Belt Alignment Problem & Question

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Can anyone tell me how much of a turn of the right side adjusting screw will make the belt tracking move from flange to outside, or vice versa?

The belt was running against the flange on my new RTS when I got it. I'm putting the hitch I had on my 2013 RT on my 2014 RTS. It is held on by the axle nuts. So naturally this is the time to adjust the belt alignment, right? The left side adjuster stayed pretty close to where it was. I loosened it just a bit so the belt has a tension of about 180# on the Krikit II. But I am having one hell of a time getting the right side adjuster set so the belt tracks correctly.

The first thing I discovered is when I tightened the axle nut the tracking changed so what was good with the nut snug was not with the nut tight. The belt moved to the flange. I must have loosened and tightened the axle nuts 20 times these past two evenings. First the belt rides the flange, then it wants to track off the outer edge. I finally resorted to loosening the axle nut all the way. I loosened the right adjuster full three turns and then made sure the axle was pulling it snug into the swing arm. Then I tightened it 2 7/8 turns and tightened the axle nut, and then spun the tire. The tracking finally changed after three of these rigmaroles to where it is just inside the outer edge. I want the next cycle to bring the belt to just shy of the flange. Hence my question above.

Another thing I discovered is turning the tire faster caused the belt to move to the flange. I have the side panels off so I've been using a socket speed wrench on the drive sprocket nut to turn the tire. Works good, except it's not fast enough. To turn it faster I use a 1/2" Milwaukee 28 volt cordless drill. The only problem with that is it's downright dangerous. As soon as the drill stops it locks up. So guess what happens when the drill locks up, the socket is still on the drive sprocket, and the tire is spinning. Yep, I've got bruises on my arm to show how dumb this trick is. Most of the time I've been able to pull the drill off while it's still running, so that removal is smooth. I guess I really should plug the cluster back in so I can start the Spyder and turn the tire with the engine, but then I have to deal with exhaust fumes in the garage.

I ain't winning!

[Peter Aawen]

....... I guess I really should plug the cluster back in so I can start the Spyder and turn the tire with the engine, but then I have to deal with exhaust fumes in the garage......

Probably a good thing you didn't try that anyway, not just due to the fumes, but also cos unless I'm very much mistaken, your Spyder would start throwing codes & other comments at you if you ran the back wheel without the front wheels turning at the same time!!!

Might not be such a biggie really, & I think they all go away once you do actually ride it & turn all the wheels at the same time once again; but it really doesn't do your peace of mind any good to be working on your Spyder only to have it start objecting strongly!!

As as for the belt alignment, I just kept on with it until I got it right. Lotsa little adjustments one side after another seemed to be more effective than bigger adjustments in an effort to get it right quick - and the belt does track in a completely different line when the wheel's turning forwards to where it tracks when it's turning backwards!!

So passing on what worked for me; just take your time, make lotsa small bites rather try for big changes, and set it up properly with the wheel turning in the drive direction - ignore entirely what it looks like if you spin the wheel backwards cos that'll change the apparent alignment instantly!!

Good Luck!

[r1100rider]

Can anyone tell me how much of a turn of the right side adjusting screw will make the belt tracking move from flange to outside, or vice versa?

The belt was running against the flange on my new RTS when I got it. I'm putting the hitch I had on my 2013 RT on my 2014 RTS. It is held on by the axle nuts. So naturally this is the time to adjust the belt alignment, right? The left side adjuster stayed pretty close to where it was. I loosened it just a bit so the belt has a tension of about 180# on the Krikit II. But I am having one hell of a time getting the right side adjuster set so the belt tracks correctly.

The first thing I discovered is when I tightened the axle nut the tracking changed so what was good with the nut snug was not with the nut tight. The belt moved to the flange. I must have loosened and tightened the axle nuts 20 times these past two evenings. First the belt rides the flange, then it wants to track off the outer edge. I finally resorted to loosening the axle nut all the way. I loosened the right adjuster full three turns and then made sure the axle was pulling it snug into the swing arm. Then I tightened it 2 7/8 turns and tightened the axle nut, and then spun the tire. The tracking finally changed after three of these rigmaroles to where it is just inside the outer edge. I want the next cycle to bring the belt to just shy of the flange. Hence my question above.

