because there is a spread value within each JASO category (as you can see below). If your oil is at the lower end of the JASO MA rating, it will likely slip in the 998.

JASO MB is the lowest rating, or most likely to slip a wet clutch. Then JASO MA1, Then JASO MA. And the best JASO rating being MA2. I highly recommend a JASO rating of MA2 for the temperamental 998 Rotax. Like I said, some JASO MA rated oils will work. But there are several great MA2 rated oils out there so why mess with a lower rated oil?

[Lew L]

But now I DON'T have the excuse to go to Wallyworld.


Kaos

[SteveLaoyster]

I would not recommend using the 20w-50 in the 998 Rotax engine. You will surely slip your clutch.

A lot of confusion is generated because people say (This or that oil works perfectly in my Spyder) But you have to be careful. The 1330 has a much more forgiving clutch than does the 998 V-Twin. And there you go again with Mobil 1 and others putting 'V-Twin' on their oil. OK! My Spyder 998 is a V-Twin so it will work just fine, right? No! Not necessarily. Mobil 1 20w/50 has no JASO rating! So the clutch in your 998 will slip for sure and it won't take long at all.

Even MA rated oils can slip on the 998. This is because there is a spread value within each JASO category (as you can see below). If your oil is at the lower end of the JASO MA rating, it will likely slip in the 998.

JASO MB is the lowest rating, or most likely to slip a wet clutch. Then JASO MA1, Then JASO MA. And the best JASO rating being MA2. I highly recommend a JASO rating of MA2 for the temperamental 998 Rotax. Like I said, some JASO MA rated oils will work. But there are several great MA2 rated oils out there so why mess with a lower rated oil?

Thank you BajaRon!! JASO rating is extremely important with wet clutches. I think some manufactures are only allowing MA2 in their machines with wet clutches.

[Habib]

I guess I just have a problem not having something that is totally required being easily obtainable. Guess it's going to be dealer oil by the case and carry a couple of quarts 'in case'. Thanks all for the responses, and the schooling.

[BajaRon]

I guess I just have a problem not having something that is totally required being easily obtainable. Guess it's going to be dealer oil by the case and carry a couple of quarts 'in case'. Thanks all for the responses, and the schooling.

All of this has been made unnecessarily confusing. Once you define the terms correctly and apply them to your particular machine (there are really only 2 when it comes to this subject, the 998 and the 1330). Then the entire exercise becomes much simpler.

The 1330 is much less demanding, as far as clutch requirements go. If you own the 998 you need to be a bit more careful. But there are several, easily obtainable, readily available lubricants for both Spyder motors. Some can be used with good results in either engine. Those are no-brainers. Others will work well only in the 1330.

So, if you own a 998 it is very important to look a bit further into a lubricant that someone says works great if they are riding a 1330 or they don't say what they are riding.

[jcthorne]

I guess I just have a problem not having something that is totally required being easily obtainable. Guess it's going to be dealer oil by the case and carry a couple of quarts 'in case'. Thanks all for the responses, and the schooling.

Mike has tried to tell you multiple times

The Valvoline Full Synthetic Motorcycle oil is FULLY rated for the 998 engines. Does not carry the SM rating and DOES carry a JASO MA2.

For the 1330 engines, the Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic also carries the JASO MA2 rating and meets all requirements for that engine.

Both of these fine quality lubricants are available at many retail outlets including most Wal Mart stores.

[Habib]

Mike has tried to tell you multiple times

The Valvoline Full Synthetic Motorcycle oil is FULLY rated for the 998 engines. Does not carry the SM rating and DOES carry a JASO MA2.

For the 1330 engines, the Shell Rotella T6 full synthetic also carries the JASO MA2 rating and meets all requirements for that engine.

Both of these fine quality lubricants are available at many retail outlets including most Wal Mart stores.

This has been noted.

[BajaRon]

..JC......I could be on His IGNORE LIST .......which is fine with me, because He's on mine now ...........Mike

Could be a variation of selective hearing. But that usually happens between married people!

[Habib]

..JC......I could be on His IGNORE LIST .......which is fine with me, because He's on mine now ...........Mike

Have I caused that much trouble already? Sorry.

[BajaRon]

Have I caused that much trouble already? Sorry.

No... Don't worry about it. You're doing fine. Some of us complain just because we can. Believe me! You'll get your turn!

[irvin48]

i love oil threads. very informative. been through many of them with the vtx and victory forums
over the years. there STILL is a lot of useful info to be gleaned amongst the jabbing
and infighting. enjoy it with popcorn and butter.

[necjcc@pyd.net]

hey thanks for the info on the other oil was going to do look up thanks again jonny c