Another thing I discovered is turning the tire faster caused the belt to move to the flange. I have the side panels off so I've been using a socket speed wrench on the drive sprocket nut to turn the tire. Works good, except it's not fast enough. To turn it faster I use a 1/2" Milwaukee 28 volt cordless drill. The only problem with that is it's downright dangerous. As soon as the drill stops it locks up. So guess what happens when the drill locks up, the socket is still on the drive sprocket, and the tire is spinning. Yep, I've got bruises on my arm to show how dumb this trick is. Most of the time I've been able to pull the drill off while it's still running, so that removal is smooth. I guess I really should plug the cluster back in so I can start the Spyder and turn the tire with the engine, but then I have to deal with exhaust fumes in the garage.

I ain't winning!

you can get away with running the bike it will just click and shudder the abs ,it isn't a perfect set up for sure it should have a push pull set up on the adjuster in stead of just one way the problem is that when you tighten the axle bolt the twisting action makes it move right at the point it cinches down and it's one way one one side and opposite on the other so what I had to do was play with that until I figured out how much the finial twisting of the axle nut would move the adjustment then move the axle past where I wanted it the amount that it would move when it clamped down hope that made sense

[IGETAROUND]

have the bike up on jacks front wheels blocked axle bolt loose engaged first gear make your adjustments on the right axle adjuster. Then with the wheels still turning with power from the motor snug axle bolt, the wheel under power while you're tightening keeps the adjustment static and you should be able to dial in the belt to the position you desire. Yes it will throw codes which will clear when you go for a ride. Hope this helps

Al

[Highwayman2013]

Just be careful. I adjusted mine with the swingarm held up by a jackstand and spinning the wheel by hand. Yes the tracking changed when tightening the axle. I just kept trying until I got it. Very dangerous to go near the back wheel while it is spinning under power.

[Chupaca]

Also a good practice to have the bike re- aligned if it was done with a laser before the adjustments. The laser is based on the rear wheel alignment. .

[cptjam]

Stop. You are doing dangerous things!
First, turning the wheel with a drill is ok, but either buy a ratchet attachment so you don't hurt yourself, or, put a drum in the drill, and spin using friction on the tire. I just turn by hand.
Make adjustments in tiny increments on both sides. Like in a quarter turn on one side, and out a quarter turn on the other. Or even an eighth of a turn. Tiny. 3/16" lateral belt travel is ok - spin forward, ten revolutions, see belt position. Spin back, 10 revolutions. See belt. If it moved 3/16" or less, you are good.
Stuff happens when a person forgets how much power is in that spinning wheel, driven by the engine. More than enough to remove body parts!
We love you, Mac. Don't hurt yourself! Joe

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

What's so bloomin' frustrating is I aligned the belt twice on my 2013 RT and had no difficulty at all getting it done!

Tightening the axle nuts with the tire spinning under power is something I don't even want to consider doing with it on blocks and jack.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

Stop. You are doing dangerous things!
First, turning the wheel with a drill is ok, but either buy a ratchet attachment so you don't hurt yourself,

I already did! That's why I used the word dumb!

I was wondering if some sort of a ratchet adapter is available. That would just the ticket. I've been going 1/4 and 1/8 turns of the adjuster. That's why I'm getting so frustrated. I had it about 1 mm from the flange, turned the tire both ways and it stayed dead on. Then I tightened the nuts full tight, spun the tire some more, and the belt was riding the flange!

I'll get back to it after coffee, and not being tired!

[PMK]

This may sound primitive Pete, but it may help. Align the belt by whatever technique you prefer.

Myself, I set the tension via the left, then fire the motor or hand spin to get it close to aligned via the right. Recheck the tension. If the tension is good and alignment is good, I begin to tighten the axle nut just approaching snug. Then using a block or brass drift, tap the axle nut on the right side forward to ensure the adjuster remains seated. Complete the tightening and double check.

I also never turn the axle, only the right side nut.

For some crazy reason a friends bike acted all weird to get aligned and tight. So when I reset ours I decided to ensure the adjuster was staying forward and got it set in less than 5 minutes from jacking, tensioning, aligning and lowering.

[IGETAROUND]

I defer to the more learned that are on the site

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

Along with what Paul and another here said about the axel moving when you try to tighten it.....I put two washers on the right side with grease in between, this seemed to lessen the tendency for the AXEL to CREEP...Tapping the left side nut forward is also a good idea........Mike

[DrewNJ]

I did mine running and in gear as well. [emoji33] Didn't fight with it at all.
Whatever works for you...[emoji106]

Sent from my Venue 8 3830 using Tapatalk

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

I finally got the alignment accomplished. The first thing I did was quit turning the axle by the left nut, even though it was faster to remove the nut by doing so. How much it helped, if any, I don't know. I don't think it made any difference. Second I adopted Mike's idea of a second washer. In my case the hitch mount is the first washer. I put anti-seize on the washer face against the hitch plate and also on the nut. I was seeing seeing metal shavings from the nut galling some.

But I still could not get the belt to stay in place as I tightened the nut. What I finally figured out was the right end of the axle was moving rearward every time. If you think about how the adjusters are made you can see there is nothing to prevent the nut tightening process from moving the axle to the rear. All of the restraint is against forward movement only. So I got to thinking how do I keep the right end of the axle from moving rearward? What I came up with is a wood wedge between the tire and swing arm. Voila, it worked!

The photos below show the washer, the wedge, the speed wrench to turn the drive sprocket, and the final result. I have the rear trunk module off to install a CB radio and older style entertainment harness. Having everything opened up sure made it a lot easier to do the alignment battle!

[BLUEKNIGHT911]

.............It's better than on the flange, but it should only be 1 credit card not 3.....not a biggy.... ................Mike

[PMK]

No wonder the thing was giving you a fit...look at how dirty it is.

[pitzerwm]

One suggestion that I was given was to tighten only the left nut. Of course, thinking that I am bulletproof, I jacked it up blocked the front wheels and put it in first to adjust, it does change in reverse, so I ran it in both directions and quickly got it centered and locked up. I did not try to tighten the nut with the tire rotating.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

.............It's better than on the flange, but it should only be 1 credit card not 3.....not a biggy.... ................Mike

I read somewhere the spec is 1 to 5 mm, but the service manual gives it in terms of total gap of both drive and rear wheel added together, 3.25 mm +/- 2.75 mm. The best I can interpret is the belt needs to be anywhere between the flange and outer edge. The service manual states the belt can contact the flange on only one of the two sprockets.

[Trevor G]

Belt Alignment

Background - how and when to check

i) Move the bike forward one to two bike lengths or if using a jack, rotate the rear wheel forwards 3 or 4 times by hand.

Check the position of the belt.

ii) Move the bike back one to two bike lengths or if using a jack rotate the rear wheel backwards 3 or 4 times by hand.

Check the position of the belt.

In both cases it should be the same distance from the pulley flange.

Ideally, it probably should be no more than one or two mm (or 1/16") away from the pulley flange. If not, if it wanders from one side to the other, even just a little, the pulleys are not aligned correctly.

iii) Because it should be an easy thing to adjust I would always adjust it, especially before having a laser front wheel alignment.

iv) Always check belt tracking after a belt adjustment or wheel removal.



Belt Adjustment

Background - there are several things to note:

i) The adjusters only work in one direction, that is, when tightening the belt. (The adjusters are screwed clockwise when looking at the head of the allen bolt/socket head bolt to tighten the belt.)

ii) When tightening or loosening the axle nut(s) it is important to always and only turn the spanner/wrench, on either side, in the direction that will push the axle forward against the adjuster.

For example - if working on the left side (the belt side) the handle of the wrench/spanner must always be above the axle when tightening, to force the axle forward against the adjuster. When you push the handle you are also pushing forward against the adjuster, which if it was correctly positioned, will then stop the axle from moving out of its correct position.

For example - if working on the right side (the brake side) the handle of the wrench/spanner must always be below the axle when tightening, to force the axle forward against the adjuster. When you push the handle you are also pushing forward against the adjuster, which if it was correctly positioned, will then stop the axle from moving out of its correct position.

iii) If you only need to tighten the belt first make sure, before loosening the axle nut, that both adjusters are tight up against the swingarm end cover. To check, loosen slightly, then turn them back to where they were.

If they both were not tight to the same degree this suggests that the axle nut was tightened in the wrong way (see above).

When tightening the belt you do not need to fully loosen the axle nut(s) - you only need to loosen them enough (maybe 1/2 to 1 turn) to allow the adjusting bolt mechanism to pull the axle back. Don't force them, though - they should be firm to turn, but not tight. Loosen the axle nut(s) a little more if necessary.

iv) If for some reason you need to loosen the belt you must undo the adjusting nuts by at least half a turn first, then loosen the axle nut(s) by 1 to 2 turns, maybe more, then kick the tyre/wheel with the flat of your shoe or boot to push it forward against the adjusters.

Turn the adjusters by hand to see if the wheel moved forward evenly - they should both be snug against the axle (in other words, they will undo by hand but not do up or tighten, by hand).

It is most important after moving the wheel forward that either or both adjuster is/are turned (and you can feel the tension) so that they are pulling the axle back. Keep the axle nuts partly done up so that you can feel this tension more easily.



Step By Step Adjustment (after noting the things above):

1) Check belt tracking in forward and reverse directions

2) Check tightness of each axle adjuster (see above) and return them to where they were if OK - don't loosen the axle nut(s) when doing this.

3) Loosen the axle nut(s) 1 or 2 turns by positioning the tool handle either above or below the axle so that as you turn it you are always and only pushing forwards against the axle adjusting bolts.

On the left side the handle must only be above the axle to loosen,

On the right side the handle must only be below the axle to loosen.

4) Adjust the belt tension by screwing the adjusters in small amounts, sometimes even just 1/8 of a turn, at a time.

Note: If you over-tighten the belt you cannot force it back just by loosening the adjusters. You will need to back off the adjusters by half a turn or so, loosen the axle nut(s) some more, and then force the axle/wheel forward.

5) Check belt tracking and adjust by using the right/brake side adjuster, turning it by 1/8 turn at a time.

Remember that if you have to loosen either side adjuster during the alignment procedure you will also need to force the wheel/axle to move forward. Then re-tighten the axle nuts so that there is some resistance as you turn the axle adjusters.

Do not just push the wheel forward to the correct position, push it past and then draw it back using the adjusters - it is MOST IMPORTANT that the axle adjusters always have pulled the axle back on both sides, to ensure that the axle remains correctly positioned when tightening the axle nuts.

Remember to rotate the wheel a few turns in each direction to check tracking - don't try to rush this.

6) When you think you are finished tighten the axle nuts, always only by pushing the handle of the tool forward, to force the axle against the adjuster on each side (see explanation above).

7) Check alignment again by rotating the wheel in both directions, by wheeling or by hand. The wheel does not need to be under power to check alignment.

If alignment is out you almost certainly did not tighten by turning or pushing the axle nut tool forward against the axle. You can double check this by trying very slightly to tighten either adjuster. If one is easier to move that side came back during the tightening procedure. Try again.

I'll load photos at some stage to demonstrate axle nut adjusting.

[Firefly]

I guess I do mine the dangerous way..... jacked up and running.. usually in 2nd or 3rd gear so if something were to happen like dropping it all to the floor the engine will cut off.

I always go from lighter tension to heavy. The axle doesn't have to be that loose to make adjustments from looser to tighter.

1/4 turn at a time on each side.. get it aligned while running. Stop. Drop it to the floor and check tension. Repeat as needed until you get it as tight as you want. You can also drop into reverse and check it running backwards.

Then tighten it all down with the bike on the ground. Take it for a straight ride 20 feet , stop and check belt alignment. Then reverse.. check again.

If you have a decent jack you can do this in a reasonably safe manner. No loose clothing, long hair, etc. anywhere near the bike when doing this.

[IdahoMtnSpyder]

6) When you think you are finished tighten the axle nuts, always only by pushing the handle of the tool forward, to force the axle against the adjuster on each side (see explanation above).

That's exactly what I was doing and the axle worked its way back! It also moved when I turned the nut from snug to fairly tight to really tight! The axle simply did not want to stay in place.

[Fruckman]

The Brain trusts of our members will never stop amazing me & I appreciate the feedback very much, So my question is: what method is everybody using to set Drive belt tension? Has anybody used the app to measure in Frequency?
Yes like plucking a guitar string, Or does anybody have a chart to correlate between Frequency & tension or newton meters? thanks again. 2014 Spyder RT Limited 1330 Ace

[ButterSmooth]

The Brain trusts of our members will never stop amazing me & I appreciate the feedback very much, So my question is: what method is everybody using to set Drive belt tension? Has anybody used the app to measure in Frequency?
Yes like plucking a guitar string, Or does anybody have a chart to correlate between Frequency & tension or newton meters? thanks again. 2014 Spyder RT Limited 1330 Ace

Yes, I use the belt frequency to set the tension, and now it even corelates with the Krikit measurements. They measured quite different tensions the first few times I tried it. The phone app WILL NOT measure the belt 'twang' because the frequency range of the Spyder belt is too low in pitch for the phone's microphone. It works great for shorter/tighter/higher pitched belts. I use a Snark musical tuner and it responds to the belt pluck nicely. The frequency method is more sensitive to change and has higher resolution. They agree only when I use the Krikit at the center of the bottom span of the belt. The attached tension chart applies to the 2020RT belt dimensions.